F@#%@#g abs almost killed me

I think it safe to say many trucks.

 

Everyone here seems to be very educated in abs with all the pros and cons but we seem to be missing the point. The point is people are having problems with their abs systems malfunctioning. Toyota and the people on here that work for Toyota seem to think that it is all operator error. I can tell you firsthand that it is not. In light snow, slowing gradually to a stop sign when at about 10-15 mph all of a sudden abs activates and removes ALMOST ALL BRAKING PRESSURE. I will type it again and this time real slow so everyone can get it. ABS REMOVED ALMOST ALL BRAKING PRESSURE. No wheels had locked up and there was no sliding. ABS activated released braking pressure and I drove right thru the stop sign into traffic. I was very lucky that there wasn't any traffic coming at the time. I am also glad that there were no school children crossing the street in front of me. This happened 4 times. Not all in the same day or week. These event set no codes in the computer. I hope that soon someone will figure out what is wrong with our trucks. Until then mine will be disabled.

 

x2

 

That is exactly what it is supposed to do that is why they are called "ANTI LOCK BRAKES" I'm sure you can find the number for NTSB online you should give them a call and they will be all over it and force a recall of every car/and truck ever made with anti-lock brakes starting with the Tacoma's. Start a position on TW get your neighbors involved then get back to me in 4 or 5 years and let me know how you made out. My Audi 90 acted precisely the same as my Tacoma and it was built over 20 years ago.

 

Just a few notes here. And I am not trying to sound insulting here at all, so please take this with a grain of salt. First, if you are in light snow, traveling at 10-15 mph approaching a stop sign, then you may be going just a tad bit fast. I have lived in snow areas, and we always reduced speed well before a stop sign. Granted I do not know the actual distance that you were from the stop sign at 10-15 MPH, but I think that is too fast. You mentioned "No wheels had locked up". Well, that IS why they call it "anti-lock" brakes. They are designed to notice wheel speed differences that indicate a wheel is approaching lockup, and regulate that wheel's pressure to PREVENT it from locking up. So yeah, ABS activation when wheels are not actually skidding is normal. Obviously there would be no codes, as the system appeared to have worked as designed. If your system had actually removed ALL brake pressure, then I would think it would have been worse. Not to mention that if all wheels indicated lockup, the abs system is designed to operate differently, and would set a diagnostic code. If you have truly had this condition happen as a result of total loss of brake pressure, my suggestion would be to take the truck in to the dealership immediately and tell them to find the problem, and fix it. Period. And I wouldn't take no for an answer. I would scream all the way up the corporate line.

That is what I say to anyone who is having a problem with the ABS. Take it in and have it checked. A test drive with a scan tool will tell you all the things that are happening when the ABS system activates. Data is the weapon needed to diagnose these problems.

I believe I had mentioned once before a customer that I had who came in with ABS activating when he was coming to a stop at a railroad track. We came to find out that he had tires that were just 50% tread, and would actually cause an erratic signal on his ABS sensors. That brings to mind another thing to consider, which could also explain how some people have ABS freaking out, and others do not. Have you checked your wheel hub bearings for wear? Have you removed the sensors and checked for small metal filings that are stuck to the magnet on the sensor? Those things can cause HUGE errors in signals, since the sensors work on a magnetic field system.

I am by far one of the last people who usually comment on this thread about driving ability. I don't know the people individually, so I have no personal knowledge of their skill. But I do feel that not everyone drives the same, and that a single vehicle will respond differently depending on the driver. Also many things like condition of the vehicle are major factors. I am actually VERY interested in this situation and am trying to compile as much info as I can. If any of you have actually removed the sensors to look at them, I would appreciate finding out what you found, and perhaps seeing a photograph. Anyone that is having abnormal operation and can take the time to simply remove all 4 of the speed sensors and photograph them for me, I would appreciate it. Also, those who do this, please list ANY and all changes from stock (Including tires) that you have made.

 

I should have known better than saying anything. YOU CAN'T ARGUE WITH IGNORANCE. Also if Tacomas are not able to drive faster than 10-15 mph in the snow shouldn't that be clearly stated in the owners manual. Sounds like lawsuit material to me.

 

Mine doesn't seem to be bump related but I could see where it's possible to have some sort of effect on the ABS system . I've had the same issue and almost always at very low speeds where traction isn't all that bad , once it happened on wet clean concrete which was really odd for sure . Haven't tried it much on gravel yet , trying to get caught up on other stuff right now .
As to those who think owners are full of shit on this , come drive mine anytime - this is a real issue .
Sarge

 

Everything you said above is exactly right and happened to me also. I even started a thread about it last year. My 50amp ABS fuse is pulled for winter time driving so I live to see another day. The Tacoma ABS system is flawed and needs redesigned.

