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Old 11-19-2013, 09:07 PM   #21
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Old 11-19-2013, 09:36 PM   #22
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I guess It was a matter of time before someone jacked my design. Ah well. I guess it was a good one. And if you want some over priced, underbuilt sliders. Give these guys a call. For the real deal. Shoot me a pm
I will order a pair from you right now. I'm assuming you have the shipping details worked out? Can you send them tomorrow? Where do I input my credit card to order them? What type of return policy do you have? They are powder coated? They bolt-on with grade 8 hardware? You have done extensive testing and stand behind your product 100%? I can only assume you have engineering schematics, 3D models, load testing metrics and I can feel confident that they will be a perfect fit? Are the pictures you posted of a completed product?

Clearly, you are a professional and have a tactful approach to business. I wouldn't say our signature rock sliders are overbuilt nor underbuilt. They use the gauge of steel we found to be a perfect balance for toughness and weight. We build our equipment within 1/5000mm of precision so the 1st pair is the same as the 1000th pair. If you want to bash our company and sliders and say we ripped you off...hahahaha, have at it. Only making yourself look bad man.

We designed and built these 3 years ago. I'm still looking for your website.

Keep up the great work!
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Old 11-19-2013, 09:43 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by GOG View Post
I wouldn't say ours are overbuilt nor under-built. They use the gauge of steel we found to be a middle ground for toughness and weight. We build our equipment within 1/5000mm of precision so the 1st pair is the same as the 1000th pair.
Eh, I don't think that kind of precision is super important to something that is hidden under the truck and just going to get drug around on rocks. Also trail armor is not exactly something you want to trade toughness out for lightweight... Unless you have them just for looks I guess I've watched rocks destroy 1/8" steel on rigs very easily actually. Hell I have watched it damage 3/16" steel. That is why I chose to go with 1/4" steel for all of my armor. If these were tube sliders it wouldn't be a big issue since tube is pretty strong due to it's geometry paired with its small size, but you have a flat plate that will meet the rocks and will dent easily...
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Old 11-19-2013, 09:49 PM   #24
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over two years? year and two months?
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Old 11-19-2013, 09:58 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by BradyT88 View Post
Eh, I don't think that kind of precision is super important to something that is hidden under the truck and just going to get drug around on rocks. Also trail armor is not exactly something you want to trade toughness out for lightweight... Unless you have them just for looks I guess I've watched rocks destroy 1/8" steel on rigs very easily actually. Hell I have watched it damage 3/16" steel. That is why I chose to go with 1/4" steel for all of my armor. If these were tube sliders it wouldn't be a big issue since tube is pretty strong due to it's geometry paired with its small size, but you have a flat plate that will meet the rocks and will dent easily...
The precision is important for quality and consistency. We are a manufacturing company. Rock sliders are the tip of the iceberg for us. I never said they were "lightweight" but the balance of toughness vs. weight is important to us. We build expedition/overland grade equipment. If you drive a rock crawler then sure, heavier armor might make more sense but when you build a truck to drive for extended off-road travel with heavy loads, rock crawler gear isn't quite the answer. We're comparing apples to oranges. We've tested our sliders slamming them into rocks in Moab all the way to the jungles of Guatemala and we have had no issues. I wish your buddies company the best. There's room for all of us
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:07 PM   #26
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over two years? year and two months?
Yup! "Been in business" for over 2 years, finally got around to registering with the state in 2012. Doh! Been too busy!
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:14 PM   #27
Benjamin Newman
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As far as a website goes, it is still a hobby job. I build for fun, and because I like seeing people enjoy what I build. I put a pile of hrs into a pair of sliders in my spare time. soon, I hope to do this full time, and move up from the hobby job status. but that is a hell of a leap as you know.
Its frustrating to see someone take what you have worked your ass off on, and call it their own design. who knows, we may have come up with similar designs at the same time. your stuff may be more "exact," I am jealous of that, I would love to have access to high dollar machinary, and that will come with time.
If someone wants a set of sliders that are "just strong enough" I wont argue with you, or them. thats fine, it's their truck. I personally, don't like problems, and when I build something, it will be to the best of my ability, if it fails, I will build it stronger and better. but I will do everything I can to prevent the first failure. I am not trying to stamp these out in mass numbers, like i said, I do this for fun. not to trump someone else.
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:19 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GOG View Post
The precision is important for quality and consistency. We are a manufacturing company. Rock sliders are the tip of the iceberg for us. I never said they were "lightweight" but the balance of toughness vs. weight is important to us. We build expedition/overland grade equipment. If you drive a rock crawler then sure, heavier armor might make more sense but when you build a truck to drive for extended off-road travel with heavy loads, rock crawler gear isn't quite the answer. We're comparing apples to oranges. We've tested our sliders slamming them into rocks in Moab all the way to the jungles of Guatemala and we have had no issues. I wish your buddies company the best. There's room for all of us
I've never felt that sliders are very heavy compared to most armor. In fact I think my are still lighter than my skids even. What do yours weigh? I am running BAMF sliders and I think they clock in about about 100lbs.

