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Old 07-06-2012, 05:46 AM   #1
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Very tight budget build

I really don't have a lot of money to spend so here is my idea now. I'd also like to keep my factory head unit until I can afford a touch screen double din and they come out with a shiny black dash kit. I love the look of my dash now and don't want to mess that up. I am thinking 6.5" components up front and 6.5"s in the back. I'd probably pick up the components first, then get am Apline KTP-445U, then get the rear speakers.

The amp: http://www.crutchfield.com/p_500KTP4....html?tp=35782

Speakers I'm looking at:
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/cat_m...33%5Bmax%5D=55

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...E-R1652-S.html

So what do you guys think? I know it's not up to the quality of most of your setups, but my money usually goes to my wife and kids
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Old 07-06-2012, 05:55 AM   #2
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Later I'll probably be getting a 10" to go behind one of the rear seats.
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Old 07-06-2012, 06:04 AM   #3
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What kind of Budget?

I put alpine 6.5 components in my front doors and they sound amazing can't wait to get an amp! The code for them is SPR-60C.
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Old 07-06-2012, 06:17 AM   #4
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The alpine power pack is a waste of money. Use that $150 to get better speakers. Pioneer and RF speakers are both very entry level and pretty close to stock. They can't handle much amplification and top out quickly. Look into alpine components. They should still be reasonable if you take that $150 from the power pack and use it for speakers. I promise you won't regret it. PM me your exact budget including tax and I can possibly get the products cheaper and ship them still for less than what u can buy them for. I've done it for many members. But I don't give out pricing info until I know for sure exactly which item you want and how much you have.
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Old 07-06-2012, 06:49 AM   #5
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I don't know my budget yet, it's mainly whatever I can scrape together. I was also planning on doing this in phases as I get money. I was thinking I could get some components that could run off of the stock HU until I can get a small amp maybe 50w RMS. I was thinking the power pack because it will save me money on cables and a LOC or processor.

Night, I looked at those speakers and I can't afford $200 speakers.

The last time I did anything with audio in a vehicle was my old Ranger which I got rid of in '04. I memphis 6x8's in the doors on a pioneer HU and a Kicker Comp VR 10" with a us acoustics 800w mono amp.
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Old 07-06-2012, 01:27 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blkvulcan View Post
I don't know my budget yet, it's mainly whatever I can scrape together. I was also planning on doing this in phases as I get money. I was thinking I could get some components that could run off of the stock HU until I can get a small amp maybe 50w RMS. I was thinking the power pack because it will save me money on cables and a LOC or processor.

Night, I looked at those speakers and I can't afford $200 speakers.

The last time I did anything with audio in a vehicle was my old Ranger which I got rid of in '04. I memphis 6x8's in the doors on a pioneer HU and a Kicker Comp VR 10" with a us acoustics 800w mono amp.
The only reason I said no to the power pack is because 50rms is what most, if not all, aftermarket radios push right of the box. It just seemed like a waste of $150 that you could use towards something else.

Check out infinity. There Reference series is pretty basic and cost efficient but still way higher quality than the pioneers. Even the RF are better thank the pioneers but I think you would be happier with something slightly more. Check out Polk also, they have surprisingly good sounding speakers for the price imo
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Old 07-06-2012, 01:46 PM   #7
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I understand about the 50w, but if I don't want to replace my head unit now.

I used to have favorite brands, but it has been so long since I've even looked at speakers. I think I may go to Best Buy tonight to listen to some. The local shops will be closed by the time I get home.

Any opinion on Kicker DS series or Cerwin Vega HED? I used to love MB Quart, but I heard they got bought out. I also loved Infininty.
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Old 07-06-2012, 05:18 PM   #8
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im going with these..should sound good.
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...CTX-6.5cs.html
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Old 07-06-2012, 05:21 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keggerdude View Post
im going with these..should sound good.
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...CTX-6.5cs.html
Those are good speakers, but Image Dynamics went out of business. Just so you know.
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Old 07-06-2012, 06:21 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blkvulcan View Post
I understand about the 50w, but if I don't want to replace my head unit now.

