Mike "Wuzzy121". Rest in peace, brother

Go Back   Tacoma World Forums > Off-Topic > Technology

Notices

WiFi antennas for access to wifi hotspots

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-19-2009, 03:21 PM   #1
epa4wd [OP] epa4wd is offline
Senior Member
epa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shed
Name: Eduardo
Joined: Mar 2009, #14828
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,914
epa4wd's Tacoma Gallery
WiFi antennas for access to wifi hotspots

I've seen for a while now a lot of different antenna designs for accessing wifi hot spots, some antennas claim up to 8 miles of range. I've seen some houses with them around town. Anyone here owns one? Do they work okay?
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2009, 07:57 PM   #3
epa4wd [OP] epa4wd is offline
Senior Member
epa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shed
Name: Eduardo
Joined: Mar 2009, #14828
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,914
epa4wd's Tacoma Gallery
No goal, just wondering because I've seen some local classifieds for the antenna and install.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2009, 05:34 AM   #4
abides.
Brunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shed
 
Brunes's Avatar
Coast Guard: LT- CG MH-65C/D Driver- CGAS NOLA
Name: Mark
Joined: May 2008, #7011
Location: Big Easy, USA
Age: 30
Gender: Dude
Posts: 17,718
Brunes's Tacoma Gallery
Send a message via AIM to Brunes
Yeah....You can do all sorts of cool stuff with specific lobe design and higher gain antennas.
My dad wired together a network @ a lumber yard. Each drying house had a computer controlled monitoring system that required the operator to walk to the house and use a computer there. He added wireless capability to all the local machines and made one central machine in the office to monitor all of them.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2009, 06:30 AM   #5
My pee parts itch
dexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the sheddexterdog is one of the sharper tools in the shed
 
dexterdog's Avatar
Joined: Jul 2009, #19571
Location: Oly WA
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,429
dexterdog's Tacoma Gallery
Nothing beats a hard wired setup but if you have to go wireless then there are some options. It just depends on what your goals are. Just make sure you protect your connection and don't let your neighbors find out if you are going to bootleg from them.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2009, 07:31 AM   #6
epa4wd [OP] epa4wd is offline
Senior Member
epa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shedepa4wd is one of the sharper tools in the shed
Name: Eduardo
Joined: Mar 2009, #14828
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,914
epa4wd's Tacoma Gallery
^^
Im not planning on getting one, or stealing from my neighbors, I already have internet service. I was just curious because I'm starting to see more and more local classifieds advertised as "Free Internet". I would have to say it looks like a great option if you live near a wifi hot spot, which pretty much now every fast food, restaurants, cafes etc have. Its also a great option for apartment buildings near my college to access the university's wifi, but I wonder how real is the up to 8 miles range is.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2009, 07:58 AM   #7
abides.
Brunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shed
 
Brunes's Avatar
Coast Guard: LT- CG MH-65C/D Driver- CGAS NOLA
Name: Mark
Joined: May 2008, #7011
Location: Big Easy, USA
Age: 30
Gender: Dude
Posts: 17,718
Brunes's Tacoma Gallery
Send a message via AIM to Brunes
Quote:
Originally Posted by epa4wd View Post
^^
Im not planning on getting one, or stealing from my neighbors, I already have internet service. I was just curious because I'm starting to see more and more local classifieds advertised as "Free Internet". I would have to say it looks like a great option if you live near a wifi hot spot, which pretty much now every fast food, restaurants, cafes etc have. Its also a great option for apartment buildings near my college to access the university's wifi, but I wonder how real is the up to 8 miles range is.
I'd question 8 miles...but yeah. There are ways to do stuff like that.

On a side note- It's not really stealing if they don't use a password and you don't have to use any special techniques to get a signal.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2009, 07:21 PM   #8
1/2 man 1/2 amazing
sooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shed
Name: A A Ron
Joined: Feb 2008, #4783
Location: Killeen, Texas
Age: 33
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,390
sooner07's Tacoma Gallery
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brunes View Post
I'd question 8 miles...but yeah. There are ways to do stuff like that.

On a side note- It's not really stealing if they don't use a password and you don't have to use any special techniques to get a signal.
Yeah, just like how if someone lock their doors its ok to walk around inside their house.

I understand the logic of people needing to secure their connections, but it isn't an excuse to utilize a service for which they pay. At least, that is how several courts have ruled on the issue.

As for if antennas work; yes they can. The 8 mile is not very likely. Standard wifi transmitters are incapable of transmitting that far in the air. Distance will vary based on humidity and particulates in the air at that long of a distance too.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 02:56 AM   #9
abides.
Brunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shed
 
Brunes's Avatar
Coast Guard: LT- CG MH-65C/D Driver- CGAS NOLA
Name: Mark
Joined: May 2008, #7011
Location: Big Easy, USA
Age: 30
Gender: Dude
Posts: 17,718
Brunes's Tacoma Gallery
Send a message via AIM to Brunes
Quote:
Originally Posted by sooner07 View Post
Yeah, just like how if someone lock their doors its ok to walk around inside their house.

