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Old 02-03-2010, 04:03 PM   #1
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House committee demands answers from Toyota

http://www.egmcartech.com/2010/02/03...s-from-toyota/

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The House Oversight and Government Reform Committee wants to know why Toyota has yet to extend its recall to pedals made by a second supplier. The committee is set to hold hearings on the issue of February 10.
Rep. John Dingell, D-Dearborn, has also sent letters to Toyota and the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration raising questions about the government’s response to the issue, and also citing the fact that there have been reported incidents as early as 2007 regarding the issue of sticking accelerators. Dingell also raised the issue as to whether the NHTSA had sufficient resources and authority to carry out an investigation.
There have also reportedly been over 100 complaints of sudden acceleration documented since 2007 with regard to the Toyota Tacoma, according to the NHTSA, though Toyota says that the Tacoma is equipped with a different pedal assembly that has not been implicated in the recent issues.

Toyota has issued a statement indicating that unless drivers detect pedal problems, they should feel fully confidant in driving their vehicles.
It has also been suggested by some, Apple Inc. co-founder Steve Wozniak included, that faulty on board computer systems are to blame for the issues, and not floor mats or gas pedals as has been said.
-By: Stephen Calogera
Source: Detroit News
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Old 02-03-2010, 07:46 PM   #2
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I think this is totally legit and I anxiously wait to hear what Toyota has to say under pressure.

The information they told govn't officials is significantly different than what they are telling the public. Why?

I thought the issue with Tacoma accelerating was having to do with the AC unit activating and hence causing a small jump in RPM..
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Old 02-03-2010, 07:50 PM   #3
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It'll be interesting to see what they say, as ywen said.

But throughout this whole uproar, I have come to believe that the Feds are finding every small flaw in Toyotas and Hondas because they are foreign, and because they are still doing well in this economy, unlike Government Motors. Don't you think it's hard to believe that a GM vehicle doesn't have any similar problems?
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Old 02-03-2010, 08:10 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chadmb2003 View Post
It'll be interesting to see what they say, as ywen said.

But throughout this whole uproar, I have come to believe that the Feds are finding every small flaw in Toyotas and Hondas because they are foreign, and because they are still doing well in this economy, unlike Government Motors. Don't you think it's hard to believe that a GM vehicle doesn't have any similar problems?
40% of all sudden acceleration claims made in the US were against Toyota models. If Toyota had 40% marketshare in the US, then that'd be fine... but they don't, far from it and that's why this is such a major deal.
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Old 02-03-2010, 08:21 PM   #5
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may i try to shed some light to the recall subject. i am a toyota tech (5yrs). we just started dealing with the recalls. they will be in 3 phases.
1- the 100 or so complaints are not confirmed. a solid majority are customers who come in reading other info and not taking into regard that not everything from the media is true. they see a possible recall and think $$$ and get sue-crazy. i have personally had to work on only 2 cars with this accel.pedal complaint -- the main thing is that Not One has been confirmed to be stuck or sticking. nor are there any tell tale signs of it.
--the ECM's have built-in protocols in the event of an emergency. if there are mixed signals in any of the related operating sys, it will go immediately into default mode and restrict vehicle performance. example - TPS not reading Pedal Pos.sensor through ECM =cut power, loss of accel ability, default, MIL turns on.
2- i think its a conspiracy by "The Big Three" and the govt. why is it that all of a sudden the Feds and the chief transportation dude issue a public statement on the behalf of Toyota (of which they have no right) and tell everyone to immediately stop driving their cars? we never heard such publicity when Ford's tires were blowing up, when their engine harnesses would catch on fire, etc.
--- the main reason why pedals are sticking is because dumb *F* who have junk all over the floors and dont keep their cars clean, and have a floormat to cover another floormat so the other OEM floormat doesnt get dirty..... hence the sticking pedal.
The Feds are trying to strong arm Toyota because they still selling cars and did not have to file bankruptcy or bailout, have good resale value, and are dominating market in this economy. They want the American public to buy "Domestic" so as to help boost the economy and promote sales of domestic vehicles. You dont hear any other Asian car manufacturer offering deals for new cars, to trade in your toyotas... its all domestic markets.
i think thats what it is.
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Old 02-03-2010, 08:36 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tacobo670 View Post
may i try to shed some light to the recall subject. i am a toyota tech (5yrs). we just started dealing with the recalls. they will be in 3 phases.
1- the 100 or so complaints are not confirmed. a solid majority are customers who come in reading other info and not taking into regard that not everything from the media is true. they see a possible recall and think $$$ and get sue-crazy. i have personally had to work on only 2 cars with this accel.pedal complaint -- the main thing is that Not One has been confirmed to be stuck or sticking. nor are there any tell tale signs of it.
--the ECM's have built-in protocols in the event of an emergency. if there are mixed signals in any of the related operating sys, it will go immediately into default mode and restrict vehicle performance. example - TPS not reading Pedal Pos.sensor through ECM =cut power, loss of accel ability, default, MIL turns on.
2- i think its a conspiracy by "The Big Three" and the govt. why is it that all of a sudden the Feds and the chief transportation dude issue a public statement on the behalf of Toyota (of which they have no right) and tell everyone to immediately stop driving their cars? we never heard such publicity when Ford's tires were blowing up, when their engine harnesses would catch on fire, etc.
--- the main reason why pedals are sticking is because dumb *F* who have junk all over the floors and dont keep their cars clean, and have a floormat to cover another floormat so the other OEM floormat doesnt get dirty..... hence the sticking pedal.
The Feds are trying to strong arm Toyota because they still selling cars and did not have to file bankruptcy or bailout, have good resale value, and are dominating market in this economy. They want the American public to buy "Domestic" so as to help boost the economy and promote sales of domestic vehicles. You dont hear any other Asian car manufacturer offering deals for new cars, to trade in your toyotas... its all domestic markets.
i think thats what it is.
Serious?