I used to have favorite brands, but it has been so long since I've even looked at speakers. I think I may go to Best Buy tonight to listen to some. The local shops will be closed by the time I get home.

Any opinion on Kicker DS series or Cerwin Vega HED? I used to love MB Quart, but I heard they got bought out. I also loved Infininty.
You will like infinity better than the pioneer or rf u picked
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Old 07-06-2012, 07:00 PM   #11
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Thanks for all the advice. I'm sure I'd like the Infinity better. I'm trying to stay under $100 for the front speakers. I just got back from my local Best Buy and they didn't have anything up to listen to. I was looking at the Kicker DS series because I have found them for $50-$70.
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Old 07-06-2012, 07:18 PM   #12
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I think you would like the kickers too
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Old 07-07-2012, 09:42 AM   #13
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Okay, a couple things here.

One, the Alpine power pack is NOT a waste of money. I don't know where others are getting their information, but an aftermarket deck does NOT put out 50W/channel. Most aftermarket decks put out around 12-15w, some go as high as 18. The 50W rating is simply one channel, for a short burst, which does not tell the story of how music is played in a stereo. The Alpine pack is a worthwhile investment, because it will put out 45w/channel in a compact package, no need to install a second amp somewhere for the mains.

Second, you get what you pay for in speakers. What I would do if I were you is take the money that you were planning to spend on the PowerPack, and put it towards speakers first. Run the speakers off the deck, while saving up for the PowerPack. This way you won't be disappointed. There are very few speakers around $100 that will satisfy people in the long run. You will no doubt decide soon after upgrading the amp to those speakers, that you need to re-purchase better speakers, as the mid-bass performance, as well as the highs just aren't there. This is more of a factor in the low quality cross-over networks than the design of the speakers. If you decide to go with a co-axial speaker, which you could do, than you will have fewer comprimises in the cross-over, at the expense of having better imaging, by being able to high mount the tweeters. IMO, your minimum budget for front speakers should be in the $200-$250 range, to better suit a long-term purchase of speakers that you'll be happy with for a while. And remember, if you're running aftermarket speakers on the stock deck, the quality still won't be there. The stock tuning of the stereo is done to ensure long term use of the stock speakers. Most often, the factory tunes them to ensure things like not blowing speakers at high volume. This entails lowering the bass output as the volume increases. Not a great sound.

Go slow, and really research what will work best for you. And try to purchase for the long term. I've been in your situation, and usually ended up spending more than I initially wanted, because I didn't think into the future far enough, and had to repurchase better quality down the road.
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Old 07-07-2012, 05:04 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMan2k2 View Post
Okay, a couple things here.

One, the Alpine power pack is NOT a waste of money. I don't know where others are getting their information, but an aftermarket deck does NOT put out 50W/channel. Most aftermarket decks put out around 12-15w, some go as high as 18. The 50W rating is simply one channel, for a short burst, which does not tell the story of how music is played in a stereo. The Alpine pack is a worthwhile investment, because it will put out 45w/channel in a compact package, no need to install a second amp somewhere for the mains.

Second, you get what you pay for in speakers. What I would do if I were you is take the money that you were planning to spend on the PowerPack, and put it towards speakers first. Run the speakers off the deck, while saving up for the PowerPack. This way you won't be disappointed. There are very few speakers around $100 that will satisfy people in the long run. You will no doubt decide soon after upgrading the amp to those speakers, that you need to re-purchase better speakers, as the mid-bass performance, as well as the highs just aren't there. This is more of a factor in the low quality cross-over networks than the design of the speakers. If you decide to go with a co-axial speaker, which you could do, than you will have fewer comprimises in the cross-over, at the expense of having better imaging, by being able to high mount the tweeters. IMO, your minimum budget for front speakers should be in the $200-$250 range, to better suit a long-term purchase of speakers that you'll be happy with for a while. And remember, if you're running aftermarket speakers on the stock deck, the quality still won't be there. The stock tuning of the stereo is done to ensure long term use of the stock speakers. Most often, the factory tunes them to ensure things like not blowing speakers at high volume. This entails lowering the bass output as the volume increases. Not a great sound.

