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Military Academy=Military Service?

View Poll Results: Academy = Service
Good Enough 3 4.23%
Not Quite 68 95.77%
Voters: 71. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-11-2012, 12:04 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YayAreaTaco0311 View Post
Ex gf's "friend" fell off the rappel tower in basic training at Ft Jackson, got med sep the next day, and has medical benefits for life. Goes to school and calls herself an "Army veteran."

How do ya'll feel about that?
I work with a guy like this.....medical out during boot camp but talks quite often like he fought around the world for the military. They deserve their benefits for whatever the physical issue is/was but as far as the made up stories go, they make me sick to my stomach.
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Old 11-11-2012, 12:09 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YayAreaTaco0311 View Post
Ex gf's "friend" fell off the rappel tower in basic training at Ft Jackson, got med sep the next day, and has medical benefits for life. Goes to school and calls herself an "Army veteran."

How do ya'll feel about that?
He'd already signed all the paperwork, raised his right hand, took his oath and was working for the military. However, I'm curious why they are giving him benefits, unless it was their fault, (faulty equipment, safety standards not followed, etc).

Boot camp counts towards time in service, but separating in boot camp before having done anything does not make you veteran.
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Old 11-11-2012, 01:04 PM   #23
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FEDERAL DEFINITION: under Federal Law a VETERAN is any person, who served honorably on active duty in the armed forces of the United States. (Discharges marked GENERAL AND UNDER HONORABLE CONDITIONS also qualify.)

I don't think someone in Basic for a couple of weeks should be considered a Veteran...However, if you get hurt and discharged while serving on Active Duty status and you weren't breaking any laws (or anything else deserving of a dishonorable discharge) you will be considered a Disabled Veteran. The benefits received will be decided by a medical board.

A service member with one day on Active Duty has the potential to be deemed a " Disabled Veteran" by the U.S. Veteran Affairs and is eligible for life long benefits.
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Old 11-11-2012, 04:07 PM   #24
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According to the Office of the Secretary of Defense, your coworker has very little integrity.

http://militarypay.defense.gov/retir...d/19_faqs.html
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Old 11-11-2012, 04:14 PM   #25
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I'm at military school, given not an academy, but know some guys at the academy and none think that it counts as service.
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Old 11-11-2012, 04:47 PM   #26
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It's not service at all. Just like my 2 years spent in ROTC is not service. Having lived at West Point for 3 years I know there are a lot of kids that go to the academies because it's 2 years of free schooling and then you can transfer somewhere else. Sure you may train with others that are joining the military but it is not considered serving until you sign a contract and have a duty station, at least IMO.
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Old 11-11-2012, 05:09 PM   #27
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Its not really a matter of opinion, its fact.

I work with several Air Force Academy grads, non of which claim it as service. It may have been alot less fun than I had in college, but just like ROTC, your TIS begins at your enter to active duty date.

The only stipulation, from what I understand, is it does count towards a civilian federal retirement. So if you did 4 years at a service academy, then commissioned and did, say, 4 years, your military TIS is 4 years but if you were hired on with a federal agency, your pay step would be based on 8 years. It doesnt work the other way around though. If you work for a federal agency for 4 years and join the military, you don't have 4 years TIS on day one of military service.

People leave the academy or ROTC for a wide array of reasons, just like Joe Blow quit his job at Walmart because he didnt like his boss or being told what to do.

What boggles me are those that quit the academy and then enlist. I was enlisted for 10.5 years and commissioned while an E-6 and am now an O-1E (closing in on O-2E) and have now seen both sides. You will always have a boss and someone with more stripes or brass telling you what to do.

If this kid thinks going to a military service academy and quitting is something to brag about, hes an idiot. My suggestion is do your PME and whatever job related advancement you can and become HIS boss.
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Old 11-11-2012, 06:27 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YayAreaTaco0311 View Post
Ex gf's "friend" fell off the rappel tower in basic training at Ft Jackson, got med sep the next day, and has medical benefits for life. Goes to school and calls herself an "Army veteran."

