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Old 01-29-2008, 09:38 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by gdawg25 View Post
I can't even imagine being so concerned about my safety that I would need to or want to carry a weapon or have one at my bed side.
Is it true you can't have a handgun much less a permit to carry where you live? Must be nice to trust your government and local athorities that much. I'm of the mindset it is better to have protection from whatever and pray to GOD you never have to use it than to believe fate is on your side.
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Old 01-29-2008, 09:52 PM   #42
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I plan to get my CCW in a little under 2 months, which is when i turn 21. Right now i own 4 firearms and depending on where i am, carry my glock with me.
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Old 01-30-2008, 06:56 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by ZonKs View Post
Guns are tools. Contrary to popular belief, they do not turn their otherwise levelheaded owners into violent, heartless killers, ready to mow down puppies and babies at the drop of a hat.
I completely agree...blaming guns for violence is like blaming spoons and forks for Rosie O'Donnell being fat...saw that on some bumper sticker once, but it's completely true.
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Old 01-30-2008, 09:49 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by stratton View Post
Its because of the free healthcare up there. People need to steal and rob to afford it down here in the states. But I will take expense of healthcare any day in order to be considered a real country with a miltary force more then a few guys throwing snow balls on horses.
Thats funny...Canada is the only country to have ever defeated the US in a war and we burned down the white house too!

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Old 01-30-2008, 12:22 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by concrete jedi View Post
Thanks Stratton I'll get up with you (p.m) and we'll see what is all involved. I would also like some direction from you on where to look at the laws concerning this issue of protection of self and property. It is pretty disturbing what happened in Florida, protecting ones self and ones property is legally challenging, not to end up in jail for doing so. One side of me says shame on you for trying to steal or hurt me, so here comes the lead ! ... the other side of me says is it really worth killing a man for taking something from me that I can replace from the store. Is it up to me to extinguish this person (who is no good to the bone), what are the ramifications ? lifetime of guilt ? sleepless nights of thought, remorse ? who knows how it would change me, what scares me the most if it didn't change me. I have I become as calloused as the man I took ? I think going through the legal process, the searching through your history, registering with the state, this is the easy part, living with the end result is when it become difficult.
Heres how i feel about shooting someone who is robbing your house. They say no object is worth taking a life over. ok i can buy that. but think about this. a guy breaks into your house and since he is "just robbing you" you dont shoot him since you dont want to take a life over material goods. so you call the cops but he is long gone before the cops get there. Next week he robs another house. This time he is startled by a dad or mom or even worse, a child and he shoots one of them. Now an innocent law abiding citizen has lost his or her life because a criminal was allowed to continue to wander the streets. my opinion, is if someone could even POSSIBLY be a threat then you should have the right to put them down if they are on your property. Thats just one scenerio, not probably but possible. Breaking the law is a choice and in choosing to do so you realize the risks. if you dont want to get shot, dont rob or mug people, if you do, you deserve what you get. i think its total BS that you have to prove your life was in danger after you kill someone in your own home.
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Old 01-30-2008, 12:25 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by concrete jedi View Post
Yeah, but after that; the damage is done and irreversible, all you have now is a mean, scared, monster who wants his revenge, I would be one myself. Yes maybe a weapon would have prevented this from happening. When you hear of such atrocities, yeah you want a gun. Now you have a guy who finds his wife is cheating on him, yes it's wrong, and he is angry, justifiable. He gets a gun, finds both of them, shoots and kills both of them. Now what ? Does it escalate from there ? what if there were kids ? it all gets very cloudy. I think what I am getting at is: in for a penny...in for a pound. I still lean on self protection, but it does get messy.
I'll take messy over helpless any day
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Old 01-30-2008, 12:27 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZonKs View Post
Guns are tools. Contrary to popular belief, they do not turn their otherwise levelheaded owners into violent, heartless killers, ready to mow down puppies and babies at the drop of a hat. Firearms teach both self reliance and personal responsibility. Some of the most polite, responsible people i have ever met have been at the range with large caliber weapons in their hands. The sport of shooting teaches discipline and patience. It is an extremely difficult sport, and it can be positive influence in a persons life. Those who argue this have most likely never tried to put 5 shots into a 6" bull at 600 yds., much less even handled a firearm. I have owned firearms for about 15 years now; Ive been raging mad plenty of times since then and it never once crossed my mind to get a gun and start shooting. Dont believe the bull**** you hear on the news, etc. Try it for yourself and make up your own mind. Firearms are to be shot and properly cleaned, not feared.
Amen
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Old 01-30-2008, 12:39 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stratton View Post
The bottom line is that the bad guys will be able to get guns no matter what. Even if they all were banned, they still would get them, and there would be more crimes committed in order to get one.
You can look at the stats in England and New Zealand and Australian to back that statement up. in countries that ban guns, the crime rate jumps drastically right after the date of the ban. Plus any tyrant run regime was started by disarming the people. At different points in history in Japan and England swords were illegal. citizens that cant fight back are citizens that are easy to take advantage of. I dont remember who said it but i love the quote "citizens should not fear the government, governments should fear the citizens"
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Originally Posted by 350TacoZilla View Post
When Guns Are Outlawed I Become An OUTLAW

