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Old 09-15-2013, 09:04 AM   #141
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Yep, like I said in post 53 (yep, some chest pounding going on), from my tuning experiences, the OE ECU is a closed loop whore.

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You have any internal work (ie forged crank and pistons)?
Nope, cause

Quote:
Internals are pretty strong in the 5vz
I've seen a tuning philosophy on these boards that I've never seen on other boards because these engines (both 4cyl and 6) are so stout. Lots of non-EMS, tuning by audible ping, "yeah I know I should get EMS buuuut" threads cause these engines can take some bad tuning.

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Im cautious about getting this kit as I don't think the stock engine can handle the turbo's full potential.
Then the buying of turbo kits should go down a good 95%, as many do not have engines that can support what their turbo setup can support. Simply use the right wastegate/boost controller settings, and make the boost that is right for your engine/fuel-timing management. Often the boost bug bites, and things mature from there.
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Old 09-15-2013, 12:00 PM   #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackdawg View Post
nah man. We have stout internals. of course probably not the FULL potential of the turbo..but that would probably be over 500hp..

with just 10psi from the turbo that comes with it you'd be around 350-425rwhp id bet. PLENTY haha
I heard the cast crank is pretty weak though... Whats the stock compression?
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Old 09-15-2013, 03:53 PM   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StAndrew View Post
I heard the cast crank is pretty weak though... Whats the stock compression?
nothing super high. 9.6:1

Like Blacksport said, you just need to tune to a certain level. You'll never have a motor that'll totally keep up with a turbo setup. A turbo almost always has more potential then the motor does.

Id push 10psi out of the Cx kit with good tuning. But thats about it without doing something to the heads( a MHG for instance).

As long as you don't get the boost bug..which is very hard to resist..you'll be fine.

Our motors are well built but yes, its not a feaking race car motor. But they can take plenty of pushing if you deliver the fuel to it and watch the AFRs.
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Old 09-15-2013, 04:09 PM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StAndrew View Post
I heard the cast crank is pretty weak though... Whats the stock compression?
I've heard the opposite about the 5vz crank. That even though it is cast, it's very strong. That was from the owner of sea2sky tuning. Even though they went belly up, he was like the 5vz tuning expert for a while. I might have also heard that from Gadget over at URD, but i don't want to put words in anyones mouth.

I've also read that the Japanese spec 5vz had a forged crank, and the japanese spec crank can be found if you shop around. But that could be hearsay...
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Old 09-15-2013, 05:50 PM   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x2468 View Post
I've heard the opposite about the 5vz crank. That even though it is cast, it's very strong. That was from the owner of sea2sky tuning. Even though they went belly up, he was like the 5vz tuning expert for a while. I might have also heard that from Gadget over at URD, but i don't want to put words in anyones mouth.

I've also read that the Japanese spec 5vz had a forged crank, and the japanese spec crank can be found if you shop around. But that could be hearsay...
I know the 3VZ has the same crank but forged and is a popular swap... Ive been entertaining the TRD SC but this kit may change my mind. Sub'ing my first thread ever.
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Old 09-18-2013, 02:17 PM   #146
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Sorry guys, but I really do not see a window opening up where I have the time to make my garage queen a daily, and take the truck (daily) out of the daily duty and under the knife.
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Old 09-19-2013, 01:13 PM   #148
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^^ No such thing as a free lunch lol.

