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Need Advice - New Truck Was Painted Prior to Sale

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Old 10-30-2009, 11:56 AM   #1
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Need Advice - New Truck Was Painted Prior to Sale

FINAL UPDATE (Hopefully!) 01/08/10 - After over 2 months, this is done. I received the payment check from Koons today. I'll flip this around to Ourisman for the downpayment. Koons is out of the picture, out of my life, done. Just need to tie up loose ends.

UPDATE 12/29/09 - Toyota Financial has received the payoff check from Koons. This is close to done!

UPDATE 12/24/09 - Purchased a Magnetic Grey 2010 4x4 Sport 6-spd from Ourisman Fairfax! I told them about everything I had been through and they contacted Debra at Koons and got the payment thing worked out.

UPDATE 12/15/09 - The truck is back at Koons. They said they would pay $24,401 for it. Basically what I paid for less taxes and fees. I'm waiting on them to send the payoff check to TFS. Once that happens TFS sends me the title, I go back to Koons and hand it over in exchange for a check. In theory...

2nd UPDATE 12/11/09 - Things are at a standstill again. I got an offer of $300 from Allen Toyota towards my $2600 loss. Contacted TMS again and requested an in-person meeting with a regional representative. They will call on Monday and I will hopefully meet with them on Tuesday.

UPDATE 12/11/09 - Page 12 of the thread: The numbers for everything look good except the loss I will take when I trade in ($2600). Talked to TMS this morning and waiting to speak with Allen Toyota. If they step up and make this right I will go forward with the swap. Koons can have the truck transferred in about a week. Things are finally starting to move forward. ::hopeful::

2nd UPDATE 12/10/09 - I got a call back from Koons about 30 minutes later with the information I needed...

UPDATE 12/10/09 - Customer Service Manager at Koons Tysons Toyota says she is 'starting to get annoyed' and starting to not want to help me when I press the issue that trade-in and sales figures on my truck have been promised by certain dates/times and these have slipped by yet again.

UPDATE 12/05/09 - Called Toyota Motor Sales USA yesterday and they gave me a case number. I've sent the package of letters, pictures, etc to them. They said Koons is required to contact me by Wed (3 bus days).

UPDATE 12/04/09 - Haven't received a response from Koons Tysons Toyota on what they are going to do and I'm doubtful it will be in today's mail. A letter to Toyota Motor Sales USA is at the bottom of Page 7. I'll be sending similar letters to the Virginia Attorney General's office, Office of Consumer Affairs, and the BBB.

UPDATE: Most recent correspondence with Koons Tysons Toyota and pictures of rusted seat frame are on pages 3 and 4 of this thread.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hey guys, I'm pretty upset right now and I'm looking for some advice. I bought my truck from Koons Tysons Toyota in mid-September. Today I brought it to Ourisman Fairfax Toyota to look at a leak above the rear window that was wetting the headliner. They called and told me that the 3rd brake light had been removed and the leak is probably coming from the seal there. They said it looks like the roof had been repainted and the brake light was taken off to do it. They said they see tape marks, some kind of polishing compound, and a second layer of paint on top of the factory layers.

I know this vehicle was at another dealer and was transferred to Koons Tysons. They disclosed this to me prior to the sale and I was told it was transferred because they couldn't sell it. The truck had 144 miles on it when I picked it up. It had some minor interior scuffs and wear but otherwise appeared new. My gut told me something was up but I ran a Carfax, it came back clean, and I purchased the truck. I don't know who the original dealer was.

I called Koons Tysons today and they told me that they have no records of the truck being repainted. I want to know why it was repainted. They said they would look into it and they mentioned it is possible that the Ourisman rep is mistaken. I offered to take the truck in to them to look at on Monday and we set up an appt.

What should I do from here? Do I have any options as far as compensation? I'm pissed that I paid a premium for a new vehicle that may have been damaged and repainted.
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Old 10-30-2009, 12:01 PM   #2
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It may have been scrapped or scratched during the shipping process and repainted. The original dealer may have repaired upon receipt.
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Old 10-30-2009, 12:07 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SManZ View Post
What should I do from here? Do I have any options as far as compensation? I'm pissed that I paid a premium for a new vehicle that may have been damaged and repainted.
I'd be pissed also....

