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-   -   extreme front driveline angle (http://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/solid-axle-suspension/139226-extreme-front-driveline-angle.html)

fireturk41 02-10-2011 02:13 PM

extreme front driveline angle
 
the angle on my front d-shaft is extreme after my SAS due mailnly to the fact i needed a shorter d-shaft and the truck sits higher, anyone else have this problem? or any remedys? its a pain always unlocking hubs just so i dont feel extreme vibes

4RunnerSeth 02-10-2011 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireturk41 (Post 2720347)
the angle on my front d-shaft is extreme after my SAS due mailnly to the fact i needed a shorter d-shaft and the truck sits higher, anyone else have this problem? or any remedys? its a pain always unlocking hubs just so i dont feel extreme vibes

You need to correct your pinion angle. Should be roughly the same angle up as your drive shaft is angle down. You can use shims to do this, but this will throw off your caster. what you really need to do is weld on steel shims to correct your pinion angle. then take your axle to a shop and have them do a cut and turn to correct your caster angle so that your truck tracks properly on the highway. Anything 2* or less and you will have steering issues. best to have it corrected to 5-6*. I was quoted $600 by a local shop when i was planning on doing this with the scout.

If your pinion angle is already as good as you can get it then you will most likely need a CV drive shaft. If you already have one and your pinion is right then i have no idea... HAHAH..

Supra TT 02-10-2011 07:48 PM

x2 ^.... also

:worthless:

fireturk41 02-11-2011 04:02 AM

ill take pics this afternoon its effin cold out. i guess ill do that and hi-steer at the same time lol

Janster 02-11-2011 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireturk41 (Post 2723423)
ill take pics this afternoon its effin cold out. i guess ill do that and hi-steer at the same time lol

Like Prerunnerseth said....
If you want to do it 'right' (and it'll be expensive)...get the perches moved (for driveline angle) & the caster properly adjusted (knuckles moved/rewelded).

Definately get have hy-steer done.

Aside from that - Shims on the front are illegal here in PA. Not sure what your state laws would be.

Just a note - if you a get CV driveshaft ...do it now and set the driveline angle for it. If you set the angles without the CV and decide to buy one later....you'll probably have to redo the angles. http://www.4xshaft.com/driveline101.html

4RunnerSeth 02-11-2011 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janster (Post 2723851)
Like Prerunnerseth said....
If you want to do it 'right' (and it'll be expensive)...get the perches moved (for driveline angle) & the caster properly adjusted (knuckles moved/rewelded).

Definately get have hy-steer done.

Aside from that - Shims on the front are illegal here in PA. Not sure what your state laws would be.

Just a note - if you a get CV driveshaft ...do it now and set the driveline angle for it. If you set the angles without the CV and decide to buy one later....you'll probably have to redo the angles. http://www.4xshaft.com/driveline101.html

The right way to correct the pinion would be to cut off the perches and then weld on new ones, but this comes with some other issues. With front axles the diff is off center. In this case it is shifted to the drivers side. Often the spring perch on that side is cast into the pumpkin. This makes it very difficult to simply cut off the perch and weld on a new one for a couple reasons. one, its cast into the pumpkin and cannot be cut off and two it is very difficult and requires some serious skill to weld onto cast steel correctly. Simply using a shim is the easiest way to fix this and then redo the perch on the other side (the axle tubes are not cast). The other way is to grind the perch on the pumpkin to get the desired angle, but this weakens the pumpkin as you are removing base material from it.

Janster 02-11-2011 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PreRunnerSeth (Post 2724132)
The right way to correct the pinion would be to cut off the perches and then weld on new ones, but this comes with some other issues. With front axles the diff is off center. In this case it is shifted to the drivers side. Often the spring perch on that side is cast into the pumpkin. This makes it very difficult to simply cut off the perch and weld on a new one for a couple reasons. one, its cast into the pumpkin and cannot be cut off and two it is very difficult and requires some serious skill to weld onto cast steel correctly. Simply using a shim is the easiest way to fix this and then redo the perch on the other side (the axle tubes are not cast). The other way is to grind the perch on the pumpkin to get the desired angle, but this weakens the pumpkin as you are removing base material from it.

I swapped Dana 44 axles under my Jeep - and I had similar issues myself. I had to cut into the webbing on mine. I had a shop cut the knuckles and set the caster after the perches were set.

I didn't want to mention details because I'm not familiar with his paticular situation.

If you use a shim, then it should be completely welded into place. I don't know what kind of axle he's using - but if he has a Grand Wagoneer axle, the perches are CAST - so welding steal onto cast is gonna be required anyway.

I had front & rear axles off an 89 Grand Wagoneer and the perches were cast.

fireturk41 02-12-2011 02:40 PM

yes, im using the axle outta an 89 grand waggy, so the best and most efficient way would be to weld shims to the perches?

Janster 02-13-2011 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireturk41 (Post 2729565)
yes, im using the axle outta an 89 grand waggy, so the best and most efficient way would be to weld shims to the perches?