I have non-stop work for two weeks but can get my garage queen to daily status in a short time... considering actually finding a place that could install the kit fast to get this show on the road.
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Old 09-23-2013, 05:37 PM   #150
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You should make a build page over at Customtacos BlackSportD
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Old 09-24-2013, 02:38 PM   #151
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I don't think I'll make a page, but I popped in on the turbo thread.
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Old 09-24-2013, 03:24 PM   #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackSportD View Post
I don't think I'll make a page, but I popped in on the turbo thread.
Just make a Page on TW
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Old 09-24-2013, 05:10 PM   #153
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Just make a Page on TW
That, I've done already haha.
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Old 09-26-2013, 01:20 AM   #154
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This made me laugh
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Turbo Kit-5vzturbomeme.jpg  
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Old 09-26-2013, 10:32 AM   #155
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Hey BlackSport or Blackdawg i was looking at this for fuel management at low boost say 4-6psi or so: http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/page.php?id=30031 with a 255 walbro you think that would be maxing my injectors out? This would just be used until i got a proper system like the URD port fuelers and a Piggy back. I figured at 4-6psu this would help keep our engine from leaning out while under boost. just looking for your 2 cents.
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Old 09-26-2013, 10:42 AM   #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackdawg View Post
i don't love those things..not very accurate. But they do work in a sense. You could get away with it for a while i think as long as you did upgrade to something more tune able down the road.
what size would be used for our stock injectors? i heard somewhere that the 7:1 but am not completely sure. i guess really i would have to try it and see how well it worked. So have you personally had experience with them?
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Old 09-26-2013, 11:06 AM   #158
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Ahh the FMU. A cheap way to get a system to fuel for boost that doesn't employ closed loop, or at least in the regions where there is boost.

People, seriously, google OBDII closed loop.

The FMU would ONLY WORK if your OBDII system wanted to run the righ air fuel to begin with, but didn't have the muscle to do it (ie: injector duty cycles at 100%, maxed out fuel pump etc). If it did have the muscle, but not the tune, but yet the "right" closed loop target values, then closed loop would actually work in your favour and tune out the lean map values and correct it into boost friendly ratios. But none of that is the case, the OE ECU has it's closed loop targets, and they are not low gear/boost friendly-- just ask any S/C owner. The FMU will crank up the fuel pressure, the ratios will become more boost friendly for a second or two, and then the OE ECU (where a second or two is like two minutes for us) snaps that back to reality, bitch slaps it back to stoich to appease the great God it worships known as CARB. On lots of OBDII cars the FMU trick actually works because their laggy turbo setup and OE ECU coincidentally do not cross paths in closed loop territory, so the FMU helps the OE ECU while in open loop to enrich even further when in boost. But our OE ECU seems to be adversly closed loop biased- wish I had a link to a recent thread that went into more detail on this, as its not just my opinion. Winding down the rant, if for some reason our OE ECU played nice with this turbo kit's spool, I'd go emanage ultimate- its the best piggyback ever fricken made to date, IMO its only achilles tendon is that they did NOT impliment an o2 feedback circuit like the URD/Split seconds and AEM FICs. They (Greddy) did later make an additional box that connected with the EMU to do that, but the size and cost was over the top and it was discontinued very quickly. IMO if the EMU had the o2 settings like the AEM FIC has, it would be king fricken kong of piggybacks.

Anywho saw your post when I wanted to swing by and post the wiki twin-charged URL as I had been getting my terminology mixed up- its a good read.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twincharger

Plans might have changed slightly, came up on an OE intake manifold, may spend the $14 on a belt and go OE intake for the turbo install, then slap the blower back on later to do in-series twin-charging where the S/C gets taken offline when the turbo comes up (on other forums this would require a dissertation as to how I plan on doing this or otherwise invoke forum nazi scrutiny, like how its not necessary here). All for the sake of science (butt dyno reviews of the various setups and the tuning pitfalls).

Again, EMS is: AEM FIC with TS PNP harness that addresses o2 and cam/crank AEM issues. If I want to go big stud status, MS3Pro, again made PNP (bias resistors set to use OE sensors, controls OE IACV etc). IMO no need to go MS3Pro unless I build the motor to handle lots more power.

Finding a lack of info on what the OE 5vz is good for, so aiming for around 350hp/tq, so thinking around 12-13psi on the turbo (12psi on the turbo will be denser than 12psi from the S/C, and will lack the ~30hp the S/C robs from the crank).
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Old 09-26-2013, 11:30 AM   #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackSportD View Post
Ahh the FMU. A cheap way to get a system to fuel for boost that doesn't employ closed loop, or at least in the regions where there is boost.

People, seriously, google OBDII closed loop.

