Major Rear Ender Today

Good points, but I've done it owing $20K on a $40K sport car. What you do is work with the insurance company and have them tell you who in your area will buy the truck. I have GEICO and they are the ones who told me how to do this. They even introduced me to the person who bought my vehicle. What happens is insurance company has you get a pay off quote from the lender. They will give you a check for the loan amount made payable to the lender and give you a check made payable to you. If you still owe money to the lender then you'd need the guy who buys your truck to write the check for the wrecked truck to the lender and then have the insurance company cover the remainder.

Bottom line, the truck gets paid off.
You walk with whatever equity you have in the truck.
You go immediately to the local Toyota dealer and strike a deal on a new 2010. Finance it and you'll have basically the same payment and nearly the same equity.

Here's what I gave up and why... remember, I owed ~20K on the Infiniti and paid in full for all of the ~$20K in mods...







Notice the bent frame rails...

 

you're 100% right. he would have the same payment. but him and my mother work it out so that they never have 2 car payments and only finance for 48 months a piece so that they keep their cars for 8 years each. if they total it and get another truck, that starts his clock over again, and that's another 2 years my mother has to wait for a new car, and her 04 4-runner already has 140k on the clock. while the payment would stay the same (or relatively close to the same), there is more to consider in this situation

 

It'll probably be pushing $16,000 US by the time they are done......

 

IRSmart--can you explain how you can change parts of the frame out and be golden when the repair is complete. I'm an old fart and guess I didn't know that was even possible. I belong to the day that if you bent your frame you were screwed.

You can keep it brief and I'm sure I'll understand I just didn't know frame parts could be changed out safely and competently....

 

Some frames these days are bolted together in pieces. My infiniti had "frame rails" that stuck out below the engine. You can see them, they're the 2 arms that are bent toward the passenger side earlier in the thread. Not too sure about our trucks though... I'm old too and say ditch a bent frame vehicle. Tire wear, alignment troubles, ride quality, safety, etc... not worth the hassle.

 

(Bear with me I'm just a tad bit older than you I bet--but I need to learn)

If you can replace the part that is bent why not? When you bend a part of the frame I understand it could pull other parts as well but do you normally have bolts or attachments points that are attached to the frame but don't bend? IN short order if the piece of frame that is bent...would it bend or tear other parts attached to it and upon inspection could you see it or would you need some kind of non-destructive testing to make the determination?

 

If part of the frame is bent it obviously went well beyond the materials yield point. This means that at the joint where the 2 frame pieces came together there was a significant amount of stress which could cause fatigue, could create small cracks that will propigate over time, it could have weakened the bolted interface significantly or actually slightly bent the connecting piece at the interface. Any of these "issues" would be a big problem in future accidents as the components that are being replaced are strong. If the interface is compromised the next time the driver of the vehicle is in an accident, the frame pieces will not behave the way they were designed to, thus being a safety issue.
Then there is the fact that the body shop may think the damage isn't that bad. They get well into the tear down, have a bunch of parts on order and find the interface is bent. What do they do? What does the insurance company have them do? Answer is simple... fix the interface with heat, pounding, cutting, welding or whatever it takes. Body shops seem to always find more damage once they've began the tear down, just the way it works.
There is always the possibility that only one part is damaged you replace it and things will be OK, but no guarantees. With the opportunity to walk away from the wreck hassle free, I'd take advantage of that opportunity every time. YMMV...

BTW, my comments are "general". I'm not saying anything negative about this guys dad, who owns the body shop. I'm just making a generalized comment about accidents with a "near-totaled" vehicle and the issues that seem to plague many people after repairs are made and they're stuck with a loan on a 'fixed' yet still very compromised vehicle.

 

Unfortunatley, the truck is not "near totaled". The NADA values my truck at $27,750, even with the current mileage. $14,500 in damage isn't even close to the fair market value of the vehicle, so it's going to get repaired.

"This guys Dad", does not own the body shop. My son works for a large dealer that owns multiple dealerships in the area and has a full service collison center. One of the dealerships they have is Lexus, which is a Toyota product.

The frame is getting replaced 100%. In doing this, my truck will be dismantled and reassembled with the replacement parts.

Am I happy about this? No. But I am counting on the fact that the collison center is located behind the Lexus dealer, and in addition to a "body shop" they also have the full compliment of Lexus mechanics on duty to handle the mechanical part of the job.

I'm certain there will be some small things that will need attention, and they will here from me about that if it happens.

 

Diminished value of a auto after it's replaced. Not sure the percentage, but you can find it via some research. I had a similar situation as Dr.RabbitFurHead and ended up with 27k in my pocket, I still had a 19k loan so it was paid off. Add your repairs and the diminished value and you will probably be over the totaling point of your truck. A little leg work and you might find yourself in a new truck and ahead.

