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Wiring 3 Kragen 7 in HID lights - attn Proforce and Rich91710

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Old 06-22-2012, 02:54 PM   #1
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Wiring 3 Kragen 7 in HID lights - attn Proforce and Rich91710

Howdy wiring and 'lectrical type people.....especially Proforce, Rich91710...

Here is your challenge.....

Instruct me on how to wire my 3 Kragen HID lights, safely.

I have almost no skill or technical ability. I can use hand tools. I have a circuit tester ( i think....one black prong, one red). I know to take off the neg battery terminal first....but then I am kinda lost. I can't read a wiring diagram....but I sorta can follow the logic of one.

Anyway,
I will post pics of what I have soon....

I have the 3 HID lights and I have a OTRATTW switch.

I have some 18 ga. speaker wire around.

Pics tonight....


Also, to the winner(s) I will make a gift of $10 to the paypal addy of your choice.

This isnt really a contest, but more like a way to pay the knowledgable contributors back for all they have imparted to me.

Pics to follow.


Also, someone give a shout out to the guy from puerto rico that is an electrical genius too. I forgot his name.
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Old 06-22-2012, 03:36 PM   #2
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Ballast and the light units should be pretty straightforward plug-and play out of the box.
The issue is safety connecting the mess to the truck.

The OTRATTW switch is a nice unit and wiring is pretty straightforward.

Pins 6 and 7 both go to chassis ground. One (7) is the ground for the background illumination, and the other (6) is for the indicator light.
Pin 8 is the supply for the background illumination. You CAN tap that into the dash wiring, but it's a bit of a PITA and if you never dim your instrument dimmer, you can just wire it straight to a switched power source.

Okay... Assuming that you are not wanting to run the lights any time and want them to shut off with the ignition (safest way to go, wired hot 24/7 you WILL eventually come out in the morning to a dead battery).
You need to find a switched hot on the underdash fuse box. The radio and ciggy lighter are common sources.
Remove the factory fuse, and replace it with an Add-A-Circuit.



Before installing, turn the key on, and using a voltmeter or non-battery powered test light, connect the black to a good chassis connection and using the red, check both sides of there the fuse came out. One will have power, one will not.

Insert the original fuse into the terminals on the Add-a-circuit closest to the legs, and insert it into the fuse block with the pigtail wire OPPOSITE where you probed the power source.
You should now have power going to your radio or cig lighter.
Install a 5a fuse in the other space on the Add-a-circuit.

Run one of your 18ga wires from the pigtail to terminal #2 on the switch. You can also jumper it to terminal 8. This will have the switch illumination on any time the key is on, but it is the simplest way to do it.

Now, run your 18ga wire from pin 3 on the switch out the firewall and to pin 85 of a regular "cube" fog light relay.
Connect pin 86 to ground.

Turn the ignition on and have someone operate the switch while you rest your hand on the relay and listen to it. You should hear it open and close the contacts as they flip the switch.

Run pin 87 on the relay to the hot supply wire of your light ballasts. You're going to want to use something heavier than 18ga for this. I'd go with 12.

Now going the other way, run pin 30 on the relay to an inline fuse. This fuse is going to protect the wiring going to the ballasts, so it (and the wire) need to be large enough to supply them. 12ga wire can handle 23 amps enclosed, so I would run a 20a fuse. That can supply 240 watts peak and 192 watts continuous... I would imagine that your driving lights are 55 watts each, so with 2 of them you have plenty of overhead for the power spike at startup.

The fuse needs to be connected to a solid power source that is hot 24/7. Directly to the battery is a good place, but most underhood power blocks have screw terminals accessible where the battery cable attaches and you can usually find a matching nut and simply attach the wire there using a ring lug.

That should do the job.
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Wiring 3 Kragen 7 in HID lights - attn Proforce and Rich91710-addacircuit.jpg  
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Old 06-22-2012, 05:05 PM   #3
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OK, the directions Rich gave are perfect. I personally would do it slightly different and a little easier IMO, but either option will work great. Here is the small problem though, you said you have (3) Kragen lights right? Well 1 relay can power 2, but may have trouble powering the third. Its going to be pretty risky putting 3 lights on 1 relay so what Im going to do is put 2 lights on (1) relay and the third light on a second relay.

This first diagram is all the wiring that is going to take place inside the engine compartment. You will need 2 standard 5pin automotive relays, connectors, wire, and EDIT: 2 inline fuse holders; one with a 20amp fuse and the other with a 10amp fuse. This may look like a disaster, but ill explain everything:



So, the 2 relays you have each have 5 pins labeled 86, 85, 30, 87, 87A.