Go slow, and really research what will work best for you. And try to purchase for the long term. I've been in your situation, and usually ended up spending more than I initially wanted, because I didn't think into the future far enough, and had to repurchase better quality down the road.
You are correct that the Alpine power pack four-channel amplifier boosts power to the speakers to 45Wx4 RMS (up from an average power of 18Wx4 RMS). It certainly would help sound quality quite well, but with the speakers that OP was looking into, this would have been a waste of money and would probably do more harm than good. Although Pioneer and RF components may be rated at a higher wattage peak and rms than the power pack puts out, that doesnt mean that they can handle it. Your recommendation is basically exactly what I said about using the power pack money to get better speakers. Higher quality speakers will sound better overall weather amplified or not.

However, OP, keep in mind that speakers and subwoofers can be "blown" by underpowering them. Regardless of what speakers you get, if they are components they should be amplified. Im sure their are a ton of people that are going to jump in now and say "I have components running off the head unit and they sound great, never had a problem".... This is true, but by underpowering your speakers you are putting a strain on them that could do serious damage to the voice coils. I have seen a sub "blow" from being underpowered.

With all that being said, I did recommend getting better speakers and forget the power pack for now, but as mentioned in the quote above, it is highly recommended that components be amplified. Im sure the power pack will give you a slight boost in sound and certainly help take the stress off the speakers, but a real amp should be installed eventually.

Its the same as if I said I was going to buy an 8" 300w bazooka self amplified sub... I have two 10's in my truck that only run on about 300w and they will make a bazooka sub look like a kids toy. People have 10,000w amplifiers strong enough to kill a person but their system still doesnt have the quality, imaging, clarity, and sound of a simple 300w system of higher quality. Why do you think Bose audio does not advertise the wattage rating of their systems... it is highly self classified internal information that Bose will never release to the public becuase it is so incredibly low wattage that if people knew how low powered it was, they would never buy it. But their home audio systems sound pretty damm good! My point is that wattage DOES NOT MATTER! The power pack is great for taking a little stress off your speakers and slightly boosting sound levels, but just because it takes it from 18 to 45 rms power does not mean its better.
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Old 07-07-2012, 11:19 PM   #15
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I would get a Pioneer double din dvd player, and use the factory speakers for now. That would probably be the most bang for the buck.
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Old 07-08-2012, 08:38 AM   #16
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I would love to get a new head unit. There are a couple reasons I don't want to go that route right now. I don't want to lose the looks of the stock unit, I don't want to lose the glossy black surround, and I'd have to pay $70 for the steerng wheel adaptor.

I understand about getting what you pay for in speakers. I also don't think I have the ears to appreciate high end speakers. I loved my memphis power reference 5x7's in my old Ranger.I honestly don't think the stock speakers in my tacoma sound that bad. I would like the highs t be a bit brighter I think. I would then like to get a single 10" sub. I don't think the highs on the stock speaker would be able to keep up with a 10 enough for my liking.

I do agree with everybody's advice. If I was still single and kidless I would be building a new system. With kids things are a lot different.
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Old 07-08-2012, 09:55 AM   #17
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haha, oh to be single and kidless.

Anyways, you'd be surprised at how much of a difference a good speaker will make. I'm not talking $4-500, but a little lower on the scale. Something like these JL speakers for example.
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_136C265...50.html?tp=106
I know they are higher than you were initially considering for speakers, but if you take into consideration the money you were considering for the Alpine PowerPack, you're in the ballpark now. I'm running, probably what you would consider for a system yourself, which is these speakers, running off an Alpine deck and the PowerPack amp. Then I have an Alpine 500w amp pushing a JL W3 10" sub. Fantastic sound. The sub hits hard, but the mains keep up just fine, giving me a very immersive sound.

I'm with Proforce on this one. Consider upping your budget by saving first. I've been in your current situation, wanting to upgrade but constrained by outside influence. I ended up buying low grade gear, only to later upgrade it to better gear, but spending more than I wanted overall, because of my initial purchase of not-so-great stuff. It sucks that you can't upgrade right away, but if the "upgrade" needs to be updated in the not-so-distant future, it's not money well spent. And, even with your ears, as you say, you'd be able to tell the difference between okay and good component speakers.
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