The FMU would ONLY WORK if your OBDII system wanted to run the righ air fuel to begin with, but didn't have the muscle to do it (ie: injector duty cycles at 100%, maxed out fuel pump etc). If it did have the muscle, but not the tune, but yet the "right" closed loop target values, then closed loop would actually work in your favour and tune out the lean map values and correct it into boost friendly ratios. But none of that is the case, the OE ECU has it's closed loop targets, and they are not low gear/boost friendly-- just ask any S/C owner. The FMU will crank up the fuel pressure, the ratios will become more boost friendly for a second or two, and then the OE ECU (where a second or two is like two minutes for us) snaps that back to reality, bitch slaps it back to stoich to appease the great God it worships known as CARB. On lots of OBDII cars the FMU trick actually works because their laggy turbo setup and OE ECU coincidentally do not cross paths in closed loop territory, so the FMU helps the OE ECU while in open loop to enrich even further when in boost. But our OE ECU seems to be adversly closed loop biased- wish I had a link to a recent thread that went into more detail on this, as its not just my opinion. Winding down the rant, if for some reason our OE ECU played nice with this turbo kit's spool, I'd go emanage ultimate- its the best piggyback ever fricken made to date, IMO its only achilles tendon is that they did NOT impliment an o2 feedback circuit like the URD/Split seconds and AEM FICs. They (Greddy) did later make an additional box that connected with the EMU to do that, but the size and cost was over the top and it was discontinued very quickly. IMO if the EMU had the o2 settings like the AEM FIC has, it would be king fricken kong of piggybacks.

Anywho saw your post when I wanted to swing by and post the wiki twin-charged URL as I had been getting my terminology mixed up- its a good read.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twincharger

Plans might have changed slightly, came up on an OE intake manifold, may spend the $14 on a belt and go OE intake for the turbo install, then slap the blower back on later to do in-series twin-charging where the S/C gets taken offline when the turbo comes up (on other forums this would require a dissertation as to how I plan on doing this or otherwise invoke forum nazi scrutiny, like how its not necessary here). All for the sake of science (butt dyno reviews of the various setups and the tuning pitfalls).

Again, EMS is: AEM FIC with TS PNP harness that addresses o2 and cam/crank AEM issues. If I want to go big stud status, MS3Pro, again made PNP (bias resistors set to use OE sensors, controls OE IACV etc). IMO no need to go MS3Pro unless I build the motor to handle lots more power.

Finding a lack of info on what the OE 5vz is good for, so aiming for around 350hp/tq, so thinking around 12-13psi on the turbo (12psi on the turbo will be denser than 12psi from the S/C, and will lack the ~30hp the S/C robs from the crank).

Yea its too bad our stock ECU is such a bag of shit anyways im not saying your wrong or anything but ive seen and read alot of the STS turbo guys running them and it with me living at above 5k feet it might help lower AFR's. Im not running this kit to race kids on the freeway i just want some more power for the mountains up here either way its worth a try for me might see if it does "anything" at all on a low boosted system. I would be getting a whole array of mods to support it after i install the turbo like the AEM FIC and Port fueler then really trun the boost up on the steep inclines. And im pretty sure our trucks would be able to handle this turbo kit at lets say 4psi with no fuel mods here in denver without hurting anything. again just speculation and thank you for putting me in my place when i find new shit on the internet .

On another note i followed your postings on custom tacos and it seems like a downhill battle there when ever trying something new.
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Old 09-26-2013, 12:09 PM   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trdtoy View Post
Yep..... Do not have a printout though..... It made 420+whp and 500+wtq at 16psi on 93 octane pump. Time mentioned was ran in 4wd spinning on street tires no locker ect. Stock truck made 140whp and 170wtq and ran high 10's in the 1/8 mile...

Internals are pretty strong in the 5vz. Just keep timing in check and afr in the 11-12:1 range. Also be sure you have a way to tune open and closed loop for best results. Mine would not go open loop until 3.5-4k rpm so if I could only tune open loop it only made good power from this point to 5700 rpm limiter. Tune closed loop from idle to 3.5-4k rpm really helps the power curves waking things up a bit including the turbo response. Plus your motor will not like running 14.7:1 afr in closed loop with boost. You will have to pull timing in this area for it to live robbing power at the same time.
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