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Old 05-18-2013, 08:47 PM   #661
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
Yup. Every time, the engine is turning with no oil pressure.
Take the valve covers off of an old Chevy 350, pull the coil wire, and see how long you have to crank a cold engine before oil starts squirting out of the pushrods.

It's not a "long" time, but it's uncomfortable.
At one time I looked into a gizmo that would build up the oil pressure before starting but I didn't follow thru.
Here is a link to a (pre-oiling)

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CTR-24-006/
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Old 05-18-2013, 10:27 PM   #662
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Quote:
Originally Posted by george3 View Post
At one time I looked into a gizmo that would build up the oil pressure before starting but I didn't follow thru.
Here is a link to a (pre-oiling)

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CTR-24-006/
Ya, a couple of my racing buddies had similar rigs back in the 80s.
Just had to remember to close the solenoid before shutting down.

What I don't see on that, or in the installation kits, is a control valve.
Done properly, the accumulator is open at all times the engine is running. That way, if the pickup is uncovered during hard cornering, the accumulator takes over.

But without a valve, it's going to dump as soon as the engine is shut down.
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Old 05-19-2013, 08:30 AM   #663
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
Ya, a couple of my racing buddies had similar rigs back in the 80s.
Just had to remember to close the solenoid before shutting down.

What I don't see on that, or in the installation kits, is a control valve.
Done properly, the accumulator is open at all times the engine is running. That way, if the pickup is uncovered during hard cornering, the accumulator takes over.

But without a valve, it's going to dump as soon as the engine is shut down.
I'm impressed ! I thought I was posting some information of interest to the subject but you already knew all about it. Let us know if you actually do a similar mod and how it worked out. Thanks.
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Old 05-19-2013, 12:01 PM   #664
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Originally Posted by george3 View Post
I'm impressed ! I thought I was posting some information of interest to the subject but you already knew all about it. Let us know if you actually do a similar mod and how it worked out. Thanks.
130k on my '91 Escort, 240k on my '94 Toyota P/U, 140k on my '03 Tundra, 45k on my '06 Duramax, 90k on my '08 Taco (that's not counting company cars and the 4 cars I drove from '78 to '90).
Plus all of the cars my wife has driven....

Never had an oiling related issue with any of them. It's not worth it for a daily driver.
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Old 05-19-2013, 01:16 PM   #665
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
130k on my '91 Escort, 240k on my '94 Toyota P/U, 140k on my '03 Tundra, 45k on my '06 Duramax, 90k on my '08 Taco (that's not counting company cars and the 4 cars I drove from '78 to '90).
Plus all of the cars my wife has driven....

Never had an oiling related issue with any of them. It's not worth it for a daily driver.
Thanks - Just saved me $200 plus time installing. Sound like you have a fleet. I thought Chris 4X4 was the go to guy but U R a wealth of info. Thanks again.
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Old 09-11-2013, 06:34 PM   #666
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got 154 km on my 2008 acc cab,4cyl,,runs fine so far,,was wondering about water pump i saw on post,,when did it go..i'm using syn oil./just did coolent as well as all other fluids.
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:52 AM   #667
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
Yup. Every time, the engine is turning with no oil pressure.
Take the valve covers off of an old Chevy 350, pull the coil wire, and see how long you have to crank a cold engine before oil starts squirting out of the pushrods.

It's not a "long" time, but it's uncomfortable.

Take the valve cover of off a 85 22R and hit the key with a live coil. You be cleaning up the mess running down both fenders for awhile. looks like a mixmaster set on ultra high. Kinda amazing really until the cleanup reality sets in. It was idiling and it was a gusher. young, dumb,,and curious.

Just turned 199 on the "99"
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Old 09-12-2013, 02:48 PM   #668
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167 on my 3RZ, "50k" on my ranger. True mileage unknown.
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:56 PM   #669
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mod View Post
Take the valve cover of off a 85 22R and hit the key with a live coil. You be cleaning up the mess running down both fenders for awhile. looks like a mixmaster set on ultra high. Kinda amazing really until the cleanup reality sets in. It was idiling and it was a gusher. young, dumb,,and curious.
Ya, chain-driven OHC is a bit different because the chain is splash-oiled.
But the cam journals are dry on initial startup.

Start the 22R with the oil cap off and you'll have the same effect as with the rocker cover off.

And ya... I did it too.
Adjusted the valves on bro-in-law's Mazda GLC. Didn't even think about the chain and cranked it over to see if the valves "sounded ok" after setting everything to proper clearances.

Freaking mess.
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Old 09-13-2013, 08:26 AM   #670
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One time my father bought a V-8 Ford sedan

A Fairlane or Galaxy or something. A 1968 I think.

It was used and he bought it for my sister. I remember going to pick it up with him. There was some slight lifter noise but other than that it started and ran well.

My sister then drove it uneventfully for several years until one day it overheated or something and then would not turn over or start. It happened somewhat far away so my father told the garage there to fix it.

They called a day or two later to say that the engine was seized as the oil pump had no drive shaft. None; it wasn't there.