Who's doing the welding work?

I would take it to a good 'speed' type shop or a shop that customizes vehicles & hot rods. They could help you set the proper pinion angle and have suggestions on exactly how to do it - whether its a shim or a custom fabricated piece of steal, or they might have a better option.

Then.....after they get the pinion angles set and welded, I would have them cut your knuckles to set caster. They have special equipment that'll set both sides exactly the same and they'll weld them to the tubes at the right spots.

We had both our rear & our front D44 angles & knuckles done at the same shop. To me....this type of work isn't something you should hack up in your back yard. It's expensive, but atleast you know its done right.

fireturk41 02-13-2011 08:12 AM

olivers custom driveshafts, they are very well known in the area and do great work from what i heard, they bult both my dshafts and they turned out great

Janster 02-13-2011 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireturk41 (Post 2731776)
olivers custom driveshafts, they are very well known in the area and do great work from what i heard, they bult both my dshafts and they turned out great

Sounds good!

Hopefully they know how to set pinion angle and cut/rotate knuckles for caster........

Good Luck and let us know how things go!

fireturk41 02-15-2011 10:14 AM

3 Attachment(s)
Pics

Supra TT 02-15-2011 04:32 PM

Rotate the pictures........... Ass lol :)

Also it probably because of the side pictures... However, that angle doesn't look bad at all.

This is an extreme DS angle...
http://image.truckinweb.com/f/832898...driveshaft.jpg

fireturk41 02-15-2011 07:45 PM

Lol I could if I would, my phone makes the pics retarded. Its not extremely bad it just grinds when the hubs are locked or the trans case is in 4wd. It also makes a death wobble lol that and I'm afraid of breaking the u joint

Janster 02-15-2011 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Supra TT (Post 2743760)
This is an extreme DS angle..

Yeah....

Extremely USELESS!!!:D

Owww...my eyes!!!! Turn it off!!!

Supra TT 02-16-2011 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireturk41 (Post 2744921)
Lol I could if I would, my phone makes the pics retarded. Its not extremely bad it just grinds when the hubs are locked or the trans case is in 4wd. It also makes a death wobble lol that and I'm afraid of breaking the u joint

I think you are hearing something else grind....:confused: Get it balanced.. I thought you had a shop make these DS's? Or did I misread? You said they built both your DS's and they work great... Well from what you're telling me.... You lied :eek:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janster (Post 2745880)
Yeah....

Extremely USELESS!!!:D

Owww...my eyes!!!! Turn it off!!!

I can't turn off pure bling bling.. Sorry it's just so....






























Sorry.. I got lost staring at the............






























Not again.. :cool:

fireturk41 02-16-2011 04:58 PM

yeah they built and balanced both, im sure its the ds grinding, it only happens in 4wd or if i lock the hubs. hey the ds's work great for me, better than the last shop that redneck rigged it w/o balancing (that one broke)

awsumdc 02-27-2011 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireturk41 (Post 2729565)
yes, im using the axle outta an 89 grand waggy, so the best and most efficient way would be to weld shims to the perches?


Don't use shims. Do it right and cut off your spring perches, and rotate your knuckles for the correct pinion angle. Then get a CV for the rear of your drive shaft. All of this in conjunction will allow you to drive your truck while the hubs are locked on the street. Mine were left locked once while traveling down the freeway at 70mph. Don't recommend it but it did no harm and there were no vibrations.

fireturk41 02-27-2011 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by awsumdc (Post 2799118)
Don't use shims. Do it right and cut off your spring perches, and rotate your knuckles for the correct pinion angle. Then get a CV for the rear of your drive shaft. All of this in conjunction will allow you to drive your truck while the hubs are locked on the street. Mine were left locked once while traveling down the freeway at 70mph. Don't recommend it but it did no harm and there were no vibrations.

had a while to wheel it and ponder, i probably wont mess with the pinion angle, i looked at other SAS yotas this weekend and saw similar if not exact angles, plus if i can ever afford and decide to put in dual cases and tons, the problem should be eliminated then, rather than throw money at it now. also i plan to go to flat top knuckles very soon

it works great so why fix it if it aint broke, ya know?

and i do have a cv in the rear d shaft and it is awersome!

thanks for all the advise

awsumdc 02-27-2011 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireturk41 (Post 2799147)
had a while to wheel it and ponder, i probably wont mess with the pinion angle, i looked at other SAS yotas this weekend and saw similar if not exact angles, plus if i can ever afford and decide to put in dual cases and tons, the problem should be eliminated then, rather than throw money at it now. also i plan to go to flat top knuckles very soon

it works great so why fix it if it aint broke, ya know?

and i do have a cv in the rear d shaft and it is awersome!

thanks for all the advise


Yeah, if you go with dual t case's then that will help. But your gonna want to put a CV in that front drive shaft at the t case end of it. Trust me, it's be a lot better than it is now. Even when you go to dual case's.


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