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Difference between 5/6 Speed Manual

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Old 04-10-2009, 05:53 PM   #1
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Difference between 5/6 Speed Manual

Hi guys, I'm kind of new to manual transmissions and wanted to ask about 5 versus 6 speed manuals. What are the differences? Does it mean 6 speed is faster than 5 speed? What is the max speed for 5 speed manuals? Can a 6 speed go 90 and a 5 speed only 80? I was just confused on the differences between the two. Thanks for the help!
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Old 04-10-2009, 07:22 PM   #2
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Well for one the 5 speed manual is only available in the 4 cylinder models, and the 6 speed manual is only available in the 6 cylinder models. I'm by no means an expert when it comes to transmissions, but the difference between the two is the gearing. For instance you can drive faster in 4th gear in the 5 speed then you can with the 6 speed without the RPM's getting as high, but it doesn't mean you can't go as fast. I'll stop talking before I dig myself in deeper, haha
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Old 04-10-2009, 07:56 PM   #3
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you get to shift 1 extra time with the 6 speed.

The gear ratio's are closer in a 6 speed. Personally, it's just a gimick and not really needed for normal everday use. Offroad I could see some benefit with the closer ratios.
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Old 04-10-2009, 08:33 PM   #4
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I personally have some complaints about the 6 speed, my biggest is that 1st gear is pretty much useless for street driving. You need to shift to second before you hit 10MPH and you can't downshift to 1st unless your going under 5MPH.
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Old 04-10-2009, 08:39 PM   #5
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Looking at the gear ratios of the 6 speed I am amazed that there is such a gap from 1st to 2nd 4.17 to 2.19 is a huge gap to cover in one gear and the 5 speed is actually closer. But this is the difference between the transmissions in gear ratios.
1st 4.17 3.52
2nd 2.19 2.04
3rd 1.49 1.40
4th 1.19 1.00
5th 1.00 0.72
6th 0.85
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Old 04-10-2009, 08:57 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluejays View Post
Hi guys, I'm kind of new to manual transmissions and wanted to ask about 5 versus 6 speed manuals. What are the differences? Does it mean 6 speed is faster than 5 speed? What is the max speed for 5 speed manuals? Can a 6 speed go 90 and a 5 speed only 80? I was just confused on the differences between the two. Thanks for the help!
No, the 6 speed is not faster, it simply offers more gear ratio choices.
Is a 24 speed mountain bike faster than an 18 speed mountain bike ?
No, just more gear choices to let your leg power be used more efficiently.

Back to taco trannys, there's the take-off gear (1st gear), the intermediate gears, the 1:1 gear (where engine and driveline turn at same speed) and finally the overdrive gear.
With overdrive gear, the engine turns about 20% slower than the driveline.

Here's link to a discussion about these transmissions and their respective ratios. See post #4.
Also there is info on the effect of the final drive ratio....that's the gear ratio in your rear (and front if 4WD) differential.
http://www.tundrasolutions.com/forum...drive-6-speed/
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Old 04-10-2009, 09:44 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brunes View Post
The 6 speed has reverse thru a detent on the left and forward insted of on the right side below 5th...

But seriously- The past two posts were way better answers!!
Prolly safer to put it there....6th would be right next to it if it was in the same place as the 5spd. Imagine hitting reverse when you going for 6th !

With the 5spd that area is vacant....makes it a good place for reverse.
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Old 04-10-2009, 10:01 PM   #9
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I'm sure you found your answer, and by looking at the gear ratios, I'm glad I have the 5 spd. I only drive on road.. & sometimes wish the ratios were spread a bit more. What would really be a good tranny woud be a 6-spd with the 5-spd ratios, then have 6th around 0.50 (my estimate is that would put one around 1400-1500 rpm's at 70-75 mph... a good setup for Florida (and Illinois, Indiana, & the other flat-land states)
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Old 04-10-2009, 10:02 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jflan View Post
Prolly safer to put it there....6th would be right next to it if it was in the same place as the 5spd. Imagine hitting reverse when you going for 6th !

With the 5spd that area is vacant....makes it a good place for reverse.
I'm surprised I haven't thrown the transmission on my scion yet- I used to have a 5 speed and an auto...Now I have a 5 speed and a 6 speed....Bad juju....
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Old 04-11-2009, 12:06 AM   #11
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can the 5 speed go 100 mph? what's the max speed 5 speed can go before it's getting bad for the car?
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Old 04-11-2009, 06:51 AM   #12
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X2. I have 5 speed and wish I had a 6th overdrive every AM when I hit the interstate on the way to work. It would be nice to save a little ga$ money.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Some Old Blind Man View Post
I'm sure you found your answer, and by looking at the gear ratios, I'm glad I have the 5 spd. I only drive on road.. & sometimes wish the ratios were spread a bit more. What would really be a good tranny woud be a 6-spd with the 5-spd ratios, then have 6th around 0.50 (my estimate is that would put one around 1400-1500 rpm's at 70-75 mph... a good setup for Florida (and Illinois, Indiana, & the other flat-land states)
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Old 04-11-2009, 07:05 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluejays View Post
can the 5 speed go 100 mph? what's the max speed 5 speed can go before it's getting bad for the car?
Are you trying to set the truck up to race??