Thinking: how the hell can that be? my father and I drove down there to see what was what. And not only was there no oil pump drive shaft (actually just a long flat piece of metal) but there hadn't been for a long time. But they had drained maybe two gallons of oil out of the car. <g> I eventually did find the twisted-off oil pump drive - by poking around in the hardened sludge in the bottom of the drain pan. <g> And the valve covers were Filled with hard baked looking sludge which had obviously not seen oil for a long time. The inside of the sludge was the exact same shape as the rocker arms - like a mold of them. <g>

The oil pressure light bulb was not installed. <g> Apparently what had happened was that the oil pump failed so the previous owner had pretty much Filled the engine with oil, disabled the oil pressure light, and then sold the car to my father. My sister had checked the oil (had it checked at the gas station) and had always been told that she didn't need oil. <g> But eventually the oil level got to below the crankshaft and the engine seized.

My point is that the engine apparently survived adequately well for years with zero oil pressure - only submersion and splash-lubrication. So the idea that anything bad happens to an engine in the few seconds it takes to get full oil flow just seems pretty remote to me. <g>

PHM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
Yup. Every time, the engine is turning with no oil pressure.
Take the valve covers off of an old Chevy 350, pull the coil wire, and see how long you have to crank a cold engine before oil starts squirting out of the pushrods.

It's not a "long" time, but it's uncomfortable.
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Old 09-13-2013, 08:27 AM   #671
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Oh; and I have 118K on my 2007 Tacoma w/2.7 running Mobil 1

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Old 09-13-2013, 08:10 PM   #672
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Pretty hard to believe that story. The crank bearings could potentially be lubricated by splash and survive, but the camshaft would gall the bearings and seize very quickly, resulting in either a broken timing chain, or a broken camshaft.

Sorry. I do not believe you.
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Old 09-14-2013, 10:16 AM   #673
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Tons of pressure on a V8 lifter pushrod configuration. Somewhere south of 100 tons or 200,000 lbs per lifter face to camshaft lobe lift during operation. Once the oil wedge that is supporting the camshaft is gone,,it's a quick death. They wouldn't last long at all without lube. I know, you can youtube me all day long of pin it to win it motor blowups, but most of the time they are a failed motor anyways.
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Old 09-14-2013, 10:32 AM   #674
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That's OK

It did, and still does, seem impossible to me too - which is why I remembered it all this time. <g> My father would be the best reference but he is dead. I'm about 99% sure that my brother wasn't living anywhere close at the time, and I doubt that my sister could even remember the car, let alone the details of it's final end. <g>

Nonetheless; I called my brother just now (left a voicemail to call me) and I guess I give the incredible long shot of calling sister a call next.

I'll see what kind of confirmation I can come up with but I'm pretty sure I remember it pretty well. I can remember the baked-on and clearly non-oiled sludge in the valve covers like I just saw them yesterday. I worked on my own vehicles all the time back then; rebuild engines and so forth, so I knew what I was looking at. Which is what made me go fishing around in the oil pan sludge for any 'spare' parts. <g>

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
Pretty hard to believe that story. The crank bearings could potentially be lubricated by splash and survive, but the camshaft would gall the bearings and seize very quickly, resulting in either a broken timing chain, or a broken camshaft.

Sorry. I do not believe you.
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Old 09-14-2013, 11:15 AM   #675
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
Ya, chain-driven OHC is a bit different because the chain is splash-oiled.
But the cam journals are dry on initial startup.

Start the 22R with the oil cap off and you'll have the same effect as with the rocker cover off.

And ya... I did it too.
Adjusted the valves on bro-in-law's Mazda GLC. Didn't even think about the chain and cranked it over to see if the valves "sounded ok" after setting everything to proper clearances.

Freaking mess.
,,And since the timing chain tensioner is oil pressure dependent, you want to keep good oil in the 20-22r's. Spendy tensioner when I bought mine nib. Had a pile o bucks in that 22R. TRD internal's, custom rods, Comp cams, matched head and intake flow work, custom header, custom 540 cfm carb. Pulled 275Hp out of the thing at a zillion rpms on the dyno back in 87. oil pressure was 75psi at full sing. A new Centerforce about every week, it just wouldn't hold it. Young, dumb and curious. Sold it and got my $5000 back out of it.
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Old 09-14-2013, 05:03 PM   #676
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,,And since the timing chain tensioner is oil pressure dependent, you want to keep good oil in the 20-22r's. Spendy tensioner when I bought mine nib. Had a pile o bucks in that 22R. TRD internal's, custom rods, Comp cams, matched head and intake flow work, custom header, custom 540 cfm carb. Pulled 275Hp out of the thing at a zillion rpms on the dyno back in 87. oil pressure was 75psi at full sing. A new Centerforce about every week, it just wouldn't hold it. Young, dumb and curious. Sold it and got my $5000 back out of it.
Yup... The one thing that could bring the "bulletproof" 22r series to it's knees is lack of regular oil changes.
Tensioner gums up, the guides wear, the chain stretches, and the cam goes out of time, causing loss of power, and eventually chain failure.
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Old 09-15-2013, 12:12 AM   #677
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My 98 stickshift is at 325,000! Runs AMAZINGLY well Pretty sure the head gaskey just went out (spewing oil all over the header) Still running strong though this will require attention. On that note, the clutch has never been replaced. Still feels great, and smooth shifting of course!
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Old 12-10-2013, 10:27 PM   #679
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2010 - 64,000
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