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Old 07-06-2012, 01:34 PM   #1
scale [OP] scale is offline
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front brake costs

let me start by saying l live in MN. = Lots of snow and salt.

If got an 04 4x4 trd. My front brakes are due and it would appear my pads have worn a bit uneven on the drivers side. THe outer wore faster than the inner. From the looks of things this is because a bit of rust built up on the guide pins.

I bought OEM pads at the dealership here ($70) planning to do the job myself. No chance in hell im getting those pins out. I tried but they are just stuck.......if tried a punch etc...no go. They wont budge. I dont want to do any damage by using heat or cutting them out with a hacksaw/sawzall. My luck i would hit the boot or seals on the 4 piston caliper and be screwed.

Im at 101xxx miles. I called the dealer looking for a rough quote.

They say:

Turning the Rotors
New pins
New pads, shims, hardware kit
REbuilding the rotors

$430

OUCH.

I think the previous owner neglected the pin maintenence.

The good thing is they are going to rebuild the calipers which should get me down the road for many many more miles.

IM worried about what else they are going to stick me with cost wise once they get in there and start the job? This was just a estimate over the phone....they havent seen the truck yet.

DOnt get me wrong....the pins dont look that corroded but they are definately JAMMED and stuck in there. They are not comming out with my hands...i can tell you that much.
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Old 07-06-2012, 01:43 PM   #2
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Brakes are very easy to do yourself...

You can take the rotors to one of the major box stores and they will resurface them for around $12. If you have original rotors on there at 100K and have had uneven wear from the pads, there is a good chance that the rotors won't be able to be turned. Then you are talking maybe another $40/side for new rotors.

Pads can be around $25 per side new.

And you can buy remmaned calipers with lifetime warranties from one big box stores for around $50/side. Those new calipers will have all new hardware(pins).

Then all you would be left to do is get some brake fluid and have a friend help you bleed them.
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Old 07-06-2012, 02:29 PM   #3
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no kidding....but the fact that i cant get my pins out of the old calipers have me concerned. Ive done ALOT of brake jobs in the past with little to no hassle. This one is too much for me. THe pins wont bugde. Trust me...ive been soaking them in PB blaster for a week....still nothing.

Besides that...i have no friends......or desire to have a run a brake bleeding job. I hate doing those. My luck id snap a bleeder screw
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Old 07-06-2012, 02:44 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scale View Post
no kidding....but the fact that i cant get my pins out of the old calipers have me concerned. Ive done ALOT of brake jobs in the past with little to no hassle. This one is too much for me. THe pins wont bugde. Trust me...ive been soaking them in PB blaster for a week....still nothing.

Besides that...i have no friends......or desire to have a run a brake bleeding job. I hate doing those. My luck id snap a bleeder screw
Come on, have more confidence in yourself...!!!

You don't even have to worry about getting the pins out of the old calipers, just take them as they are if you chose to buy remanned ones.

Snap the bleeder??? no chance of that on new calipers.

Hell, I had my 6 year old son press the brake pedal for me on one bleeding job. Worked out fine. And he felt like a $million doing work on his dad's truck.
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Old 07-06-2012, 03:08 PM   #5
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I know what you mean about the pins, the first time I tried I had to drill them out, took an entire weekend just for new pads. At the time I didn't have anyplace to work on the truck and ended up paying $700 for front calipers, rotors, and pads. If yours are in the same shape mine where in I would either pay the shop or buy all new or remade calipers and replace the whole front system.
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Old 07-06-2012, 04:45 PM   #6
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So you got them loose just can't get them out right, is there anyway to polish off the rust with some emery cloth lets say a 1" wide strip,X 2ft long and sand off the rust.
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Old 07-06-2012, 04:49 PM   #7
if you have to ask, u can't afford it
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if the pads have shifted or off center, it will make the rusty pins a little more harder to pull out. im just saying. if u tried spreading apart the pads a little bit so there is some play between rotor, pad, and caliper, u may be able to shimmy it loose (maybe with a punch) ( $0.02)
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Old 07-06-2012, 05:26 PM   #8
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not loose at all. Frozen I can move the pads ....although very limited away from the rotor on the pins. The inside pad is frozen at the lower portion on the pin. Mostly the pins are frozen where they go through the calipers. Sanding is impossible. it is thick. Ive scrapped a bunch off but not enough to get htem to move yet.
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Old 07-06-2012, 05:28 PM   #9
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If you really want to keep the calipers you could try cutting the pins with a Dremel and hammering it the piece left inside.
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Old 07-06-2012, 05:48 PM   #10
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after a few hours at it today...i give up. If i cut the pins and cant remove the bits in the calipers.....i cant go anywhere Not even to the dealership to give them my life savings.