 

I agree with you. The ABS system on the Tacoma functions somewhere in the range of poorly to detrimentally in winter conditions. My experiences with it have not been positive. I have always experienced it to be hyper-sensitive. Considering how slowly I approach intersections, there have been moments where I have wondered if my truck was determined to crash itself.
As a guy who lives where there is a long winter season, I get your point and share your concerns. Thanks for posting them

 

Ignorance huh? Wow. Sounds like you need to take a breath there sir. I have tried to be polite and informative in everything I have said. I never once indicated that a tacoma is not capable of driving faster than 10-15 MPH in the snow. What I DID say was that when approaching a STOP SIGN in the snow, that perhaps approaching it at a lower speed might be prudent. I ALSO said that I was not sure how far away you were from the stop sign at that speed. If you were say 100 feet from the stop sign at 10 MPH, then that is not that bad, but if you were 25 feet from the stop sign at 10-15 MPH in the snow, then perhaps that was a bit fast. Always read everything, not just the parts that might hurt your feelings sir.

Yeah, there are so many variables that I have seen over the years with ABS systems. They are pretty complex, and I for one would love to compile some vehicle data including vehicle specifics to see if there is some kind of commonality involved here. Obviously there are some issues with the Tacoma system. The question is, what is going on, and is it something that can be corrected by software, or vehicle components.

 

My 2c worth is that the ABS needs to be dialed back. Of the 4 vehicles I drive on the same routes day to day, only the Taco engages ABS when I don't expect it to. The other vehicles, when I feel the ABS engage, I usually already know I'm in an "oh shit" situation where I'm stopping very hard and starting to lock up. Never do they kick in any other time. But on the same routes in the Taco, I can be stopping normally and then suddenly I feel the ABS and I'm wondering why it's engaging. Typically it's where the road isn't so smooth. I also get the sensation that when it does kick in, I have a lot less stopping power vs our other vehicles. My car will chirp the tires as it "scrubs" to a stop, as I call it. The Taco doesn't have that urgency, as it rolls to a stop instead.

ABS mod, FTW.

 

Thank you for specifying which fuse you pulled. I keep reading on TW that you should only pull one fuse but opinions seem to vary on whether you should pull the 30amp or the 50amp.

I'd love to hear from a fellow 2013 owner who's pulled their 50amp successfully.

The pro-ABS folks seem particularly fervent in this thread. I don't understand the "whining and crying" comments. Saying, "My ABS sucks, what's the best way to fix this myself?" isn't whining, it's just problem-solving.

On the other hand, making numerous calls to Toyota and the NTSB or filing a law suit...well, I gotta say, that sounds a bit more like whining and crying than popping the hood and solving your own problems.

No worries though, I'm sure I only dislike ABS because I'm an idiot who can't drive.

 

Well, I think if there is an ABS problem it has to be vehicle-specific. I haven't had problems. Just now I hit this hill in the attachment as a test. 50 MPH, downhill, dirt/gravel. Slammed the brakes hard, the ABS was pumping and bumping and stopped just fine.

Would I have stopped faster with ABS disabled? MAYBE, MAYBE, but what would it have been, one foot shorter?

I've been on the stock Dunlops through a full Colorado winter, drove from PA back to Colorado the day after Christmas last year in that massive blizzard on I-70 (and you better believe I had to hit the brakes hard many times on that trip), and I haven't had any occurrences like people on this thread have stated.

13k miles on stock Dunlops and I haven't had any of those "fear-sweat" moments, which is why I say it has to be vehicle-specific, not a design or engineering problem.

I've been on loose snow up to 18 inches, packed snow, black ice, mud, dirt, gravel, a combination of all of them in temperatures as low as -5F and never had that "fear-sweat" moment.

 

Well the majority of folks on this site don't know shit (which is fine unless you're gonna be a douche) and then they bitch about something turn around and bitch at others for essentially the same thing. Ah fuck it.

 

Here is a fact that catches a lot of motorists by surprise: if the vehicle we are driving is equipped with ABS brakes, our stopping distances on ice and snow will be longer than if our vehicle did not have ABS brakes. In older vehicles and less expensive vehicles, ABS can lengthen our stopping distances by up to 50 per cent compared to non-ABS. In more modern vehicles and, in particular, ones with very sophisticated ABS braking systems, the difference is not so pronounced.

http://www.wheels.ca/news/abs-brakes-can-add-to-stopping-distances/

 

I don't know what point you're trying to make, but I'll stick with what I said above, I've gone 13k miles on this truck through a Colorado winter, been through just about every condition imaginable with the stock Dunlop's, and never once felt like I was out of control braking.

I just posted above a downhill dirt road where I slammed on the brakes at 50mph and bipbamboom, I was at a stop. According to some here I should have slid right into the ditch.

Which is why I say it's vehicle-specific, not a design or engineering problem.

 

You suggested that the difference in stopping distance with or without ABS would be " maybe one foot shorter " , It would be considerably more than that

 

abs and off roading on a dirt road is always a bad combo, both my Tacoma and Discovery have ABS disable switches.

 

OZ, I really don't think it would be considerably more. In my experience the ABS hasn't been a problem at all. Next time that road gets muddy I'll slam the brakes and post the skid marks. Maybe I'll pull the ABS fuse and see what happens. You tell me what you want, it will be a controlled test.