Did Weapons Fail U.S. Troops During Afghanistan Assault?

[PackerfanXD]

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LWRC AR15 bites the Dust
An overview with pictures

This is a 10.5” (SBR) Litner Wise, well it is a LWRC, (Land Warfare Resources Corporation), Which is formerly the Leitner-Wise Rifle Company. We put this rifle in the dirt to test it's function under extreme conditions. Not only did it work, it worked flawlessly each time we preformed the test

We were out at the local shooting spot and decided to see how much abuse this strong, reliable AR15 could take. It took all we gave it and worked through all our tests

The configuration tested. 1. A stock of some kind 2. A V-TAC sling 3. Some kind of an EOtech optic 4 Surefire vert grip w/ lights

To start we gently put the rifle on the ground

After it landed we started the dust portion of the test

Kicking fine dust and dirt into most AR15s is going to stop them from working well for the most part. Although this treatment is not recommended for any rifles.. or most anything else for that matter

Kicking dirt on to most of the gun, not the barrel of course, but being sure to hit the receiver

The gas vents from a hole under the handguards, so extra dirt was kicked here to attempt a failure

Once it was covered in dust we tested function.

A quick slap to remove most of the dust was all to get ready for shooting

Dust was still falling from the rifle as the first test shots were taken.

This LWRC functioned perfectly, with no failures. All the extra dust was thrown off the rifle with the first few shots

Aside from the momentary cloud of dust that stopped after a few shots there was no sign this rifle had been covered in dust just moments before. This kind of reliability is typically thought to be available from only an AK47, but this LWRC may do a lot to change that

After the testing the rifle was dirty but working well. The EOtech needed a cleaning, but was still operable as well. A lens cover for the light and rubber boots over the LEDs kept the lenses in good shape. Nothing else on this AR was effected by our testing. (Our testers face is blurred so that if he ever meets the guys at LWRC they won't know what he did to one of their rifles

For our testing this day we went through every barrel cap we brought with to the range. They are designed to cover the barrel and crown from dirt, rocks and even water to some extent. They are simply plastic so they can be shot through if needed. Here's what they look like before and after

Will this LWRC gas piston AR15 end the debate on which is better the AR15 vs the AK47 ??

[Jmartin89]

Its not that the M4 is a bad weapon it is the shit but its just that the M4 that we are getting issued are used up and just had to many rounds fired through them the M4 i have now has been through 3 maybe more tours through iraq who knows how many rounds have went through i know ive fired a fair share and thats not counting whats been shot through it back at ranges in garrison

[PackerfanXD]

Originally Posted by Jmartin89

Its not that the M4 is a bad weapon it is the shit but its just that the M4 that we are getting issued are used up and just had to many rounds fired through them the M4 i have now has been through 3 maybe more tours through iraq who knows how many rounds have went through i know ive fired a fair share and thats not counting whats been shot through it back at ranges in garrison

Excellent observation.

[AVTOMAT]

LWRC=the shit.Our troops have been screwed since McNamara and the "whiz kids" pushed this crap through , IMO.Why did Stoner not use the direct gas again?

[chris4x4]

Originally Posted by johnecon2001

I have no idea the conditions and free time and maintenance training available over there.. but there is a lot to be said for cleaning and maintaining your weapon. Part of me thinks it may not just be a poor design, but also a lack of proper care.
Again, not to shift blame off the weapon, but the article does mention needing a lot of maintenance (dirty?), a lot of that could be fixed by breaking the weapon down and cleaning it.

I think this is precisely what may be causing the malfunctions over there, however, when one is on a 2 way shooting range, things as basic as weapon maintinance are quickly overlooked. That and Im sure they are not counting the rounds fired to know when to propperly lube parts of the rifle. As far as Im concerned, a "Battle ready" weapon, is one in which it will fire every time that trigger is pulled...regardless if it has been 2000 rounds since it was last cleaned.