I've heard of this similar type of fraud before. Dealers selling vehicles as 'new' when they're not new. If the car was repainted, then that's NOT NEW and they should've told you about that when you bought it and been discounted accordingly.

What else did the carfax tell you? What about registration information?

Here's some neat info...especially #8 & 9.
http://www.ucan.org/gasoline_autos/a..._10_auto_scams
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Old 10-30-2009, 12:37 PM   #4
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Thanks for your replies,

Janster, I can't access my carfax account anymore because its expired. When I get home I can see if I can pull the report from their old emails.

I did receive a call from the Koons dealership's Customer Relations manager. The discussion was heated but productive. She told me she contacted the dealer that they purchased the truck from and they told her that a branch had fallen on the roof and there was a dent. The dent was repaired and the roof was repainted. They said that the original dealership did not disclose the repair work to them when they bought it. The truck was shipped from Texas.

She felt that Koons was not responsible since they did not know about the damage and since it had not been titled it was technically still new. She also said that around 25% of cars on the lot have some kind of repair work to them. She also said that I bought the truck for $3K under MSRP so I had a significant discount to begin with.

I argued that the sale price is irrelevant and had I known about the body damage I would not have purchased the truck. I also told her that the body damage reduces the resale value which is unacceptable since I paid a premium for a new truck. I expect more from the brand and company as a whole, regardless of who was responsible for the repair work. I mentioned that they would sell to me in good faith a properly working truck and the motor may blow when I drive it off the lot. The repairs would be covered under warranty then and I told her I felt that this was a similar case of a hidden problem becoming evident.

It sounded like this particular dealership may not be at fault so I told her I would be contacting Toyota corporate. She said they would call Koons and have them call me and I would be talking to her again. I asked what the remedy would be in this case and she said she did not know but was open to my ideas.

My only one at the time was to consider the trade-in value of my truck in perfect condition and the trade-in value of my truck knowing there was body work done to it and refund the difference.

Any direction, suggestions, anything that you guys can give would be much appreciated!
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Old 10-30-2009, 01:30 PM   #6
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Wow 25% of new cars and trucks get repaired and not disclosed? As far as carfax, accidents do not always show up on it, especially if they are done in house or out of pocket. I would be upset too!

Keep good notes & track all your facts/dates/people talked to and time spent resolving your issue. Keep us posted on what happens and best of luck getting lots of $$ back!
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Old 10-30-2009, 01:36 PM   #7
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that sucks sorry, keep us posted and goodluck
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Old 10-30-2009, 01:45 PM   #8
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not much you can do. i worked at a bodyshop for 10000000 years. we would fix new cars all the time for dealers and they never told anyone. we fixed a camry that was t-boned on the way to get leather int done.we replaced pass side doors,rockers,center and "A" pillars, fender,and repaired the rear quater.customer never knew.it sucks but a minor paint repair is ok.
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Old 10-30-2009, 01:53 PM   #9
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Fuck you and Fuck your body shop for participating in that scam. You are equally guilty.
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Old 10-30-2009, 01:59 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paintdiddy View Post
not much you can do. i worked at a bodyshop for 10000000 years. we would fix new cars all the time for dealers and they never told anyone. we fixed a camry that was t-boned on the way to get leather int done.we replaced pass side doors,rockers,center and "A" pillars, fender,and repaired the rear quater.customer never knew.it sucks but a minor paint repair is ok.
That is so unbelievable yet I totally believe it! What a bunch of crap!
I would be completely pissed if I found out that my "new" vehicle wasn't new.
I'd make them give me virgin.
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Old 10-30-2009, 02:29 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by mxboy57 View Post
Fuck you and Fuck your body shop for participating in that scam. You are equally guilty.
Dude, chill the heck out- If you work for a body shop you cannot help what the person getting a vehicle fixed does with it. I don't work for a body shop or anything but I just don't think it is the guy's fault that fixes the car. Are you on steroids? Easy on the juice, bro.
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Old 10-30-2009, 02:51 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by mxboy57 View Post
Fuck you and Fuck your body shop for participating in that scam. You are equally guilty.
hahahahahaha what a total loser..let me get this right.i'll tell my boss to fuck off and not fix the car.its not a scam on our end.take it up with the dealer dickbag.
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Originally Posted by Mr_Torque View Post
That is so unbelievable yet I totally believe it! What a bunch of crap!
I would be completely pissed if I found out that my "new" vehicle wasn't new.
I'd make them give me virgin.
thats why i always inspect a new car/bike/boat/ski before buying.check door and hood jams for paint edges.never ever ever trust the dealer. do you think they would sell a new car that was hit for less when they can rape you as new???

