Need advice about leasing

[Ridgerunner]

Originally Posted by TheMaster

Finally, I agree with you on the equity point. Leasing is not for everybody. I would consider a lease since I tend to abuse (work them to the max) my vehicles. So, I replace my vehicle often.

OH so YOU are a dishrag guy

[TheMaster]

Originally Posted by chris4x4

Then wouldnt you be responsible for any damage and/or exessive wear?

Only if it is visual. I tow crazy loads very often. For example, I went to a quarry 2 Saturdays ago with my 18' trailer. Told the dude I wanted no more than 6,200 pounds of river rock. He said no problem and dumped half a bucket full from his loader. When I tried to move, my wheels were spinning but my truck wouldn't move. Put on 4LO and drove half a mile to the scales. The idiot had put 14,700 pounds of river rock on my trailer. Went back and they hardly managed to remove 4,700 pounds of rock since the loader bucket was too big to scoop out of my trailer. So I hauled 10,000 pounds for almost 70 miles on hilly terrain. This is my story almost every month since I do building and landscaping where I have to transport rocks. There are days my loads are so heavy, I cannot shift higher than 3rd gear. If you read my posts over the last 2 years you know I'm not making this up. Due to such abuse, I try to replace my ride by 60,000 miles.

[chris4x4]

Originally Posted by TheMaster

Only if it is visual. I tow crazy loads very often. For example, I went to a quarry 2 Saturdays ago with my 18' trailer. Told the dude I wanted no more than 6,200 pounds of river rock. He said no problem and dumped half a bucket full from his loader. When I tried to move, my wheels were spinning but my truck wouldn't move. Put on 4LO and drove half a mile to the scales. The idiot had put 14,700 pounds of river rock on my trailer. Went back and they hardly managed to remove 4,700 pounds of rock since the loader bucket was too big to scoop out of my trailer. So I hauled 10,000 pounds for almost 70 miles on hilly terrain. This is my story almost every month since I do building and landscaping where I have to transport rocks. There are days my loads are so heavy, I cannot shift higher than 3rd gear. If you read my posts over the last 2 years you know I'm not making this up. Due to such abuse, I try to replace my ride by 60,000 miles.

I fully understand.

[TheMaster]

Originally Posted by chris4x4

I fully understand.

Something else I discovered. I went off roading a few weeks ago on hilly terrain and when going down hill, I would switch to neutral to coast down so as to save some gas. Doing so multiple times, while going down hill my little son said, dad the gear was in reverse while going down hill. I said quiet silly boy, it is not possible. But then, I had the balls to try in on the next down hill. Holy sh!t, the lever goes into reverse while the truck is moving forward. No funny noise or grinding gears. Non of that stuff. Only the lever goes into reverse but the trucks moves forward. I was doing 20 MPH. I did it about 5 times just to confirm this is true fully knowing I might have to pay for a new gear box. But all is well. Its one wild Tacoma.

[chris4x4]

Originally Posted by TheMaster

Something else I discovered. I went off roading a few weeks ago on hilly terrain and when going down hill, I would switch to neutral to coast down so as to save some gas. Doing so multiple times, while going down hill my little son said, dad the gear was in reverse while going down hill. I said quiet silly boy, it is not possible. But then, I had the balls to try in on the next down hill. Holy sh!t, the lever goes into reverse while the truck is moving forward. No funny noise or grinding gears. Non of that stuff. Only the lever goes into reverse but the trucks moves forward. I was doing 20 MPH. I did it about 5 times just to confirm this is true fully knowing I might have to pay for a new gear box. But all is well. Its one wild Tacoma.

I would never buy a truck from you! Are you auto or stick? FWIW, I was driveing an RX-7 one time and I was playing with my girlfriend at the time, and she went to hit me and hit the shifter into reverse. It was an auto. There was a loud "BANG" and the engine died. It blew the tranny off the engine, and broke the rear end. No warranty.

[Toyhauler]

Great feedback and so many great opinions.

I have been thinking a lot as well whether I should lease or buy and I keep coming up with this:

Yes, mileage is another one of my consideration. Luckily my work as well as my play (sort of speak) are usually around the area. With the cars that I have previously owned, I don't believe I have ever gone over 10K a year. In fact my previous car, I only put 7K a year haha.

Here is what I figured. I can possibly sell my current car for $23K (fortunately paid off) or maybe a little more.

With that being said, I believe due at signing for a tacoma is $2k with a $259/month lease for 36 months. To make things easier, lets say I don't hassle and just do that deal. At the end of the deal, I'll have spent about $12K. Which will leave me an additional $11K in the bank which can possibly go to another investment. After the 3 years, I would get another car and based on my trend, that is what would happen even if I bought the car. Or in the event that I just happen to fall in love with the car, I can just buy it out.

Does that make sense at all? Am I missing any points? There is one point of the lease that I do not understand, that would be the residual. After I negotiate an OTD price, and switch to a lease what are they going to counter with? Saying that its not possible to do a lease at that price?

Just trying to get all my ducks in a row before I got out there to the wolves aka car salesman haha.

[TheMaster]

Originally Posted by chris4x4

I would never buy a truck from you!

I wouldn't blame you and neither would I sell it to anybody I know. Mine is an automatic. I love the truck but I have to use it. Its a truck at the end of the day and a Toyota. I call it, return on investment.

[Toyhauler]

How do you guys feel about the $259/ month for 36 months on a 08 pre-runner trd sport package? Due at signing is 2K. Is it a good deal or is there still room to haggle.