[Turb0wned]

What the u.s needs to use are AK-47's. I bet that won't fail.

[PackerfanXD]

Originally Posted by Turb0wned

What the u.s needs to use are AK-47's. I bet that won't fail.

The military actually wants to hit what they're aiming for.

[Jmartin89]

Originally Posted by chris4x4

I think this is precisely what may be causing the malfunctions over there, however, when one is on a 2 way shooting range, things as basic as weapon maintinance are quickly overlooked. That and Im sure they are not counting the rounds fired to know when to propperly lube parts of the rifle. As far as Im concerned, a "Battle ready" weapon, is one in which it will fire every time that trigger is pulled...regardless if it has been 2000 rounds since it was last cleaned.

after every mission we strip are weapons down clean and lube them

[Turb0wned]

Originally Posted by PackerfanXD

The military actually wants to hit what they're aiming for.

LOL. Let me tell you people say an AK isn't accurate which is wrong. Now im not saying its as accurate as an m4 or anything but people have this wrong thought about it. The reason why these iraq fucks can't hit anything with it is because all the do is hold the fun in between there arm and rib area and start spraying everywhere instead of aiming.

[PackerfanXD]

Originally Posted by Turb0wned

LOL. Let me tell you people say an AK isn't accurate which is wrong. Now im not saying its as accurate as an m4 or anything but people have this wrong thought about it. The reason why these iraq fucks can't hit anything with it is because all the do is hold the fun in between there arm and rib area and start spraying everywhere instead of aiming.

I've shot both and seen both side by side at the range at 200yds and there is no comparison in accuracy. The AK from a bench barely hits paper at that distance.

[WNYTACOMA]

Originally Posted by fghtngsquirrel

That SCAR is a badass weapon. Danger Room reported that this would eventually replace the M4, but it comes down to $$... BS.

If the government is going to overcharge us taxpayers, i would rather it be for something our enlisted guys (and gals) can count on in the field.

It is inexcuseable that faulty equipment should cost lives (or limbs) on a regular basis.

This is the stuff that really pisses you off.

[bambooshoots]

Pistons are not be-all end-all.

The barrels and chambers still get hot.

Cookoffs are still possible.

I don't think that in the situation stated above a piston design would have fared any better. I seems more of a training issue. I've done 10 mags before in the same timeframe stated in the article and haven't had any issues.

I would also think that the weapons over there are getting old and beat up by now. I've heard some SAWs being in service so long that they constantly have problems.

Keep the weapon clean, lubed and use it like the way it was designed to be used ie, a individual rifle/carbine, not a LMG.

[bambooshoots]

Originally Posted by PackerfanXD

The military actually wants to hit what they're aiming for.

If you want to test that theory please hand me an AK magazine and hold a target 300 yards downrange.

[johnw]

they need this or this

[Hoyal]

Originally Posted by Turb0wned

What the u.s needs to use are AK-47's. I bet that won't fail.

The scar has a trigger pack to be able to shoot the 7.62 round as well as the 223, and 556.

My dad and brother both were on a team that tested these in a war situation and said they are simply amazing.

[PackerfanXD]

Originally Posted by bambooshoots

If you want to test that theory please hand me an AK magazine and hold a target 300 yards downrange.

I'll believe it when I see it. Post up a vid.

[PackerfanXD]

Originally Posted by bambooshoots

Pistons are not be-all end-all.

I didn't say it was but it's better than DI any day of the week.

[trtripoli]

Originally Posted by johnw

they need this

Don't push the red button! If you know where this gun is from you understand.

[PackerfanXD]

Is that from HALO?

[40204ever]

DI is self cleaning. Everytime you pull the trigger the old layer of GSR is replaced with a new, warmer layer of GSR. The M4 is a pig but it works.

I am skeptical about the story and its timing. Poor weapon performance is a morale killer.

I would think we would have been hearing reports about M4 issues a longtime ago. At least a couple of times in 8 years of fighting.