Quote:
Originally Posted by gcwaterski View Post
Dude, chill the heck out- If you work for a body shop you cannot help what the person getting a vehicle fixed does with it. I don't work for a body shop or anything but I just don't think it is the guy's fault that fixes the car. Are you on steroids? Easy on the juice, bro.
lol steriods...juice...hahahahahahahaha. he is a retaded loser. another keyboard tuffguy
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Old 10-30-2009, 03:02 PM   #13
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Damn , now I feel like I did not look over my truck good enough when I bought it. to late now I guess, if something is wrong with it I don't want to know, lol. a leaky mess is no good, hope the OP gets this situation resolved
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Old 10-30-2009, 04:15 PM   #14
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Dealerships are not there to make the customer happy. Dealerships are a business. They are there to make money. They must make a monthly quota assigned by the Regional Manager. They do not give a shit about the customer.

Always go through your new purchase with a very concerning eye. Let the buyer beware is always the mantra!!
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Old 10-30-2009, 04:22 PM   #15
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What make you guys so certain it was even the dealer? Repairs happen all of the time at the factory. A scratch, bad paint application, etc., etc. And yes...often times the repairs can occur after the vehicle is built.
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Old 10-30-2009, 04:27 PM   #17
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As I recall, there's a certain cost percentage that goes into the equation before disclosure to the customer is needed. Vehicles get damaged all the time and dealers does not have to disclose anything as long as they are within the cost limits. Sucks but it happens and apparently it's legal.
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Old 10-30-2009, 04:55 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paintdiddy View Post
hahahahahaha what a total loser..let me get this right.i'll tell my boss to fuck off and not fix the car.its not a scam on our end.take it up with the dealer dickbag.

thats why i always inspect a new car/bike/boat/ski before buying.check door and hood jams for paint edges.never ever ever trust the dealer. do you think they would sell a new car that was hit for less when they can rape you as new???


lol steriods...juice...hahahahahahahaha. he is a retaded loser. another keyboard tuffguy
Since you do bodywork, i wanted to know if using an electronic paint guage is about the best way to verify body work...
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Old 10-30-2009, 04:58 PM   #19
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I knew of a mechanic that worked in an Autoport located on the coast. There were several body techs employed by the various manufacturers to repair vehicles after their boat trip across the atlantic... would be the same on the pacific coast too. They also saw damage from transport on the train network to the specific warehouses.

In addition, when the vehicle is transported from warehouse to dealer's lot this is often done by third party shipping company - and from time to time (more often with trucks and SUV's) parked on the lower level of an auto carrier the roof gets damaged if the vehicle isn't strapped down properly.

There are many instances in which the vehicle can sustain light damage in transport to the Dealer's lot. In most cases the dealer wouldn't ever know that repairs had been done.

Not to mention in your case where the vehicle had been transferred from one dealer to another. Who's to say it wasn't at another 3rd or 4th dealer before that.

I do hope that you get some resolution.
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Old 10-30-2009, 05:06 PM   #20
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My '03 Mustang was previously hit and I bought it brand new. Found out when we had to take the front bumper off to blend the fender in to repair a scratch. The mounting tabs were in all wrong, and it had overspray on it.
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