How do ya'll feel about that?
I work at the commissary on an Air Force base. I deal with people like this all the time, some young, some have been wards of the government for decades. When I see that tan ID card (like my wife & grandson have), well I don't have any respect for you unless you have a Purple Heart. I'm nice to all my customers, but don't try to tell me you're a veteran because I'll show you my back & walk away. If person doesn't graduate from basic training, OCS or a service academy, you are not a veteran regardless of what your ID reads.
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Old 11-13-2012, 08:14 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warputer View Post
I work with a guy like this.....medical out during boot camp but talks quite often like he fought around the world for the military. They deserve their benefits for whatever the physical issue is/was but as far as the made up stories go, they make me sick to my stomach.
Exactly... and while some people are deserving of some of these benefits, it's just like the Unions, others abuse it and just want to "buck the system"... I'm an ex submarine sonar tech, I did one term and got out... I heard of a lot of guys that learned about all the little disability benefits you can claim when getting out, and a lot of the sonar techs were getting audiograms and getting 10% disability for life. Granted 10% for an E-4 getting out after one term is pocket change, multiply that by tens of thousands military wide, and now you've got a substantial chunk of tax payer dollars. It's a controversial issue though and everyone will feel differently about that kind of stuff.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:22 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AzogSS View Post
Ask to see a DD 214. Argument over.
HAHAHAHAHA!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by YayAreaTaco0311 View Post
Ex gf's "friend" fell off the rappel tower in basic training at Ft Jackson, got med sep the next day, and has medical benefits for life. Goes to school and calls herself an "Army veteran."

How do ya'll feel about that?
One word describes that guy. Shitbag.
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Old 11-13-2012, 03:56 PM   #31
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answer from someone that knows

Here's the answer: At the two year point in the AF Academy, cadets are given the opportunity to withdrawal and pay back thousands of dollars for the education already received. If they decide to continue on to their Junior year, they have to sign a document more or less saying they pledge to finish and be commissioned at the end of four years. If for some reason, the cadet is dismissed during their junior or senior year, they will have to enter the AF as an enlisted Airman and perform a minimum 8 year hitch with the last 2-4 being fulfilled in inactive reserve status.

He probably has a CAC because he lost one at one point, had another made, then found the one he lost.(happens quite often)

BTW, in NOOOOOOOOOOO way (official or unofficial) is he considered a veteran!

I'm an AF AD SMSgt
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Old 11-13-2012, 05:18 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeckel7234 View Post
First off happy veterans day to all the current and prior service.

Is going to the AF academy for 2 yrs give or take considered actual service? A guy just started working with, went to the academy for just short of 2 years, and tells people regularly he served and is borderline retarded arrogant with it (got out because he didnt like dealing with the politics of it), not to sure how I feel about it, since I dont know jack shit about the academy. And in the dept i work theres atleast 6 or 7 prior service enlisted and were all kinda sketchy about it. So all in all what the majority opinion on this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeckel7234 View Post
Those were his reasons, saying he had to contact the senator that sponsored him and it took a while for him to actually get out, and he still has a CAC card idk why though, or even if it may be expired. I know yall were butting heads but for the most part Brunes going to the academy and j83 maybe at West Point, yall agree that its bs to consider himself a "military veteran".
I was just talking to my brother, who goes to USNA.. and he says that although he is sure it differs school to school, there is a reason he left at 2 years. At the Naval Academy, that is the point where they allow you to leave without having to serve or pay them back. Once you start your 3rd year, when you graduate or are kicked out, you owe 5 years of service. He is BSing about the CAC card.. and the senator (as far as he knows) has nothing to do with you leaving, he/she is only someone who gives you a nomination (congressmen can to) as part of your application to get in. If he's BSing about everything, the Air Force Academy probably decided they didn't want him and let him go. Or hey, maybe he did leave. Either way, it doesn't count as service.
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:11 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustBeGood View Post
Here's the answer: At the two year point in the AF Academy, cadets are given the opportunity to withdrawal and pay back thousands of dollars for the education already received. If they decide to continue on to their Junior year, they have to sign a document more or less saying they pledge to finish and be commissioned at the end of four years. If for some reason, the cadet is dismissed during their junior or senior year, they will have to enter the AF as an enlisted Airman and perform a minimum 8 year hitch with the last 2-4 being fulfilled in inactive reserve status.

He probably has a CAC because he lost one at one point, had another made, then found the one he lost.(happens quite often)

BTW, in NOOOOOOOOOOO way (official or unofficial) is he considered a veteran!