I can understand brand loyalty... to an extend.

Talk about conspiracy theories.. the general consensus amongst conspiracy theorists prior to this is that there exist some "back door" relationship between consumer reports and Toyota.. Hence the consistently excellent ratings they give to Toyota vehicles. That being said, CR has revealed 40% of ALL sudden acceleration claims are on Toyota vehicles, with only 16% market share

http://blogs.consumerreports.org/car...s-ford-gm.html

So the possibilities are:

A) Toyota owners are generally more of a dumbass than the industry average. These are the folks who keep shit on the floor cluttering up the gas pedal. So much stuff such that it causes sudden acceleration... *snickers*
B) The average intelligence/behavior of Toyota drivers is on par with drivers of the other brands. Thus the disproportionate 40% claim of sudden acceleration issues points to a problem with Toyota designed vehicles.

Option B makes sense to me. You can't argue against statistics.

You cited the intended functionality of the ECM unit. I don't doubt that you have more working knowledge of the ECM unit than myself. However, I also know that as a toyota tech, you don't have access to or knowledge of the assembly level code that is written into the ECM unit. A software bug by definition is an "unintended error/failure"
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Old 02-03-2010, 09:00 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tacobo670 View Post
may i try to shed some light to the recall subject. i am a toyota tech (5yrs). we just started dealing with the recalls. they will be in 3 phases.
1- the 100 or so complaints are not confirmed. a solid majority are customers who come in reading other info and not taking into regard that not everything from the media is true. they see a possible recall and think $$$ and get sue-crazy. i have personally had to work on only 2 cars with this accel.pedal complaint -- the main thing is that Not One has been confirmed to be stuck or sticking. nor are there any tell tale signs of it.
--the ECM's have built-in protocols in the event of an emergency. if there are mixed signals in any of the related operating sys, it will go immediately into default mode and restrict vehicle performance. example - TPS not reading Pedal Pos.sensor through ECM =cut power, loss of accel ability, default, MIL turns on.
2- i think its a conspiracy by "The Big Three" and the govt. why is it that all of a sudden the Feds and the chief transportation dude issue a public statement on the behalf of Toyota (of which they have no right) and tell everyone to immediately stop driving their cars? we never heard such publicity when Ford's tires were blowing up, when their engine harnesses would catch on fire, etc.
--- the main reason why pedals are sticking is because dumb *F* who have junk all over the floors and dont keep their cars clean, and have a floormat to cover another floormat so the other OEM floormat doesnt get dirty..... hence the sticking pedal.
The Feds are trying to strong arm Toyota because they still selling cars and did not have to file bankruptcy or bailout, have good resale value, and are dominating market in this economy. They want the American public to buy "Domestic" so as to help boost the economy and promote sales of domestic vehicles. You dont hear any other Asian car manufacturer offering deals for new cars, to trade in your toyotas... its all domestic markets.
i think thats what it is.
Perception is reality. If people think their gas pedal is sticking and tell the world about it, Toyota better fix it or prove they are wrong.

Toyota has the burden of proof here, and if they don't act quickly they will lose billions .
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Old 02-04-2010, 06:06 AM   #8
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Hey Tacobo: You still think Toyota has no fault and it's Government Motors going after them? http://www.autoblog.com/2010/02/04/t...nown/#comments

LOL.. Toyota = Epic Fail. . I really hope the resale on my Tacoma doesn't go down..
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Old 02-04-2010, 06:15 AM   #9
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When I found that all the manufactures were using computers and the brakes for vehicle stability control and traction control and anti lock brakes, and now also the Diffs.
I asked what happens when the car experiences the equivalent of the the blue screen of death...I guess we now know.
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Old 02-04-2010, 06:20 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wht09taco View Post
When I found that all the manufactures were using computers and the brakes for vehicle stability control and traction control and anti lock brakes, and now also the Diffs.
I asked what happens when the car experiences the equivalent of the the blue screen of death...I guess we now know.
Not to say these kind of issues can't happen to other cars.. But as of right now.. these issues are only happening to Toyota (or at least most reported against Toyotas) So it's easy to target them for now...
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Old 02-04-2010, 06:30 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ywen View Post
Hey Tacobo: You still think Toyota has no fault and it's Government Motors going after them? http://www.autoblog.com/2010/02/04/t...nown/#comments