For day to day-look at the manual for gearing speeds and and consider that there are lots of things that go into top speed...You trans can prolly handle more than your tires are rated for. Your clutch, brakes, shocks, oil, etc can all have issues as well.
It can also handle more than your frame is designed to do-High speeds will feel VERY light, almost floating...and that is dangerous if you don't know what you are doing or you are in the wrong place (like public roads).

If you are trying to race- you need to find someone nearby who also has a manual truck they race and learn from them..cause there is SO much more to consider than we can every tell you about on here....
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Old 04-11-2009, 07:09 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geoff5093 View Post
I personally have some complaints about the 6 speed, my biggest is that 1st gear is pretty much useless for street driving. You need to shift to second before you hit 10MPH and you can't downshift to 1st unless your going under 5MPH.
I hear ya! I love my 6 speed, but that first is Awful. My last truck was a 12V cummins, with a granny gear for first. Useless...but in my taco, second is two high to start in.....VERY MUCH A PIMA
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Old 04-11-2009, 07:27 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryanf View Post
I hear ya! I love my 6 speed, but that first is Awful. My last truck was a 12V cummins, with a granny gear for first. Useless...but in my taco, second is two high to start in.....VERY MUCH A PIMA
Yeah...I usually skip shift to 3rd off of a high 1st or I find that I'm shifting almost constantly between rolling and like 12-13 mph.

Anyone talked to Toyota about potential for changing out gears or multipliers??
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Old 04-11-2009, 08:24 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluejays View Post
can the 5 speed go 100 mph? what's the max speed 5 speed can go before it's getting bad for the car?
Quote:
X2. I have 5 speed and wish I had a 6th overdrive every AM when I hit the interstate on the way to work. It would be nice to save a little ga$ money.
This is from the link in post #4. As you can see both 5spd and 6spd have virtually the same OD gearing. In fact the 5spd is slightly taller!
The 6spd is just split more in the intermediate gears as you can see.

Aisin 5 speed
R155:

1 3.95
2 2.06
3 1.44
4 1.00
5 0.81

Drive ratios (3.307 / 4.100)
(Gear ratio * Final Drive)
1 13.06 / 16.19
2 6.81 / 8.45
3 4.76 / 5.90
4 3.31 / 4.10
5 2.68 / 3.32

Getrag 6 speed
RA60:

1 4.17
2 2.19
3 1.49
4 1.19
5 1.00
6 0.85

Drive ratios (3.307 / 4.100)
1 13.79 / 17.10
2 7.24 / 8.98
3 4.93 / 6.11
4 3.95 / 4.88
5 3.31 / 4.10
6 2.81 / 3.49

FD: 3.307 (4x2) / 4.100 (PreRunner/4x4) -> these are 4 cylinder model rear ends

For max speed you have to factor in your gear ratio(s) and tire diameter (and redline ) .....there's a chart around here somewhere for doing that.....it's used mainly when upsizing tire size and changing gear ratios to accomodate.
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Old 04-11-2009, 04:26 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by george3 View Post
X2. I have 5 speed and wish I had a 6th overdrive every AM when I hit the interstate on the way to work. It would be nice to save a little ga$ money.
When I'm driving at 60MPH in 6th gear my RPM's are almost always around 2K. I wish there was another gear for even more fuel savings!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ryanf View Post
I hear ya! I love my 6 speed, but that first is Awful. My last truck was a 12V cummins, with a granny gear for first. Useless...but in my taco, second is two high to start in.....VERY MUCH A PIMA
Yeah, I really don't prefer to start off in 2nd unless I'm going at least 5MPH. I usually tend to shift from 1st > 2nd > 3rd > 4th by the time I hit 30MPH, but I almost always skip 5th gear.
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Old 04-11-2009, 06:04 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geoff5093 View Post
When I'm driving at 60MPH in 6th gear my RPM's are almost always around 2K. I wish there was another gear for even more fuel savings!

Yeah, I really don't prefer to start off in 2nd unless I'm going at least 5MPH. I usually tend to shift from 1st > 2nd > 3rd > 4th by the time I hit 30MPH, but I almost always skip 5th gear.
Yeah, I've driven the 6spd and I don't like that first gear....too deep for a normal take-off gear and to tall to be a true granny, IMO.

If 1st is too deep and 6th is not tall enough, one solution is to re-gear the differentials. The gear shops (Randy's Ring and Pinion) have calculators to help you decide on which gearset is best for your application.
I can say that 1st gear in the 2.7L 4x4 with 4:10's is about perfect for a normal 1st gear (stock tires). I would do the math and try to emulate that as the driver in the formula, then take however taller 6th ends up to be.
Focus on that take-off (1st) gear.

Larger tire diameter would be another way to go.
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Old 04-11-2009, 07:06 PM   #19
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are the top speeds of the 6 gear the same as the top speed of the 5th gear? i'm trying to drive on the I-5 from LA to Sacramento and I was wondering if I can go 100 mph with the 5 speed since there is going to be no one on the road. at what speed can i go at until it starts to become bad for the car?
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