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Expanding our deck from 120 SQ/FT to about 550 SQ/FT

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Old 07-29-2013, 12:18 PM   #61
Not very sporting to fire on an unarmed opponent.
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Originally Posted by BTR View Post
the question is now how the hell do I install the undersill trim
There isn't any siding below your ledger is there ?
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Old 07-29-2013, 01:36 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by BTR View Post
btw this is my first time building a deck, I learned everything so far from google, youtube, talking to people, and books. so if any pros out there see something then its ok to say something...

that being said I have no idea how to install vinyl railings... I'm especially concerned about the angles
Nice job. Only thing i would have done differently is double some of your joists that other joist are hanging off of. That angled area i would have only ran the rim at an angle, probably doubled it, and ran the joists in the same orientation as the common joists, mainly for fastening purposes and the spans assuming all your decking will be oriented in the same direction. Again, nice job! Vinyl railings are easy, you wont have any problem with them.
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Old 07-29-2013, 01:38 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by BTR View Post
the question is now how the hell do I install the undersill trim
I dont do much vinyl so i am no expert, but that type of undersill should be nailed on before you install the last course of siding.
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:17 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evanmb31 View Post
Nice job. Only thing i would have done differently is double some of your joists that other joist are hanging off of. That angled area i would have only ran the rim at an angle, probably doubled it, and ran the joists in the same orientation as the common joists, mainly for fastening purposes and the spans assuming all your decking will be oriented in the same direction. Again, nice job! Vinyl railings are easy, you wont have any problem with them.

yeah I hear what you are saying, the only thing is that the angled area was more of an after thought and once I started tinkering I quickly reached the point of no return.
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:19 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BamaToy1997 View Post
That stuff does look nice. Never used it before though. I always used regular wood decking. I can't wait to see how it looks when finished.



Maybe he can convert it into an escape hatch, and a small crawl space under the deck. lol

Thanks, its called rhino decking and its super heavy..... and solid each strip weighs 60+ lbs
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:21 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OZ-T View Post
I'm not a fan of composite but lots of people swear by it

How are you attaching it ? What brand is it ?
Rhino deck, each strip weighs 60+ lbs, I'm attaching it using the camo hidden fasteners method
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:27 PM   #67
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7-24-13

using my new led worklight



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Old 07-29-2013, 02:34 PM   #68
your TW web developer!
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nice work so far man. I just bought some of that composite decking for the underside of my built in bbq project and you're right it is very heavy
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:37 PM   #69
Not very sporting to fire on an unarmed opponent.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BTR View Post
Rhino deck, each strip weighs 60+ lbs, I'm attaching it using the camo hidden fasteners method
That decking is meant to use these fasteners , no ?

http://www.rhinodeck.com/main-nav/pr...-vision-clips/
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:42 PM   #70
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You can use multiple types. These screw up from the bottom
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:44 PM   #71
Not very sporting to fire on an unarmed opponent.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haslefre View Post
You can use multiple types. These screw up from the bottom
I've used that system on cedar

but grooved boards are meant to be held down with the clips which allows for linear expansion and contraction because unlike wood , composite expands and contracts in length too
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:55 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OZ-T View Post
I know that , like I posted before , cut the housewrap 1" above the ledger , tape the wrap to the sheathing , install flashing over the tape with the wall leg of the flashing under the upper housewrap

also : what good is flashing on the outside of the housewrap ? Is that really code there ? That's dumb
No, it's not really how code is. Here in Alabama, there isn't much code when doing your own contracting work. BUT that being said, I personally do not like the idea of cutting into existing house wrap if I can help it. So if I am modifying a home that has already been wrapped, I prefer adding the flashing as long as at least 4 inches of it is protruding up the wall to prevent "wicking" of moisture as much as possible. Even if moisture were to wick up, when it passed over the flashing it would still be caught by the existing moisture barrier. Of course in the OPs case, I see no signs of a house wrap at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BTR View Post
the question is now how the hell do I install the undersill trim
The undersill trim can be difficult in your case, since the bottom board is already installed. One option would require knowing how far up the board the lowest bolts are. If you remove the first 2 deck boards to get to the TOP of the board, and the board itself is bolted directly to the house, you can try this method (It takes a bit of work, but will help with making sure moisture stays out):

  1. Remove all of the bottom bolts that are bolting the joist to the house, leaving the top bolts in place.
  2. Slightly loosen the top bolts to allow a small amount of movement of the board.
  3. Slide the flashing behind the board from underneath.
  4. Reinstall the lower bolts, through the flashing and into the house.
  5. Tighten up the top bolts.
  6. seal all of the bolt heads that screw into the house.
Yes, this is a lot of work, but we are talking prevention to make the wood less prone to damage over the years.


Also remember that when slipping the flashing underneath the joist, overlap the pieces of flashing by 6 -8 inches, and apply a liberal bead of sealer onto the back of the next piece of flashing to help seal the overlap.
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:57 PM   #73
Not very sporting to fire on an unarmed opponent.
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Flashing is meant to keep the water that gets behind the siding from getting behind the housewrap or paper , putting it on top of either is pretty pointless except to direct the water that's already on the outside of the siding over the ledger

The white behind the siding isn't TYPAR ?