I'm an AF AD SMSgt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasmine View Post
I was just talking to my brother, who goes to USNA.. and he says that although he is sure it differs school to school, there is a reason he left at 2 years. At the Naval Academy, that is the point where they allow you to leave without having to serve or pay them back. Once you start your 3rd year, when you graduate or are kicked out, you owe 5 years of service. He is BSing about the CAC card.. and the senator (as far as he knows) has nothing to do with you leaving, he/she is only someone who gives you a nomination (congressmen can to) as part of your application to get in. If he's BSing about everything, the Air Force Academy probably decided they didn't want him and let him go. Or hey, maybe he did leave. Either way, it doesn't count as service.
Thanks for the research put in this, surprisingly I havent seen him since I put this up. It blows my mind when people act/lie like that
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:20 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tacomathom View Post
I work at the commissary on an Air Force base. I deal with people like this all the time, some young, some have been wards of the government for decades. When I see that tan ID card (like my wife & grandson have), well I don't have any respect for you unless you have a Purple Heart. I'm nice to all my customers, but don't try to tell me you're a veteran because I'll show you my back & walk away. If person doesn't graduate from basic training, OCS or a service academy, you are not a veteran regardless of what your ID reads.
You sound very bitter.... so you dont respect retired Military? One doesnt have to be injured to have given all. I expect more from a retired Chief.
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Old 11-14-2012, 08:59 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrdSurgie View Post
You sound very bitter.... so you dont respect retired Military? One doesnt have to be injured to have given all. I expect more from a retired Chief.
haha I got hurt, they didn't even give half of us purple hearts. Your flippin ribbons don't make you a vet.

Service in a brach of the armed forces = veteran.

service in combat = combat veteran.

went to a class on how to be a boot-tenant = civilian.
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:51 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tacomathom View Post
When I see that tan ID card (like my wife & grandson have), well I don't have any respect for you unless you have a Purple Heart.
so you don't respect your wife or grandson? Interesting.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:07 AM   #37
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what seems to bother me about this is his non-chalant way of leaving the academy ( Politics?) Those spots are very hard to come by and I know a few of my friends who would have loved to have his AND been Excellent service members. ( Actually, two are, they went to college privately and joined anyway)
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:55 AM   #38
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I had a friend that was an academic failure at West Point. He had to enlist to pay for his time or obligation. We went through AIT together, damn good soldier too. Is this still the case? The time frame was back in 94' though.
Sounds like you co-worker has the could have, should have syndrome.

No graduation from basic, not a vet
No commision from a service academy, not a vet.
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:17 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AzogSS View Post
Ask to see a DD 214. Argument over.

Wouldn't you still technically get one even if you were academy?
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:43 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YayAreaTaco0311 View Post
Ex gf's "friend" fell off the rappel tower in basic training at Ft Jackson, got med sep the next day, and has medical benefits for life. Goes to school and calls herself an "Army veteran."

How do ya'll feel about that?
Depends on his attitude. If he states in advance that he was injured in basic while trying to serve his country, I could respect that. If he acts like he is some big shot vet who got injured on duty like he was overseas, then I would call him a scumbag.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanLikesTacos View Post
Its not really a matter of opinion, its fact.

I work with several Air Force Academy grads, non of which claim it as service. It may have been alot less fun than I had in college, but just like ROTC, your TIS begins at your enter to active duty date.

The only stipulation, from what I understand, is it does count towards a civilian federal retirement. So if you did 4 years at a service academy, then commissioned and did, say, 4 years, your military TIS is 4 years but if you were hired on with a federal agency, your pay step would be based on 8 years. It doesnt work the other way around though. If you work for a federal agency for 4 years and join the military, you don't have 4 years TIS on day one of military service.

People leave the academy or ROTC for a wide array of reasons, just like Joe Blow quit his job at Walmart because he didnt like his boss or being told what to do.

What boggles me are those that quit the academy and then enlist. I was enlisted for 10.5 years and commissioned while an E-6 and am now an O-1E (closing in on O-2E) and have now seen both sides. You will always have a boss and someone with more stripes or brass telling you what to do.

If this kid thinks going to a military service academy and quitting is something to brag about, hes an idiot. My suggestion is do your PME and whatever job related advancement you can and become HIS boss.
Unless things have changed over the years, your TIS starts the day you signed your contract and were sworn in. I was sworn in and signed my contract with the USMC on 10 November, 1986 for 8 years. I graduated high school in 1987 and went to basic training summer of 1987, and my contract ended on 10 November, 1994. Full TIS was 8 years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by brian View Post
Wouldn't you still technically get one even if you were academy?
You get a DD-214 when separated or transferring from active duty status. You are not on active duty when in school, hence he would have never received one.
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