My guess is the dealership has reman calipers just sitting there........2 of those and some new pads and bam.....im out the door. THe turn around time is 3 hours from what the guy was saying. I have a hard time beliving they can to this job in 3 hours. IF the pins were free.....then sure. This price includes a caliper rebuild and new seals etc. THat to me says they are probabaly just throwing remanufactured calipers on and turning my rotors and sending me on my way.

Lesson learned though. Ill be checking my pins and lubing them around tire rotations. THe previous owner didnt. THat much is clear.

id kind of be curious to know where one can get OEM calipers, pads and pins, and all the hardware just to see what it would cost in parts to rip them clean out and replace the lot.
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Old 07-06-2012, 08:52 PM   #11
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You can do this yourself. http://www.ncttora.com/fsm/2003/Repair_Manual/03tacoma/br/fbc4wdpr/comp.pdf

Look at the picture of the caliper, there are just two big bolts and a brake line that hold the caliper on. If you disconnect your brake line, and remove those two bolts, take the whole assembly off and replace the whole thing with a rebuilt caliper. You can buy them with the shoes already in the caliper and return your dealer brake shoes for a refund. Or you can buy rebuilt calipers without the shoes, and purchase a new installation kit with new pins and install your dealer sourced brake shoes.
There is no need to mess with anything else, and if someone can help you bleed the brakes you will be done and it should cost half of what the dealer wants to do.
If you don't want to do the work, then go to the dealer. Good Luck.
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Old 07-07-2012, 06:30 AM   #12
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the line bolts are rusted as well. I have not tried to remove them but i have to imagine they are about the same. Minnesota winters are brutal. If i lived anywhere else im betting this would be simple. Looks like a single resevior for the entire system as well which would mean i would need to bleed the rears.........which would probably lead to broken bleeders. Curious to know what you would recommend for replacment calipers.

Looks like rock auto has the raybestos professional grade loaded calipers. I can get a set of them for just under $200 shipped. They list 2 size of bleeder screws (a m7x1 and a m10x1) Does anyone know which i would need? I suppose it wouldnt matter if it is just the bleeder.

They also list brands of loaded kits from cardone, centric and beck/arnley. Not sure which is the best. They have to all be pretty close to the same.
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:02 AM   #13
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Nothing is as easy as we'd like it to be

Quote:
Originally Posted by scale View Post
the line bolts are rusted as well. I have not tried to remove them but i have to imagine they are about the same. Minnesota winters are brutal. If i lived anywhere else im betting this would be simple. Looks like a single resevior for the entire system as well which would mean i would need to bleed the rears.........which would probably lead to broken bleeders. Curious to know what you would recommend for replacment calipers.
I did a rear brake job on my Accord a couple nights ago. Took about 3 hours with oddly enough, an inordinate amount of time removing two machine head screws that to my knowledge, serve no purpose other than to hold things in place during line manufacturing. I replaced the rotar and pads and parts cost me $338 at the dealer (I prefer OEM replacements). The caliper pins and caliper mounting bolts were pretty corroded, perhaps not like a MN bolt after 108K miles, but pretty cruddy! I soaked them with WD-40 for a day or so before attempting the job. I think it helped.

I also rapped the old rotars with a hammer several times knocking off a bunch of rust. When removing the machine head screws, the impact wrench only bent the phillips tip and didn't budge the screws and started to distort the screw head. With a tip and vicegrips, I hammered the tip into the screw and was able to finally turn out the machine screws. They were corroded at the tip only. My theory is that with the hammering, I was able to break the frozen tip away from the mating surface. Wish I saw this thread earlier to through you that tip. But, I was able to get the job done!

At this point, you might try drilling and tapping the tips with a reverse thread and turn in a reverse threaded bolt. Add plenty of WD-40/blaster and let soak before attempting to remove the tips. Depending on your situation, you could try to carefully step up the drill size and drill the tip out (chisel), but I'd be afraid of taking an angle where you bugger up the mating threads.

