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Old 05-25-2012, 08:54 PM   #241
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I am gonna ignore that IFS comment. Dont generalize.
He should say "Stock IFS is shit" I like long travel
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Old 06-01-2012, 09:17 AM   #242
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Originally Posted by Supra TT View Post
Not true, a cv has more contact points there for making it stronger than a u-joint. RCV makes the strongest axles pretty much... $$ (CV)



3 link, you use bigger bars, one less bar obviously, but you're gonna need to run a panhard bar especially in the rear if you plan to drive it I think the 3link with a panhard has less bump steer to it. 4 link is better due to its simplicity and great articulation.. There's more too it I suppose.. 4link can be triangular or parallel as well, 2 different set ups

Actually the three link has better articulation and less binding than the 4 link does, (I actually saved the episode of extreme 4x4 where they talk about that for those who want to argue), and you must run a panhard bar on a three link no matter what. Also, it's easier to fit a three link on a truck especially if your going to try and get the truck as low as possible.
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Old 06-01-2012, 09:18 AM   #243
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Originally Posted by 45acp View Post
Good to know, simplicity and better articulation is what I'm after. 4-link it is!


Stole this pic from Pirate. The tire size & brand, as well as the ride height is what I'm aiming for.




Be careful with that. The information you got on that is not entirely correct. See the post above
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Old 06-01-2012, 07:02 PM   #244
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Originally Posted by awsumdc View Post
Actually the three link has better articulation and less binding than the 4 link does, (I actually saved the episode of extreme 4x4 where they talk about that for those who want to argue), and you must run a panhard bar on a three link no matter what. Also, it's easier to fit a three link on a truck especially if your going to try and get the truck as low as possible.
Yes you are right. 3-link does articulate better..

But, I know you have ran into numerous problems with your three link system... sometimes they aren't always easier
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Old 06-02-2012, 09:57 AM   #245
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Originally Posted by Supra TT View Post
Yes you are right. 3-link does articulate better..

But, I know you have ran into numerous problems with your three link system... sometimes they aren't always easier

Granted, nothing is ever easy when your trying to put something that was not in the oringinal design concept of a vehicle especially when you were the first with said vehicle, however, once it was designed and put together it works flawlessly now and has been copied time and again.

Trying to put a four link either in the front of one of these trucks or in the rear of one of these trucks has many issues. First, if you use a triangulated system in the front you'll have to have the truck sitting too high to be of any use because of where the engine sits. Second, if you use a parallel system, you will need to run a panhard bar to keep the axle from moving side to side. Now you have five links instead of four links.

In the rear if you use a four link triangulated system you will have to move the fuel tank to get it to work or you can just have a truck that is sitting really high to make it work. Then again running a parallel four link system you have to run a panhard bar.

To me it's just simpler and better to run a three link as opposed to any four link system.

Not trying to bash on you. Your one of the few who were brave enough to step out and tackle something like this by yourself. just want everyone to have enough information to make a decision on how to approach their projects.
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Old 06-02-2012, 11:48 AM   #246
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What is the typical cost of trying to do a home brewed 3 link?
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Old 06-02-2012, 01:04 PM   #247
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Originally Posted by awsumdc View Post
Granted, nothing is ever easy when your trying to put something that was not in the oringinal design concept of a vehicle especially when you were the first with said vehicle, however, once it was designed and put together it works flawlessly now and has been copied time and again.

Trying to put a four link either in the front of one of these trucks or in the rear of one of these trucks has many issues. First, if you use a triangulated system in the front you'll have to have the truck sitting too high to be of any use because of where the engine sits. Second, if you use a parallel system, you will need to run a panhard bar to keep the axle from moving side to side. Now you have five links instead of four links.

In the rear if you use a four link triangulated system you will have to move the fuel tank to get it to work or you can just have a truck that is sitting really high to make it work. Then again running a parallel four link system you have to run a panhard bar.

To me it's just simpler and better to run a three link as opposed to any four link system.

Not trying to bash on you. Your one of the few who were brave enough to step out and tackle something like this by yourself. just want everyone to have enough information to make a decision on how to approach their projects.

I see, I see. You are the brave one, cutting up an 05 first week off the lot!

Anywho, thanks.
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What is the typical cost of trying to do a home brewed 3 link?
Rear, front? Both?
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Old 06-03-2012, 09:11 AM   #248
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I see, I see. You are the brave one, cutting up an 05 first week off the lot!

Anywho, thanks.


Rear, front? Both?
Just the front. Also, in my shopping/searching I have more questions. Aside from axle shafts, knuckle service kit, and a 3rd member rebuild/re-gearing, what else should I be purchasing and from where to do a complete rebuild for this axle I bought?
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Old 06-03-2012, 09:59 AM   #249
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Typical cost for the front 3 Link I would say would be around $1500 or more depending on if you make your brackets. Heims aren't cheap and neither are C/Os.

And parts can be purchased from numerous places I believe. I know http://www.marlincrawler.com/axle/fr.../service-parts For sure

You will want the trunion eliminator kit too, and axle ball gussets
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Old 06-03-2012, 10:13 AM   #250
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Originally Posted by Supra TT View Post
Typical cost for the front 3 Link I would say would be around $1500 or more depending on if you make your brackets. Heims aren't cheap and neither are C/Os.

And parts can be purchased from numerous places I believe. I know http://www.marlincrawler.com/axle/fr.../service-parts For sure

You will want the trunion eliminator kit too, and axle ball gussets
For $1,500 it sounds like I am better off just going with leaf since I won't be doing hard core rock crawling. Since you mentioned Trail-Gear to me a while ago I have been shopping them mostly and marlin crawler. For the Marlin Crawler stuff does the pick up also fall under the Hilux parts?
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Old 06-03-2012, 11:28 AM   #251
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Yeah CO's are no joke on price. Leafs can be done for like half that or less. And leafs work great, I love my leaf springs, haven't let me down yet, and they aren't even set-up properly...