BTW, I'm in SoCal and this promotion ends at the end of the month.

[tacomaman06]

Originally Posted by Toyhauler

How do you guys feel about the $259/ month for 36 months on a 08 pre-runner trd sport package? Due at signing is 2K. Is it a good deal or is there still room to haggle.

BTW, I'm in SoCal and this promotion ends at the end of the month.

you still have some haggle room, but thats pretty good,imo.

[mws4ua]

Originally Posted by Toyhauler

Here is what I figured. I can possibly sell my current car for $23K (fortunately paid off) or maybe a little more.

How certain are you that you could get $23k for your car? Did you ever find the purchase price of the Tacoma? (I read over the thread briefly, but I could have missed it.)

Originally Posted by Toyhauler

With that being said, I believe due at signing for a tacoma is $2k with a $259/month lease for 36 months. To make things easier, lets say I don't hassle and just do that deal. At the end of the deal, I'll have spent about $12K. Which will leave me an additional $11K in the bank which can possibly go to another investment. After the 3 years, I would get another car and based on my trend, that is what would happen even if I bought the car. Or in the event that I just happen to fall in love with the car, I can just buy it out.

As I said, I don't know the OTD price, so I'll say it's $25k. If you sell your car for $23k and add the $2k you were going to put down to make up the difference, you have the truck free and clear. No monthly payments, no chance of reposession if you fall on hard times, etc. Now you can take that $259/month and put it into even a high interest savings account (just $3% - current return in ING Savings account) and have $9,768 after 36 months.

Even if the OTD price is more, you could finance a few thousand and have it paid off very quickly (unless you have a little more money set aside).

Originally Posted by Toyhauler

Does that make sense at all? Am I missing any points? There is one point of the lease that I do not understand, that would be the residual. After I negotiate an OTD price, and switch to a lease what are they going to counter with? Saying that its not possible to do a lease at that price?

I'm anti-leasing, so I don't do it... SO, I don't know the answer to this question. Knowing the concept of a lease, though, if you decide to buy the truck at the end, you WILL end up paying more for it in total because the lease will be calculated based on an interest rate. You'll be paying for the truck, plus the interest. I would make them tell you exactly what the lease-end buyout would be so that you can see for yourself.


Bottom line for me: If I had $23k in hand from the sale of a paid-off car, there's no way I would lease the next car. My actual scenerio: I had $14k in hand from a paid off car, had saved up 6k in cash, and financed a few thousand. The truck was paid off in 2 months, and it feels GREAT!

[Rtrn2taco]

A residuel will vary among different lease companies and can be manipulated to make your payment lower. the purchase price of the vehicle has no bearing on the residuel, the lease company buys the truck from the dealer. the residuel is what the company thinks the truck will be worth at lease end. if the vehicle ends up being worth less then there "educated guess" you win, because you had paid less then the depreciated value. if the vehicle is worth more than the "educated guess" you can buy the vehicle for the residuel and wind up with positive equity. I have leased several vehicles in the past and always looked at it as getting more vehicle for less monthly payment as I always had gotten a new vehicle every so many years.

I think all that makes sense?

[Toyhauler]

Originally Posted by Rtrn2taco

A residuel will vary among different lease companies and can be manipulated to make your payment lower. the purchase price of the vehicle has no bearing on the residuel, the lease company buys the truck from the dealer. the residuel is what the company thinks the truck will be worth at lease end. if the vehicle ends up being worth less then there "educated guess" you win, because you had paid less then the depreciated value. if the vehicle is worth more than the "educated guess" you can buy the vehicle for the residuel and wind up with positive equity. I have leased several vehicles in the past and always looked at it as getting more vehicle for less monthly payment as I always had gotten a new vehicle every so many years.

I think all that makes sense?

Is the residual value something that I can negotiate?

MWS: I have always thought that way as well, "why the hell do I want to rent something when I can easily own it". This thinking process does not work for me as I have seen my trend through the last several years, I have been purchasing cars and selling it within 2 years time. Basically, I eat the depreciation for the next buyer.
No matter how hard I push myself to try and keep the car, I'm so used to finding a reason to sell it. Am I a baller? No, actually far from it, but I have learned to save which is what allows me this pleasure of a new car every other year.
But yes, I used to feel exactly as you did (honestly, still do, but can not find a good reason to buy it again and know that I am going to sell in 2 years or so).
I am pretty sure I can get $23K for my car, actually that is a low estimate. So the difference that I would "save" I can put that in a savings account or some other investment.

[Toyhauler]

Ok so I spoke to a friend at a toyota dealership and here is what he can do:

Tacoma Pre-Runner Sport Access Cab V6

Cap cost would be $22166.xx
Out of pocket: $539.xx
12K/year
36 month lease
Payment: $285.xx

What do you guys think? Keep in mind I'm in SoCal.

[HardCase]

My only experience with a lease was back in the early 90s and involved a Toyota Previa van (which my daughter still drives, a real beater now but still runs good). I can't remember the numbers but do recall that it had a sort of gauranteed residual value whereby I could purchase it for that price at my option at the end of the lease. I did when the time came because the residual value was several thousand below the Blue Book value of the car at that time, so it worked out to be a good deal for me.

One thing I'll say, though, is that I was always fretting a bit about not wanting to put too many miles on it, they clobber you if you do, and also I didn't feel like I could do much in the way of mods as I feared they'd nail me for that as well. Owning is better IMHO, but it still turned out okay and wasn't a bad experience by any means.