I understand the logic of people needing to secure their connections, but it isn't an excuse to utilize a service for which they pay. At least, that is how several courts have ruled on the issue.

As for if antennas work; yes they can. The 8 mile is not very likely. Standard wifi transmitters are incapable of transmitting that far in the air. Distance will vary based on humidity and particulates in the air at that long of a distance too.
Incorrect- You have to walk into their house thru a closed door. THAT is "extra" steps. They also have an expectation of privacy/control over their house.

If they are broadcasting a signal that reaches into your space without any security- Totally different story. They do not have an expectation of privacy in YOUR house- and if the signal is in your house- It's in YOUR house. If you don't use any signal boosting technology or "hacking" to get the signal to work....it IS legal.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 05:49 PM   #10
1/2 man 1/2 amazing
sooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shedsooner07 is one of the sharper tools in the shed
Name: A A Ron
Joined: Feb 2008, #4783
Location: Killeen, Texas
Age: 33
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,390
sooner07's Tacoma Gallery
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brunes View Post
Incorrect- You have to walk into their house thru a closed door. THAT is "extra" steps. They also have an expectation of privacy/control over their house.

If they are broadcasting a signal that reaches into your space without any security- Totally different story. They do not have an expectation of privacy in YOUR house- and if the signal is in your house- It's in YOUR house. If you don't use any signal boosting technology or "hacking" to get the signal to work....it IS legal.
Might want to check your sources on both issues. It is not legal to enter another person's property without their consent regardless of if they leave their door open or not. You must have an invitation or reasonable legal cause for entering.

While it is still open for debate in court, it isn't exactly legal in the eyes of some courts around the country. I don't argue the point of the logic behind it, I would say that it isn't the best idea to go and attempt to access a wireless connection that isn't yours.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 06:00 PM   #11
abides.
Brunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shed
 
Brunes's Avatar
Coast Guard: LT- CG MH-65C/D Driver- CGAS NOLA
Name: Mark
Joined: May 2008, #7011
Location: Big Easy, USA
Age: 30
Gender: Dude
Posts: 17,718
Brunes's Tacoma Gallery
Send a message via AIM to Brunes
Quote:
Originally Posted by sooner07 View Post
Might want to check your sources on both issues. It is not legal to enter another person's property without their consent regardless of if they leave their door open or not. You must have an invitation or reasonable legal cause for entering.

While it is still open for debate in court, it isn't exactly legal in the eyes of some courts around the country. I don't argue the point of the logic behind it, I would say that it isn't the best idea to go and attempt to access a wireless connection that isn't yours.
I'm a federal LEO...I know that you can't walk into someone else's house because you feel like it. I'm sure I understand the whole 4th amendment "thing" and the laws related to it fairly well. And the fact that it is "still open to debate" means that it is BY DEFINITION- Not precedent bound.

The example I drew was to make clear parallels out of your apples to oranges comparison. There is laws that specifically outlaw trespass- There are not laws that dictate the use of a free to air signal. Which is why we are having this discussion.

I have my own hardwired connection- and I, too, would recommend getting your own connection as a point of clarification. But I wouldn't expect the cops to knock down your door if you snarf some signal from the neighbors.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2009, 05:06 AM   #12
Senior Member
Jigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shedJigzor is one of the sharper tools in the shed
 
Jigzor's Avatar
Joined: May 2009, #17413
Location: Pennsylvania
Gender: Guy
Posts: 3,111
Jigzor's Tacoma Gallery
trespassing?! If they do not lock their system down that is an open invite since it is publicly broadcasted. That being said, how am I trespassing when I am still in my own home/property? Their signal is trespassing MY property! Don't want me to have it? Then don't broadcast, lock it down, or block the signal to my property.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2009, 07:47 AM   #13
Keyser Soze
WATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud of
 
WATRD's Avatar
Name: Rob
Joined: Sep 2009, #22382
Location: Duvall, WA
Gender: Dude
Posts: 163
WATRD's Tacoma Gallery
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brunes View Post
There is laws that specifically outlaw trespass- There are not laws that dictate the use of a free to air signal. Which is why we are having this discussion.
Actually, the FCC has being making laws about that for decades and decades. Longer than most of have been around. Read on for more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jigzor View Post
trespassing?! If they do not lock their system down that is an open invite since it is publicly broadcasted. That being said, how am I trespassing when I am still in my own home/property? Their signal is trespassing MY property! Don't want me to have it? Then don't broadcast, lock it down, or block the signal to my property.
That is half right. The Communications Act of 1934, and amended in 1996, indicates that you do have the right to receive signals that you otherwise intercept lawfully. However, WiFi is a two-way system and recent court decisions have set a precedent that it is a "service", subject to the same laws as other services when it comes to "theft of services" rules.

