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Rear wheels lock up when i make sharp turns in H4

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Old 11-07-2012, 04:54 PM   #41
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OK, I just learned about the lack of central differential and Drivetrain Binding. So basically, what I experienced is "as desgined" and I should be switching back to L2 when I have to make sharp turns, right? ...well unless I know for sure that the surface is slippery enough that the tires WILL slip. So i guess in my case, even though i was driving on snow, the tires were not slipping. Did i get this right?
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Old 11-07-2012, 04:56 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rokedawg View Post
So i was trying to make a right turn onto my street in h4. It's snowing quite bit so deffinitely is not "sticky pavement" as many previous posters seemed to reiterate. And my tires locked. Same thing happened as i tried to turn onto my driveway (covered in snow once again). So you all are saying this is normal? Or did i miss something in this thread?
This is the first time i used the H4 so it kind of freaked me out...
define locked up? Like just for a second or for quite a while?

4wd basically locks one front tire and one rear tire together so they have to rotate at the same speed. Well when you turn the front end follows a different path than the rear and since the tires are locked together one must travel faster than it should or slower to compensate thus causing the slipping.

If it was just for a second (or for the duration of the turn) then it was likely normal and is nothing to worry about.
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Old 11-07-2012, 04:59 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rokedawg View Post
OK, I just learned about the lack of central differential and Drivetrain Binding. So basically, what I experienced is "as desgined" and I should be switching back to L2 when I have to make sharp turns, right? ...well unless I know for sure that the surface is slippery enough that the tires WILL slip. So i guess in my case, even though i was driving on snow, the tires were not slipping. Did i get this right?
Yep. One thing I will mention is 4wd only helps you take off from a stop on snow covered roads. If you are using 4wd while driving around it is actually more likely to cause you to lose control because the tires have to slip here and there to maintain the same rate of rotation. So you will be periodically losing traction that you wouldn't normally lose while in 2wd.
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Old 11-07-2012, 05:16 PM   #44
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Thanks Brady. Yeah, the more I read on this subject the more I think it was the binding. Just wondering though, how much angle I can get away with turning in H4 without putting undue stress on the system? Theoretically, any angle will cause the axles to turn at different speed so I shouldn't make ANY turns in H4 if the tires are gripping right? I ask because there is this steep hill with a bend that I have to go down coming home from my son's day care. If it is snowing, I want to be sure that I don't lose traction.
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Old 11-07-2012, 05:26 PM   #45
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Never mind my last question. I basically answered it myself inside the question.
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Old 11-07-2012, 05:28 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rokedawg View Post
Thanks Brady. Yeah, the more I read on this subject the more I think it was the binding. Just wondering though, how much angle I can get away with turning in H4 without putting undue stress on the system? Theoretically, any angle will cause the axles to turn at different speed so I shouldn't make ANY turns in H4 if the tires are gripping right? I ask because there is this steep hill with a bend that I have to go down coming home from my son's day care. If it is snowing, I want to be sure that I don't lose traction.
I would just flat out say that if your tires are gripping don't be in 4Hi or be going less than 5mph at least.

As long as your tires can safely slip (like in gravel for example) you are probably good up to like 75% of full lock. Basically just don't go to full lock in 4wd. If you start binding before full lock then I would try to avoid steering that far next time. I don't have any specific numbers, especially since it probably varies every time anyway, sometimes your tires grip the snow, sometimes they don't.
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Old 11-07-2012, 05:30 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rokedawg View Post
Thanks Brady. Yeah, the more I read on this subject the more I think it was the binding. Just wondering though, how much angle I can get away with turning in H4 without putting undue stress on the system? Theoretically, any angle will cause the axles to turn at different speed so I shouldn't make ANY turns in H4 if the tires are gripping right? I ask because there is this steep hill with a bend that I have to go down coming home from my son's day care. If it is snowing, I want to be sure that I don't lose traction.