Tough spot to be in, but we've all been there at one time or another. I snapped off the top bolt on the front shock and had to get creative. The job took longer, but it got done and in the process, built some confidence as another member noted. Good luck with your mini-project!
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:06 AM   #14
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Note: take a look at where to apply lubricant and what type to use. This is a key step.
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:15 AM   #15
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I am in Chicago, so I understand EXACTLY what you are saying about rust and corrosion.

Certainly RockAuto is probably the cheapest place to go...if you are in no hurry.

But, I have used the remmaned calipers from both O'reily's and more recently AutoZone. Bought a pair of unloaded calipers from AutoZone WITH lifetime warranty, so if those pins ever get stuck again, and they will...I just bring them back and get a new set. You can try to maintain those pins all you want, in these winters with the heating and cooling of brakes...you'd be chasing your tail.

If you are worried about breaking off the banjo bolt for your brake line...the new calipers come with new ones of those.

Face it, if you know what you are doing, easier for you to discover this stuff yourself. With it at the dealership, they discover it, that estimate keeps growing!
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:47 AM   #16
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had same problem that you had didnt think they would come out but tokk pb blaster and sprayed on let sit then took a hammer and wacked it on both sides got them moving a hair each way sprayed more moved a little more then took punch and they knocked out enough to get visegrips on them to rotate and hammer on the visegrips. Then it took a sledge hammer to pound the rotors off.
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Old 07-07-2012, 11:32 AM   #17
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brake cleaner, sand cloth, pull the clip that holds them in place. Or just pay the $430, that actually sounds cheap. Better yet, buy your own parts from Camelback, and let them charge you labor.
I bought rotors and pads from Camelback, and I would say it was around $225. Figure their labor and tax, that makes sense.
Then add the pins, backer plate, clips etc, so $300 just in parts, on the front.
Have them use anti-seize on those pins, so next time they are rust free and slide out.
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Old 07-07-2012, 12:34 PM   #18
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yeah im hoping that quote doesnt just keep growing. Hell......it was only a phone quote so who knows what it will be in the end. @430 im not horribly pissed considering...the caliper seals will get replaced and cleaned up. That also includes turning the rotors (although im not sure they need it).

You would think the dealership would find it more cost effectitve just ot replace rotors rather than turn them. Same with calipers. rebuilding those is labor intensive.....well more so then bleeding new calipers. I guess that is where they get you. Labor costs more than parts so....bam......more money for the dealer.
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Old 07-07-2012, 01:08 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scale View Post
after a few hours at it today...i give up. If i cut the pins and cant remove the bits in the calipers.....i cant go anywhere Not even to the dealership to give them my life savings.

My guess is the dealership has reman calipers just sitting there........2 of those and some new pads and bam.....im out the door. THe turn around time is 3 hours from what the guy was saying. I have a hard time beliving they can to this job in 3 hours. IF the pins were free.....then sure. This price includes a caliper rebuild and new seals etc. THat to me says they are probabaly just throwing remanufactured calipers on and turning my rotors and sending me on my way.

Lesson learned though. Ill be checking my pins and lubing them around tire rotations. THe previous owner didnt. THat much is clear.

id kind of be curious to know where one can get OEM calipers, pads and pins, and all the hardware just to see what it would cost in parts to rip them clean out and replace the lot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scale View Post
yeah im hoping that quote doesnt just keep growing. Hell......it was only a phone quote so who knows what it will be in the end. @430 im not horribly pissed considering...the caliper seals will get replaced and cleaned up. That also includes turning the rotors (although im not sure they need it).

You would think the dealership would find it more cost effectitve just ot replace rotors rather than turn them. Same with calipers. rebuilding those is labor intensive.....well more so then bleeding new calipers. I guess that is where they get you. Labor costs more than parts so....bam......more money for the dealer.

OMG thats quite a bit of change, too bad your not closer, I could save you some cash!

FYI I NEVER turn rotors, once turned they are thinner and will warp easier the 2nd time (trust me). Your way better off just replacing the rotors from the getgo, then get a pair of loaded calipers, and some brake fluid and go to town, should seriously take you less than 3 hours, I can do that whole job in less than 1 hour.
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Old 07-07-2012, 01:21 PM   #20
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i agree on the rotot turning.....

what do you all recommend for replacment rotors / loaded calipers? I know most guys like to stick with OEM on their trucks but that cost gets huge fast unless there is a spot to buy the stuff other than the dealer
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