Hilux and pickup I believe are the same thing. Call them if you need to they are good guys there.
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Old 06-03-2012, 12:03 PM   #252
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Originally Posted by Supra TT View Post
Yeah CO's are no joke on price. Leafs can be done for like half that or less. And leafs work great, I love my leaf springs, haven't let me down yet, and they aren't even set-up properly...

Hilux and pickup I believe are the same thing. Call them if you need to they are good guys there.
Right on man, good lookin' out. Do you see any major issues running 4.88's on a 27 spline axle for 35's? Or for that matter 5.29's?

edit: Just read an article here http://www.fourwheeler.com/techartic...all/index.html and now I am confused if the front diff is a 30 or 27 spline axle carrier. WTF. FML. Mind=blown.
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Old 06-03-2012, 12:28 PM   #253
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I would run 5.29's Lower is usually better. I regret not going lower IMO. And I'm at 5.38s on 39s...

The diff is what ever it is, the difference in spline count they are talking about is on the outer splines. Usually if you run 30 spline you may need to grind the knuckle a littler since they are bigger shafts to fit. If you have the extra money get the 30 spline... They are only like $60 more. Also if you buy axles, get them from longfield axle... trust me, he has the best.

Like my dana 44 has 19 spline outer, 30 spline inner. I can upgrade to 30 spline outer but........... $$$ for me.
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Old 06-03-2012, 12:49 PM   #254
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I would run 5.29's Lower is usually better. I regret not going lower IMO. And I'm at 5.38s on 39s...

The diff is what ever it is, the difference in spline count they are talking about is on the outer splines. Usually if you run 30 spline you may need to grind the knuckle a littler since they are bigger shafts to fit. If you have the extra money get the 30 spline... They are only like $60 more. Also if you buy axles, get them from longfield axle... trust me, he has the best.

Like my dana 44 has 19 spline outer, 30 spline inner. I can upgrade to 30 spline outer but........... $$$ for me.
So essentially if I stay with the Birfield's I would have a 27 spline inner and a could use a 30 spline outer if I so chose to? I would prefer to run chromoly 30 spline axles for that peace of mind while out and about. The other thing too is that this 22RE is (maybe) pushing 100bhp so would 5.29's be overkill? I am trusting you on this cause I don't have shit for a clue of what I'm doing with SAS and I've read through your build maybe 50 times.
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Old 06-03-2012, 01:37 PM   #255
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I don't think you can use the original inners (maybe) but you would need to replace the CV joint, since I believe it is different. (I really have no clue) It only would make sense to me in order to use the bigger outer, the CV would need to be bigger.

I would call longfield and verify what I said above, ^ since I am not sure..

Also, If you are concerned with it go with 5.13s? Instead of 5.29s. My truck only has 145BHp and 5.38s are not low enough. Lower gear ratio = more control.

Are you driving it on the road?
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Old 06-03-2012, 08:30 PM   #256
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I don't think you can use the original inners (maybe) but you would need to replace the CV joint, since I believe it is different. (I really have no clue) It only would make sense to me in order to use the bigger outer, the CV would need to be bigger.

I would call longfield and verify what I said above, ^ since I am not sure..

Also, If you are concerned with it go with 5.13s? Instead of 5.29s. My truck only has 145BHp and 5.38s are not low enough. Lower gear ratio = more control.

Are you driving it on the road?
5.13's might not be a bad idea. As of right now no. When it's all said and done the only road time it will see is to and from trails local to me in AZ. No interstate/freeway driving for this rig.
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Old 06-03-2012, 09:34 PM   #257
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What size tire are you wanting to run? My buddies crawler/DD has a 22R on propane. He's running 36in Iroks with 5.29's and he said that it's right at stock, maybe just a little more pep. He also has 4.7's in the case and his rig does great!

As far as the three link, you'll have a pretty penny in it but it's well worth it! Linke SupreTT said, the shocks are pricey and the joints are a kick in the nuts... especially since there's so many of them.
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Old 06-03-2012, 10:34 PM   #258
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What size tire are you wanting to run? My buddies crawler/DD has a 22R on propane. He's running 36in Iroks with 5.29's and he said that it's right at stock, maybe just a little more pep. He also has 4.7's in the case and his rig does great!

As far as the three link, you'll have a pretty penny in it but it's well worth it! Linke SupreTT said, the shocks are pricey and the joints are a kick in the nuts... especially since there's so many of them.
End goal was going to be 35'' tires, on 5'' of lift, running 5.29's, on a Detroit locker and probably 5 more years down the road dual transfers. The axle spline count is what has me worried about doing that. If I can run chomoly 30 spline axles then I'll do it. Also planning on running a rear Detroit as well (but I guess that is a given).
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Old 06-04-2012, 04:49 AM   #259
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Gotcha, sounds like a clean setup and you definitely doing it right... My buddy is running stock shafts in his right now. So far he's only busted one shaft, but he was just being stupid when he did that. I think he's doing the Dirty 30's here in a few months just so that it would be one less thing to worry about.
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Old 06-04-2012, 10:24 AM   #260
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Originally Posted by Underdog777 View Post
End goal was going to be 35'' tires, on 5'' of lift, running 5.29's, on a Detroit locker and probably 5 more years down the road dual transfers. The axle spline count is what has me worried about doing that. If I can run chomoly 30 spline axles then I'll do it. Also planning on running a rear Detroit as well (but I guess that is a given).
Make sure you get chromo tcase output shafts.. learned the hard way with a single case..upgraded to a double case when we switched out the broken shaft
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