Either way good luck with your repairs and the bs with wrecks. Glad you werent hurt.

 

Okay got it!!! Thanks. What would be interesting is if the vehicle after repair was involved in another auto accident and injury resulted from parts not replaced due to a lack of damage criteria. Being an aviation accident investigator I can tell you when an aircraft is crashed (more than a hard landing) it is not salvaged out! Parts are not allowed to be used on other aircraft. Radio's etc are of course allowed but the other stuff requiring Part 61 (?) certification are not!

I also found the blog after yours that stated the frame in it's entirety was being replaced....dammmmmmm.... technology in vehicle repair has certainly jumped ions ahead of what it used to be. As a kid I thrived on this stuff but must admit as I've gotten older I haven't kept up with it. Say what you will but I find this very interesting.

Thanks to all who educated me....who said an old dog can't learn new tricks...I just did.

 

I can certainly understand why aircraft parts are not reused.... A part failure could result in the craft falling out of the sky......

If I'm reading your post correctly, you are misunderstanding about the frame damage. The first shop I went to was going to section in a partial frame. The shop that is actually doing the repair work is replacing the entire frame with a new one.

 

Okay that is what I thought was going to happen...a complete frame replacemnt....I didn't know you could do that. As far as an airplane falling out of the sky....it scares me to think of an out of control car at 30MPH in rush hour traffic....it's all damm scary....

 

i didn't read the response to your question by the other member, for the simple reason that i have ADD, it's a long post, and it's early in the morning lol

there are 2 different kinds of frame constructions, a "body-on-frame," and a "unibody." a body-on-frame was used for many decades since cars were designed in just about every type of car, from big pickups to small cars. it means that the body of the car (or cab and bed, in the case of a truck) is actually bolted to a physical frame. so, if the frame gets bent, you can remove the body from the frame, and bolt it to a new one, like in this case. trucks and large SUVs still use a body on frame construction, because they are stronger. cars, however, from the late 70's/early 80's-present use unibody frame construction (with the exception of the ford crown victoria/mercury mountaneer/lincoln town car, which are all using frames designed in the mid-70's still and have never had their frames re-designed)

a unibody frame is just the opposite. the frame and body are all 1 piece, and are built at the factory as one piece. it's normally the body of the car, rear quarter panels, roof, and engine compartment that are all one piece. things like the hood, front fenders, and doors are all added on. the problem with a unibody is that if any part of the frame gets damaged, it MUST be fixed, because it cannot be removed to be replaced because it is part of the car. that is why when you hear people say that if the frame is damaged, the car is most likely a total loss, because repairing a frame is a lengthy and costly process.

make sense?

 

Okay so I understand the taco that was wrecked is a unibody type frame. I've heard of the frame straightening equipment that is used to straighten them and they come at a very expensive price tag. I would expect thru computer technology the right push and pull technique could be darn near perfect. I would also expect some type of criteria that would say "if it's bent this bad then you cannot straighten the frame correctly!" Way to much technology for me...but hey if you guys tell me it works your smarter than me and I would believe you....

 

No. Tacomas are not unibody, they are the "body on frame" type.

However you are correct about the frame equipment being expensive, and with the use of computers and lasers, they can get a unibody vehicle just about back to "as new" condition.

 

I don't mean to pick over word but you said "just about!" As a consumer would you be satisfied with a unibody that is "just about" correct? Would I be satisfied with that....again I'm just asking to learn....I'm sure as heck not the word police but trying to be very specific on what I understand....

Thanks to you and IRSmart for bearing with an old guy on this!!! You guys have taught me more in your blogs than I have learned about cars in the last 15 years....

 

I say "just about", because the repair work would be done within given tolerences that are used within the industry. I don't know what those tolerences are, but I do know it's something that you cannot decern with the naked eye.

For example, when you get a front end alignment done, it's not perfect. There are +/- tolerences that the mechanics work to that are acceptable. If the shop gives you a computerized printout of the aligment, you'll see what those tolerences are and where your specific vehicle falls within them.

 

Since you had an '08 vehicle, are you getting a Toyota, OEM frame or an aftermarket frame? Most insurance companies try to push aftermarket parts (which are not always made to the same specs as the OEM parts) once the vehicle goes past 1 year old.

 

Excellent question....I never even thought about this....and thanks for the tolerance answers. I kinda figured there was a tolerance involved as this is what we use on accident investigations to determine part failures as a cause of the accident or replicating attitudes....

 

exactly. that is why the frame on the tacoma can be replaced, rather than neccessitating a repair