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Old 07-29-2013, 03:02 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OZ-T View Post
I've used that system on cedar

but grooved boards are meant to be held down with the clips which allows for linear expansion and contraction because unlike wood , composite expands and contracts in length too
I agree with OZ, the composite needs the fastener clips due to expansion. I have some experience with composite, the deck looks good so far and the PVC handrail is not difficult. I do think the OP might have some deflection when stepping on the boards due to the spacing of the joists especially on the diagonal run. Composite does not have the strength of 5/4 wood decking. Nothing to be concerned about though.
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Old 07-29-2013, 05:06 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OZ-T View Post
Flashing is meant to keep the water that gets behind the siding from getting behind the housewrap or paper , putting it on top of either is pretty pointless except to direct the water that's already on the outside of the siding over the ledger

The white behind the siding isn't TYPAR ?

I agree with this. But my method does this. From inside to outside is:
Sheething/houswrap/flashing/siding/floorjoist.

If the water DOES get behind the flashing, it WON'T get past the housewrap. Perhaps I am not explaining my thoughts well enough? Hard to explain in text, but if you look at the photo that I first posted it shows how it all comes together, and prevents any moisture that DOES get past the flashing from getting to the house.
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Old 07-29-2013, 05:18 PM   #76
Not very sporting to fire on an unarmed opponent.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BamaToy1997 View Post
I agree with this. But my method does this. From inside to outside is:
Sheething/houswrap/flashing/siding/floorjoist.

If the water DOES get behind the flashing, it WON'T get past the housewrap. Perhaps I am not explaining my thoughts well enough? Hard to explain in text, but if you look at the photo that I first posted it shows how it all comes together, and prevents any moisture that DOES get past the flashing from getting to the house.
I hear what you are saying Bill and I'm not trying to sound like a total A hole , that just wouldn't pass any code we have here .

Water can't get behind the flashing the way I explained it unless it is already behind the housewrap

Up here we also have to have a 10mm rainscreen drainage cavity between the siding and the " primary drainage plane " which is your housewrap or paper , and all flashings must have a 4" wall leg behind the paper above , lapped shingle style ( ie top course over bottom course ) and all flashings must have 1" end dams on them



Carry on
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Old 07-29-2013, 05:55 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OZ-T View Post
That decking is meant to use these fasteners , no ?

http://www.rhinodeck.com/main-nav/pr...-vision-clips/
Quote:
Originally Posted by SH7mi View Post
I agree with OZ, the composite needs the fastener clips due to expansion. I have some experience with composite, the deck looks good so far and the PVC handrail is not difficult. I do think the OP might have some deflection when stepping on the boards due to the spacing of the joists especially on the diagonal run. Composite does not have the strength of 5/4 wood decking. Nothing to be concerned about though.

yes i noticed this as well so i added a few scrap blocks in between the diagonal runs to help with that
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Old 07-29-2013, 05:59 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BamaToy1997 View Post
No, it's not really how code is. Here in Alabama, there isn't much code when doing your own contracting work. BUT that being said, I personally do not like the idea of cutting into existing house wrap if I can help it. So if I am modifying a home that has already been wrapped, I prefer adding the flashing as long as at least 4 inches of it is protruding up the wall to prevent "wicking" of moisture as much as possible. Even if moisture were to wick up, when it passed over the flashing it would still be caught by the existing moisture barrier. Of course in the OPs case, I see no signs of a house wrap at all.



The undersill trim can be difficult in your case, since the bottom board is already installed. One option would require knowing how far up the board the lowest bolts are. If you remove the first 2 deck boards to get to the TOP of the board, and the board itself is bolted directly to the house, you can try this method (It takes a bit of work, but will help with making sure moisture stays out):

  1. Remove all of the bottom bolts that are bolting the joist to the house, leaving the top bolts in place.
  2. Slightly loosen the top bolts to allow a small amount of movement of the board.
  3. Slide the flashing behind the board from underneath.
  4. Reinstall the lower bolts, through the flashing and into the house.
  5. Tighten up the top bolts.
  6. seal all of the bolt heads that screw into the house.
Yes, this is a lot of work, but we are talking prevention to make the wood less prone to damage over the years.
to
dig in
Also remember that when slipping the flashing underneath the joist, overlap the pieces of flashing by 6 -8 inches, and apply a liberal bead of sealer onto the back of the next piece of flashing to help seal the overlap.
hmmm. might not be horrible. the first floorboard isnt permanently secured so i might be able to take a closer look
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Old 07-30-2013, 06:48 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BamaToy1997 View Post
You can also try this stuff, which will help you out. Remember, an ounce of prevention....

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...SIN=B000IUL9NO



This is instead of flashing correct? do they have something similar to this at a local home improvement store?
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Old 07-30-2013, 10:02 AM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OZ-T View Post
I hear what you are saying Bill and I'm not trying to sound like a total A hole , that just wouldn't pass any code we have here .

Water can't get behind the flashing the way I explained it unless it is already behind the housewrap

Up here we also have to have a 10mm rainscreen drainage cavity between the siding and the " primary drainage plane " which is your housewrap or paper , and all flashings must have a 4" wall leg behind the paper above , lapped shingle style ( ie top course over bottom course ) and all flashings must have 1" end dams on them



Carry on
No worries. I know you weren't trying to be rude or anything. I can see in my mind what you are talking about. I am honestly curious why it wouldn't pass code my way, but then again I have seen some REALLY strange code, like when I lived in hurricane prone Florida! lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BTR View Post
This is instead of flashing correct? do they have something similar to this at a local home improvement store?
You CAN use it instead of flashing, but to be honest, I would use both since you are working on existing construction. But that is just me, I tend to overdo things when working on my house. For example when the inspector came to my house in Florida after I installed an add-on roof to the back deck he was laughing so hard it was crazy. I asked him why he was laughing. He responded by saying something to the tune of "I think the house would lift off the foundation before this additional roof separated from the existing one!"
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