On both relays, pins 87A are not going to be used, just leave them as is.

Pins 87 are your output of the relay when its turned on so these will go to the positive wire of your lights (usually red, or whatever other color wire is there besides black.. black should be the (-) ground wire on each light). Your going to attach 2 of the lights to 1 relay and the third light on its own relay as shown. The size of the wire used should be equivalent or greater than the size wire thats already coming of the lights.

Now your power for your lights and to power the relays. This will be pins 30 and 86. 30 is what will directly power your lights through the relay, so this need to be a good size wire. I would recommend 12 guage wire for pins 30 to the battery.
**NOTE: I messed up the drawing by showing both pin 30's connected to each other, then going to the battery with a single fuse... this will work, but is not ideal. Each relay should connect to the battery with its own separate 12g wire wire AND its own separate fuse. The relay powering 2 lights needs a 20amp fuse and the relay with only 1 light needs a 10amp fuse.**

For pins 86, these also need power. You can jump pins 86 over to pins 20 to steal power from them. You can use a small wire for this, as pins 86 only need 200ma draw which is nothing.

Pins 85 is whats going to trigger the relays from your switch. These are going to be (- ground) trigger wires. That way, you can skip the entire part about tapping into the fuse box in your car and using the add-a-circuit thing. It just simplifies the process.

*Just for the sake of explaining how and why, this is a relay:



Pin 85 and 86 are connected to a magnetic coil that triggers the relay. At rest, pin 30 is connected to 87a at all times. When 85 and 86 get power and ground, then 30 switches over to pin 87. Hopefully that makes sense. So what Rich did was have your relay connected to ground at all times (pin 85), then use the switch to send 12v to pin 86 to trigger the relay. This requires that your switch have power, so I made it so that your relay pin 86 is always powered, and your switch sends ground to trigger. Its the exact opposite, but doing this avoids having to power your switch and find a fuse to tap into.*

(I WILL FINISH THE OTHER DIAGRAM FOR YOUR SWITCH WIRING TO COMPLETE THIS AND POST IN A LITTLE WHILE - HOPE THIS HELPS GET YOU STARTED)
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Old 06-22-2012, 05:13 PM   #4
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That diagram will work fine for a standard switch, but he's running the illuminated switches.
The nighttime illumination light can be powered by an external source so that's not a problem, but the indicator light taps into the switched output and goes to ground.

Running ground-true switching would have a small current flowing through the light 24/7, and it would go dark when it turned the switch on (ground applied to both lights).
The switch is internally wired... I don't think there's a good way to provide the indicator light using ground-true switching.
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Old 06-22-2012, 05:14 PM   #5
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Also note, that diagram has the lights available 24/7, regardless of the ignition key status.
Easy to kill the battery, but with the big advantage that it simplifies the wiring... no need for an add-a-circuit.
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Old 06-22-2012, 05:31 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
That diagram will work fine for a standard switch, but he's running the illuminated switches.
The nighttime illumination light can be powered by an external source so that's not a problem, but the indicator light taps into the switched output and goes to ground.

Running ground-true switching would have a small current flowing through the light 24/7, and it would go dark when it turned the switch on (ground applied to both lights).
The switch is internally wired... I don't think there's a good way to provide the indicator light using ground-true switching.
Im not familiar with the switch he was using so I guess I should have looked into that part first before posting all that. I was going to dig into the details of the switch now, but I see what your saying, He needs power anyways in order to take advantage of the indicator light. Good catch

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
Also note, that diagram has the lights available 24/7, regardless of the ignition key status.
Easy to kill the battery, but with the big advantage that it simplifies the wiring... no need for an add-a-circuit.
I prefer this when it comes to lights only because its pretty difficult to forget to turn off 3 HID's and the added convenience of simply being able to use them at all times. If im out offroad, I like to be able to stop, turn the truck off, and leave some lighting on without wasting gas. Of course you gotta make sure you only do that for limited time... I think its a nice option tough. Also more efficient than just turning the key to acc because then you can have them on without anything else in your truck wasting the battery if you decided to run them with the truck off. But either way works I suppose. Some people like the peace of mind.
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Old 06-22-2012, 05:34 PM   #7
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And I did 2 relays just to be safe.. I suppose you could use just 1, but thats up to OP. A relay is rated for 40amps, and typical HID's draw about 10+ amps each at startup, then run off 3-4amps continuous. So its only risky for first startup, but it should work fine.