Best thing you can do is go out by yourself and test the limitations of what it will do. Go to a prking lot full of snow, find some hills, etc. Drive like an idiot (with no one around of course). Once you know exactly how your truck is gonna act youll be 100% more confident. Not knowing how it will act scares the SHt out of me, but once you figure it out and get used to it you'll have fun!
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Old 11-07-2012, 06:22 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jivewalker View Post
Best thing you can do is go out by yourself and test the limitations of what it will do. Go to a prking lot full of snow, find some hills, etc. Drive like an idiot (with no one around of course). Once you know exactly how your truck is gonna act youll be 100% more confident. Not knowing how it will act scares the SHt out of me, but once you figure it out and get used to it you'll have fun!
Basically, if I don't feel the wheels locking (that dragging, vibrating, locking feel) then I am still OK right?
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Old 11-07-2012, 06:24 PM   #49
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replace rear differential fluid. make sure to add friction additive.
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Old 11-07-2012, 07:39 PM   #51
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oh, boy...the 4x4abc links makes me never want to use 4x4 ever again and turned my stomach reflecting back on the the drive home i had this evening in H4. It even made me wonder if it could mess up the system so easily, why would anyone want to use 4x4? When I am driving in the winter when I won't see black ice until i hit it, it is already too late to switch to 4x4. So it seems almost useless.
But clicking thru links on howstuffworks somehow ended me up on sites with celeb boobs so I feel better now. thanks!
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Old 11-07-2012, 07:44 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rokedawg View Post
oh, boy...the 4x4abc links makes me never want to use 4x4 ever again and turned my stomach reflecting back on the the drive home i had this evening in H4. It even made me wonder if it could mess up the system so easily, why would anyone want to use 4x4? When I am driving in the winter when I won't see black ice until i hit it, it is already too late to switch to 4x4. So it seems almost useless.
But clicking thru links on howstuffworks somehow ended me up on sites with celeb boobs so I feel better now. thanks!
steep Gravel roads, mud, deep snow, Moab, etc.
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Old 11-07-2012, 07:48 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BradyT88 View Post
steep Gravel roads, mud, deep snow, Moab, etc.
well....yes of course. I knew i left myself wide open for that one as i clicked on submit...
I meant from daily practicality perspective.
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Old 11-07-2012, 07:51 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rokedawg View Post
well....yes of course. I knew i left myself wide open for that one as i clicked on submit...
I meant from daily practicality perspective.
Daily is unlikely. Maybe if you lived near the mountains on a poorly maintained road that got lots of snow every few days.
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Old 11-07-2012, 07:57 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rokedawg View Post
well....yes of course. I knew i left myself wide open for that one as i clicked on submit...
I meant from daily practicality perspective.
You must be thinking of all wheel drive.
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Old 11-07-2012, 08:05 PM   #56
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I don't understand how all wheel drive or full time 4wd help at all. If you are on a slick surface you are just going to 1 tire fire anyway aren't you (minus any diff locks of course). I mean they say under ideal traction, the power is 25% to each tire, but in reality isn't the power like just going to the tallest tire still, since all 4 tires are not going to be exactly the same size?

If it truly is 25% to each tire under ideal traction then I could see if you were on the verge of loosing traction that could keep one tire from just spinning, but I think there is still a slim chance of hitting that ideal condition very often.
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Old 11-07-2012, 08:13 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OffroadToy View Post
You must be thinking of all wheel drive.
Yeah, until now my dumb ass thought that H4 is basically an "all-wheel drive
mode".
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Old 11-07-2012, 08:20 PM   #58
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AWD doesn't mean it is one big open diff. Many systems have limited slip differentials to allow for the slippage needed for turning but lock up the diffs when the torque imbalance gets too high.

Another method is to make everything an open diff but then apply the brakes on the wheel that starts spinning too fast. This will cause some torque to applied to the opposite wheel which hopefully has traction.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four-wheel_drive
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Old 11-07-2012, 08:21 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rokedawg View Post
Yeah, until now my dumb ass thought that H4 is basically an "all-wheel drive
mode".
Don't worry too much about. Nobody seems to know much. You just put in and turn the key, put it in gear, push the gas, magic happens, and you move...

I didn't know too much about a lot of it either though until my rear diff blew up on me about a year ago.
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Old 11-07-2012, 08:23 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomtom View Post
AWD doesn't mean it is one big open diff. Many systems have limited slip differentials to allow for the slippage needed for turning but lock up the diffs when the torque imbalance gets too high.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four-wheel_drive
Bahaha!! I am tired... I completely spaced that you could just though some LSD's in there and solve all those problems. I'm use to my Taco, open/open unless I hit the lockers.
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