.... true as any statement you will ever hear... 2 gun cabinets full 1 gun safe full and many more planned buying a gun is like money in bank...more laws they come out with to restrict them...more the old ones are worth
this is why you could sell a used gun for above or at its market value during the Clinton years. People would pay more for a used gun in good shape than a new one. that way they are not on any record and the government cant track you down if they ever outlaw guns. My dad sold multiple guns for same price as a new one
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Old 01-30-2008, 12:48 PM   #49
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the only reason i have an alarm system in my house is to wake me up if someone breaks in so i can shoot them. i'll never know why they broke in because their story will never be told. if they are there to rob, pillage, rape, etc, it doesn't matter. if 9 out 10 buglers where shot dead during break ins, can you imagine how many less break ins there would be??? that would be awesome.
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Old 01-30-2008, 04:13 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by L_Jackson View Post
the only reason i have an alarm system in my house is to wake me up if someone breaks in so i can shoot them. i'll never know why they broke in because their story will never be told. if they are there to rob, pillage, rape, etc, it doesn't matter. if 9 out 10 buglers where shot dead during break ins, can you imagine how many less break ins there would be??? that would be awesome.

amen!!
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Old 01-30-2008, 04:36 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ndcouch View Post
Heres how i feel about shooting someone who is robbing your house. They say no object is worth taking a life over. ok i can buy that. but think about this. a guy breaks into your house and since he is "just robbing you" you dont shoot him since you dont want to take a life over material goods. so you call the cops but he is long gone before the cops get there. Next week he robs another house. This time he is startled by a dad or mom or even worse, a child and he shoots one of them. Now an innocent law abiding citizen has lost his or her life because a criminal was allowed to continue to wander the streets. my opinion, is if someone could even POSSIBLY be a threat then you should have the right to put them down if they are on your property. Thats just one scenerio, not probably but possible. Breaking the law is a choice and in choosing to do so you realize the risks. if you dont want to get shot, dont rob or mug people, if you do, you deserve what you get. i think its total BS that you have to prove your life was in danger after you kill someone in your own home.
Everything you said I also feel has weight and is valid. "How dare they come into my house and steal from me" but as you said, the laws are against the good guys, what to do ?
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Old 01-30-2008, 04:48 PM   #52
My other ride weighs 200 tons
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That's why it is called the criminal justice system. Honest people get it either way. In court for helping the cops out or by working and paying taxes so the ones that do get caught can eat three meals a day.
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Old 01-30-2008, 05:33 PM   #53
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One important thing is to make sure that, if it does come down to pulling the trigger, you don't stop until there is no chance he's getting up. Much harder for the family to press bullsh!t charges if the criminal isn't sitting there whining about how much their leg still hurts and how they weren't going to hurt you. They were just warning shots...

Can't complain from 6ft down.
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Old 01-31-2008, 07:06 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by concrete jedi View Post
Everything you said I also feel has weight and is valid. "How dare they come into my house and steal from me" but as you said, the laws are against the good guys, what to do ?
That's only sort of true in SC...if someone's in your house uninvited, and you catch them there, you have the right to shoot to kill them. The former attorney general said years ago, and I've had numerous solicitors (criminal prosecutors) tell me that if someone has broken the threshold of your home, uninvited, they absolutely will not prosecute unless you somehow lured them in or it can be shown/proven that you had a reason to know that they were no threat to you or anyone else in the house. The presumption is that if someone is in your house, you feel as if your life is in danger, and therefore, you can shoot them in "self-defense." That's true whether they have a gun or not, generally. The justification is not that you're protecting your belongings, but rather that you are protecting your person or someone else's.
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Old 01-31-2008, 07:28 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by 2003greenbean View Post
i have my cwp i have a kel tec 380 but in sc you dont have to have a cwp to carry in your car
You like that keltec? i had a p-11 and man what a piece of sh|t feed failures/ jam/stove pipe /etc... never had or fired the 380 Hmmmmmm,...
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Old 01-31-2008, 07:30 AM   #56
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I too have the Kel-Tec 3AT, but have had some of the same experiences as you with jams, etc. I got one of the PF-9's recently, and have, thus far, not had those problems with about 500+/- rounds through it.
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Old 01-31-2008, 07:37 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by argm31i View Post
I too have the Kel-Tec 3AT, but have had some of the same experiences as you with jams, etc. I got one of the PF-9's recently, and have, thus far, not had those problems with about 500+/- rounds through it.
yeah the PF-9 looks pretty sweet however i still have a bad taste in my mouth from my first experience with keltec.. Since i traded the p-11 off for a glock 23
and haven't looked back yet these guns CAN take a beating and keep.. ..
well you know the rest
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Old 01-31-2008, 07:42 AM   #58
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I know what you mean about having a bad taste...I "grew up" with Glocks...have a 23 as a matter of fact, also...but, the PF-9 was so small, and it's got about the smallest round I prefer to use for my primary carry pistol (9mm), so when I saw one on sale for about $200 I figured that I could buy it, and even if I didn't like it, I could still at least get my money back. So far, I'm pleased, but still skeptical (i.e. - I haven't actually started carrying it yet) and likely will remain so until I get at least 1,000 rounds through it without a jam, etc.
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Old 01-31-2008, 07:49 AM   #59
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cool , btw $200 is not bad for a 9mm, i didnt realize it was THAT inexpensive
However i will give Keltec A five star rating for customer service they are proly the best i've ever experienced!! last weekend i shot this at the range and was very impressed ahhhh the possibilities.......

<IMG src="http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/images/big/su16A_01.jpg=">

linky: http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/images/big/su16A_01.jpg
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Old 01-31-2008, 07:54 AM   #60
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It was a good price ("gun show only" and it had a slight nick on the slide - barely noticeable), but I think they're normally around $280. Your experience with their customer service is similar to what I've heard about them before, apparently they really stand behind their products no matter what.
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