Maybe we can put all this together into 1 simple post for the OP. We will use 1 relay but use 10awg wire for pin 30 with atleast a 30amp fuse. Thoughts Rich??
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Old 06-22-2012, 06:52 PM   #8
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40a relay you'd be safe with a 30a fuse, and 10ga is more than adequate for a 30a fuse.
Could even go to a 35 to get a little more overhead for startup.
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Old 06-22-2012, 07:23 PM   #9
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Wow!!! You guys both rock. But I knew that from your other posts.

Rich and Proforce, please PM me a paypal addy and claim your prizes. I have benefited from your posts way beyond this one, so dont be bashful.

I think I have another question or to, unrelated to the above, that I'll most likely be hitting you up for again anyway. One is easy (LED bed light switching) and the other is mobile audio related.....but let me get these HIDs lit up first.

Thanks....

I'll try to get these hooked up tomorrow and take a few pics.
Jeff
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Old 06-22-2012, 07:47 PM   #10
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No need for cash, but if you must, please direct my share here:
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That's the Calguns Foundation http://calgunsfoundation.org/
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Old 06-22-2012, 08:02 PM   #11
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It will be done, thanks!
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Old 06-22-2012, 11:07 PM   #12
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So Ive put together the info from Rich and myself. This should be the final solution for your wiring. Forget my previous diagrams, this will be the correct way.



If you have any questions, feel free to ask. The only thing I was confused about myself is your OTRATTW wiring. According to their website, this is how their switches work:



So based on the above diagram, thats how I drew my wiring instructions, although Rich mentioned it slightly different, but he has more experience with these switched so maybe Im missing something. But according to the website, this should be correct. Hope it all works. This is about as simple as I can explain it.

All the important notes are on my diagram. Good Luck!
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Old 06-22-2012, 11:14 PM   #13
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Actually I don't.... I was sent a pdf of the switch and went from that, but the pdf did not have the internal wiring, and it indicated the wiring as I had related.

Maybe they modified it and one of us has an old drawing?
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Old 06-22-2012, 11:27 PM   #14
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Odd... They do show a few different wiring patterns for various switches, but it looks like the one you posted is current.

Going to email the guy who sent me the pdf and clarify.
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Old 06-22-2012, 11:41 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich91710 View Post
Odd... They do show a few different wiring patterns for various switches, but it looks like the one you posted is current.

Going to email the guy who sent me the pdf and clarify.
Sounds good. If its wrong Ill try to adjust my diagram to make it correct. Since the OP offered $ for our services I want to be sure this gets done correctly. Thanks
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Old 06-23-2012, 06:00 PM   #16
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You guys rock. that diagram is what should have come with the HID lights. Anyhow, I'll double check the OTRATTW diagram of internal switching that came with it and I'll let you know if it is current.

Well current as of when they sent me the switch in December.

And anyone keeping track Rich and Proforce (anthony) are both winners, but you guys all ready knew that before my thread.

Thanks.....btw, i didnt have drive way tiime today, but tomorrow the wife and daughter are going to a bridal shower so the boy and I can have some tacoma time.
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Old 06-23-2012, 06:10 PM   #17
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Easy enough to verify.
Apply power to 3 and a ground to 8 and see if the indicator light comes on.
Then apply power to 6 and ground to 7 and see if the switch illumination comes on.
If they do, then follow Pro's final diagram (but use 10ga wire instead of 12 with that 35a fuse )

If not, then try power to 8 and ground to 7. If the illumination comes on, then move to 3 and 6... if the indicator works, then use Pro's but modify the switch connections to match my description.

The issue is the switch illumination. In any case, pin 2 gets power from the add-a-circuit, and pin 3 sends power to the relay (and to the indicator light).
You just need to find the ground for the indicator light (it's going to be either 6, 7, or 8, and you won't blow anything up by applying ground to each in turn to test), and once that is identified, the remaining two pins can be wired to your dash lighting.
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Old 06-23-2012, 06:18 PM   #18
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Anthony, your diagram is the same as the one I got from OTRATTW.

Rich, i can easily scan and send the OTRATTW diagram from the switch to you on Tuesday when I get back to work, just PM me a good email and it'll arrive as a pdf.
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Old 06-23-2012, 06:26 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tango down View Post
Anthony, your diagram is the same as the one I got from OTRATTW.

Rich, i can easily scan and send the OTRATTW diagram from the switch to you on Tuesday when I get back to work, just PM me a good email and it'll arrive as a pdf.
I found Anthony's diagram on their site.
Still haven't heard back from the guy I was exchanging emails with, but I did send him a followup to double check his switch to make sure it's correct.
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Old 06-23-2012, 06:36 PM   #20
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Name: Bry
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just out of curiosity why use the ottrattw switch before the oem switch??
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