LOL.. Toyota = Epic Fail. . I really hope the resale on my Tacoma doesn't go down..
Yeah the Prius recall. It's a conspiracy too. Now that the professors of academia have abandoned their Saabs and flocked to a Prius we have to save Saab somehow.
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Old 02-04-2010, 01:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tacobo670 View Post
2- i think its a conspiracy by "The Big Three" and the govt. why is it that all of a sudden the Feds and the chief transportation dude issue a public statement on the behalf of Toyota (of which they have no right) and tell everyone to immediately stop driving their cars? we never heard such publicity when Ford's tires were blowing up, when their engine harnesses would catch on fire, etc.
At least im not the only one. +1 to you bro
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Old 02-04-2010, 10:43 PM   #13
if you have to ask, u can't afford it
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fords were blowing up and catching fire. chevys would fall apart and the trans' would sh!t themselves. they filed for bankruptcy, bailout, and shut down stores -- still no major "problems...?
i saw the story that started this whole thing, about a police officer who was driving and crashed and killed several members of his family. (very sad) - due to the sticking pedal. i wonder is, how did he have enough time to make a call to 911 about the situation. and what officer does not know how to operate a vehicle in an emergency situation? im just saying.
plus the prius has 2 braking systems. its redundant. all cars have these. if hydraulics fail then there is still a "hardline" to brake.
but then again i think cars in general are getting to technical. too many sensors and such. much more things to go wrong.
btw... whats a carburetor?
i think i rather hit a car or a wall than have my car explode in front of my face.
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Old 02-05-2010, 12:55 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tacobo670 View Post
i saw the story that started this whole thing, about a police officer who was driving and crashed and killed several members of his family. (very sad) - due to the sticking pedal. i wonder is, how did he have enough time to make a call to 911 about the situation. and what officer does not know how to operate a vehicle in an emergency situation? im just saying.
What's the point of questioning the driver and situation? Unless you think that story was fabricated as well? The fact is, the car decided to have a mind of its own. As a driver, that is LAST thing you expect. Who knows - maybe he was in traffic at the time and it surprised him and he concentrated on avoiding obstacles in front of him and screaming passengers around him just made it worse and he didn't have time to think straight? BTW, he didn't make the phone call, it was a passenger in the car that called 911.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tacobo670 View Post
plus the prius has 2 braking systems. its redundant. all cars have these. if hydraulics fail then there is still a "hardline" to brake.
Okay, I guess you do'nt want to understand the issue, maybe that's why many dealerships failed to regard these claims from Prius owners..

The issue is not with the brake system failing. It has to do with the complexity of the regenative (sp?) brake system working with the traditional brake system. Software glitch causes a momentary delay between the hand off from the regen to the traditional. Besides,, Toyota has alraedy admitted to a software issue with the brake system. So how in the world can you still sit there and argue that nothing is wrong? WOW.... fanboism..
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Old 02-05-2010, 01:11 AM   #15
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Steve Jobs sent a report to the Toyota Mucks and informed them the issue sounded more like a Software problem to him and of course, they did not want to hear that, especially coming from Steve Jobs. When actually they would have looked much better to the General Public by accepting his help which would show the public they are truly interested in finding the Problem and Solution, instead of making things up to hush the public, like a dirty floor mat. I thought for sure Toyota would make an announcement saying its not their fault, the vehicles that have the gas pedal problem is due because to Tall of Americans driving their cars and they will issue a Recall to have the seats adjusted back a little.
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Old 02-05-2010, 06:34 AM   #17
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Can't wait for these documents to come out.. Toyota will go down big time once that happens. Where there's smoke, there's fire.

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...,7374631.story
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Old 02-05-2010, 06:47 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocket View Post
Steve Jobs sent a report to the Toyota Mucks and informed them the issue sounded more like a Software problem to him and of course, they did not want to hear that, especially coming from Steve Jobs. When actually they would have looked much better to the General Public by accepting his help which would show the public they are truly interested in finding the Problem and Solution, instead of making things up to hush the public, like a dirty floor mat. I thought for sure Toyota would make an announcement saying its not their fault, the vehicles that have the gas pedal problem is due because to Tall of Americans driving their cars and they will issue a Recall to have the seats adjusted back a little.
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a little late for me
http://gizmodo.com/5462205/steve-woz...prius-problems
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Old 02-05-2010, 09:06 PM   #19
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the story is wat it is, a story. as a driver - a good safe driver, u should be aware of ur vehicle and whats going on in/around u, know wat to do in an emergency situation. steve wosniak has access to toyota's software? prius braking -there is no "hand-off" . the mg1 mg2 are always acting on the engine causing regen and engine braking. when u depress the brake pedal thats all on its own. if anything the delay would be to route the regen power to recharge the HV battery.
besides i just came back from japan and the toyota reps took me to all the coolest bars. but they said its nothing to worry about. the corp is just buying time so GM and the others can catch up. plus i still get paid either way. its hard setting the pace/standard every year. lol
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