You would be perfectly within your rights to set up a receiver to listen in, as long as you do not use any information you capture for illegal purposes or for profit. The minute your 802.11x card handshakes with the WAP, you are into something else...

As an aside, since this is a vehicle forum, did you know that the FCC Communications Act of 1934 is also what is routinely argued as making radar detectors legal? Police have argued that they want to block you from receiving that singal, but the courts have routinely upheld the policy that a radar gun is a radio transmitter and you are free to receive it's signal. Of course, the police then counter that you receive the signal as a means to commit an illegal act, so the FCC regulation shouldn't apply... and the beat goes on...

(I was a commercial broadcast engineer, in a past life)
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2009, 06:10 PM   #14
abides.
Brunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shedBrunes is one of the sharper tools in the shed
 
Brunes's Avatar
Coast Guard: LT- CG MH-65C/D Driver- CGAS NOLA
Name: Mark
Joined: May 2008, #7011
Location: Big Easy, USA
Age: 30
Gender: Dude
Posts: 17,718
Brunes's Tacoma Gallery
Send a message via AIM to Brunes
Quote:
Originally Posted by WATRD View Post
Actually, the FCC has being making laws about that for decades and decades. Longer than most of have been around. Read on for more.



That is half right. The Communications Act of 1934, and amended in 1996, indicates that you do have the right to receive signals that you otherwise intercept lawfully. However, WiFi is a two-way system and recent court decisions have set a precedent that it is a "service", subject to the same laws as other services when it comes to "theft of services" rules.

You would be perfectly within your rights to set up a receiver to listen in, as long as you do not use any information you capture for illegal purposes or for profit. The minute your 802.11x card handshakes with the WAP, you are into something else...

As an aside, since this is a vehicle forum, did you know that the FCC Communications Act of 1934 is also what is routinely argued as making radar detectors legal? Police have argued that they want to block you from receiving that singal, but the courts have routinely upheld the policy that a radar gun is a radio transmitter and you are free to receive it's signal. Of course, the police then counter that you receive the signal as a means to commit an illegal act, so the FCC regulation shouldn't apply... and the beat goes on...

(I was a commercial broadcast engineer, in a past life)
125 Dishonestly obtaining electronic communications services

(1) A person who—
(a) dishonestly obtains an electronic communications service, and
(b) does so with intent to avoid payment of a charge applicable to the provision of that service,
is guilty of an offence.
(2) It is not an offence under this section to obtain a service mentioned in section 297(1) of the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988 (c. 48) (dishonestly obtaining a broadcasting or cable programme service provided from a place in the UK).
(3) A person guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable—
(a) on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months or to a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum, or to both;
(b) on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years or to a fine, or to both.


I'd like to see any case law documentation you have- cause the way I read that punitive article it would be nearly impossible for anyone to be convicted.

I receive signals all the time and do nothing dishonest to get them- I just sit there and it comes to my computer. Dushonestly comes when you hack a password to using signal boosting or have to go sit in the attic leaning into a corner to get the signal.

It's also impossible to prove my intent. An open signal that I find broadcasting into my house- I don't know where it's coming from most of the time (Several folks in my development run open wireless and there is a community center with access too...) "I just assumed it was there to be used" is a pretty solid defense to the intent cause...


  Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2009, 06:44 PM   #15
Keyser Soze
WATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud ofWATRD has much to be proud of
 
WATRD's Avatar
Name: Rob
Joined: Sep 2009, #22382
Location: Duvall, WA
Gender: Dude
Posts: 163
WATRD's Tacoma Gallery
It's largely anecdotal from reading various trades, but let me find some examples.

These are related to the theft of services:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-10784_3-9722006-7.html
http://www.designnine.com/news/node/423
http://www.newswireless.net/index.cfm/article/2317

I will also try to find the cases of the actual prosecutions that I have read about, as I have time. In the mean time, this is a GREAT resource, including a list of the various laws in various states that you might be prosecuted under:

http://www.cybertelecom.org/broadband/wifisecurity.htm

It looks like both Florida and Washington are active in prosecutions, so we had both better be careful
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
F/S Ipad 2 64G wifi Fennywald Buy / Sell / Trade - Other 4 01-11-2012 07:13 PM
Wifi over a large distance rjclemen Technology 26 08-12-2011 11:15 PM
Need laptop Wifi help schleygo Technology 6 02-07-2011 09:50 AM
stupid wifi solus Technology 13 08-25-2009 11:16 PM
i need wifi RoyB Off-Topic Discussion 2 10-17-2008 06:30 PM


Copyright © 2014 Tacoma Forum. Tacoma World is not owned by, or affiliated with Toyota Motor Corporation.