Rock Crawler and Expo seem to go hand in hand for most people on here as well, hell even you it sounds like, if you spend some time in Moab. So it's not apples to oranges for the majority of this site. Comparing Pirate4x4 to ExpeditionPortal would be apples to oranges. TacomaWorld is kind of the middle grounds/combination of the two sites, only Tacoma specific.
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:25 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Btnewman View Post
As far as a website goes, it is still a hobby job. I build for fun, and because I like seeing people enjoy what I build. I put a pile of hrs into a pair of sliders in my spare time. soon, I hope to do this full time, and move up from the hobby job status. but that is a hell of a leap as you know.
Its frustrating to see someone take what you have worked your ass off on, and call it their own design. who knows, we may have come up with similar designs at the same time. your stuff may be more "exact," I am jealous of that, I would love to have access to high dollar machinary, and that will come with time.
If someone wants a set of sliders that are "just strong enough" I wont argue with you, or them. thats fine, it's their truck. I personally, don't like problems, and when I build something, it will be to the best of my ability, if it fails, I will build it stronger and better. but I will do everything I can to prevent the first failure. I am not trying to stamp these out in mass numbers, like i said, I do this for fun. not to trump someone else.
I hear you man. We went through many prototypes and kept perfecting until we "got it right". We've hi-lifted off them with 600Ibs loads in the truck. No issues. We are not interested in mediocre or sub-par equipment, either. Totally with you on that man! I believe you have worked your ass off as have we. Sorry you think we ripped off your design but I assure you we've never seen any of your equipment until today. Keep working hard and don't settle!
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:34 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BradyT88 View Post
I've never felt that sliders are very heavy compared to most armor. In fact I think my are still lighter than my skids even. What do yours weigh? I am running BAMF sliders and I think they clock in about about 100lbs.

Rock Crawler and Expo seem to go hand in hand for most people on here as well, hell even you it sounds like, if you spend some time in Moab. So it's not apples to oranges for the majority of this site. Comparing Pirate4x4 to ExpeditionPortal would be apples to oranges. TacomaWorld is kind of the middle grounds/combination of the two sites, only Tacoma specific.
Exactly, we are probably more middle ground with a lean towards expedition. TW is a middle ground and we are Toyota enthusiasts so this is a great forum. Pure expo guys LOVE our rock sliders. Clearly, we get mixed reviews from the wheelin guys. I'm saying our rock sliders will hold up to either challenge. We know we will not be able to cater to everyone.

Our sliders weigh about 60Ibs each but they are a lot more steel than BAMF. BAMF is making some really great stuff!

Thanks for the awesome conversation guys! Keep it coming!
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:38 PM   #31
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I wish the best for you guys! And you guys do carry some some good stuff. When you see my stuff, I hope you see why I am a bit frustrated. But, I want to see everyone succeed, and you guys have a bit more retail stuff than I would ever want to deal with, I grew up in retail, and don't want anything to do with it. I personally, just want to build.
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:38 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by GOG View Post
Our sliders weigh about 60Ibs each but they are a lot more steel than BAMF. BAMF is making some really great stuff!
um... how can they be more steel if they are almost half the weight?
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:41 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by BradyT88 View Post
um... how can they be more steel if they are almost half the weight?
Oh, I thought you meant BAMF are 100lbs total...? They are 100lbs each? Our Rock Sliders are 60lbs/each, 120lbs total weight added to the truck. Again, this is a product of our expedition minds. We carry heavy loads and demand more slimline equipment that performs...because it all starts to add up and when a 15mpg truck starts to get 7mpg...that is no bueno on a 2000 mile trip!
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:44 PM   #34
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Holy geez! Mine are a bit heavier than that! No wonder my back always hurts...
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:49 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by GOG View Post
Oh, I thought you meant BAMF are 100lbs total...? They are 100lbs each? Our Rock Sliders are 60lbs/each, 120lbs total weight added to the truck. Again, this is a product of our expedition minds. We carry heavy loads and demand light weight equipment that performs...because it all starts to add up and when a 15mpg truck starts to get 7mpg...that is no bueno on a 2000 miles trip!
I thought you said those things were supposed to be on the light weight side? haha BAMF are like 100 pounds. Maybe 110lbs total with all the bolt-on hardware added in.
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:49 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Btnewman View Post
I wish the best for you guys! And you guys do carry some some good stuff. When you see my stuff, I hope you see why I am a bit frustrated. But, I want to see everyone succeed, and you guys have a bit more retail stuff than I would ever want to deal with, I grew up in retail, and don't want anything to do with it. I personally, just want to build.
Thanks man, and we wish the best for you! Don't be frustrated, use it to elevate your work and designs! Conceptually, we both have a similar approach to rock sliders but there are a lot of differences. Clearly, there will be people that love yours and people that love ours...no biggie!
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:54 PM   #37
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I thought you said those things were supposed to be on the light weight side? haha BAMF are like 100 pounds total. Maybe 110lbs total with all the bolt-on hardware added in.
Yup, that is what I said originally...our design has A LOT more steel than BAMF. Let me clearify. Because of our long steel plate that spans the truck, they are heavier than tube steel sliders (they always will be, more steel=more weight), but they are light for the design. The first prototypes we built were like 150lbs! So, we had to fix that. To us, 120lbs or less for rock sliders is well within expedition weight parameters.
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:59 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GOG View Post
Yup, that is what I said originally...our design has A LOT more steel than BAMF. Let me clearify. Because of our long steel plate that spans the truck, they are heavier than tube steel sliders (they always will be, more steel=more weight), but they are light for the design. The first prototypes we built were like 150lbs! So, we had to fix that...
So... why not go with a tube design, like BAMF's, that is not only lighter (more ideal for expo as you have said) and stronger, due to not having that long steel plate that is only 11ga? I just haven't seen steel plate under 3/16" fair well under our heavy rigs.
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Old 11-19-2013, 11:09 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by BradyT88 View Post
So... why not go with a tube design, like BAMF's, that is not only lighter (more ideal for expo as you have said) and stronger, due to not having that long steel plate that is only 11ga? I just haven't seen steel plate under 3/16" fair well under our heavy rigs.
Quite simply, we want more slimline design. Only 11ga? Trust me, these things are bombproof the way they are built.
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Old 11-19-2013, 11:11 PM   #40
Skinkwerks Rockware & Fabrication!!
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Quite simply, we want more slimline design.
Non-kickout tube sliders are pretty slimline still though.
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