VW caught cheating EPA board. 18 BILLION in possible recalls

Somebody correct me here because I'm not sure, but the way I've read the articles on this issue, is that the vehicles "used to certify" (and quite possibly every one on the road but not necessarily) emissions testing during each model's certification had the phony subroutine that showed code readers a perfect running diagnostic. Doesn't mean that the emissions were not working entirely but that they might not be up to the highest standard of cleanliest exhaust. The fact that the certification car was bogus gets multiplied and fined by the number of cars VW sent out the door. The certification car was not required to be sniffed due to the way rules for deisels were written.

If you have a diesel in Commiefornia does it need to be sniffed every year or just code checked?

 

Every car had the phony subroutine that would dupe an emissions test into believing the car would pass. I'm not sure how VW did it, but it sounds like anytime a certain set of parameters that are unique to emissions testing were matched the car went into a different mode of operating the emissions equipment that allowed it to pass emissions tests not only by the EPA but by sniffers as well. It was only detected finally after a university did some emissions testing in situ, which means on the actual road, and the real numbers on emissions were up to 40x the legal level.

Yes, every car has the proper emissions system but when it's running at the level that allows the car to pass emissions the cars performance is extremely poor, like 3000 lbs semi truck poor from what is coming out.

So now VW must not only recall all of those cars, which I guess in stats that don't require smog testing might mean that only the people who want a boat anchor will go in, but VW could also be on the hook for a class action lawsuit since those cars won't meet the MPG stickers or the performance of the car as it was sold. That lawsuit could be worth over 25 billion alone in North America. Also, the fine from the EPA is up to $37,500 per vehicle, which is 18 billion in the USA. The fine may be reduced, and it sounds like the EPA will be nice and only hit VW with a 9 billion dollar fine. Lastly, VW stock has taken a tumble because now >25% of the VW stock on the lots is basically unsalable, which has cost VW somewhere north of 20 billion dollars at this point.

 

well there are a few issues:

1. it's fraud
2. they gained an edge on competition, just by pretending to be better
3. by bypassing the emission system 99.9% of the time VW saved $$ on warranty repairs if said system fails
4. technically all those cars are not street legal anymore (and that applies to all states - even if they don't do emission checks)
5. Even the CEO knew what was going on but let it slide, they could have played the "by accident" card but they didn't even try

 

On #5, it sounds like their legal department told them not to lie because the US department of justice was already beginning to ask questions about who was in the know. If they had of lied, the department of justice might of had grounds to shut down VW operations in North America for an indefinite amount of time...

 

I work 30mls from the only VW plant in the US...all of Chattanooga works there lol

 

Ze Germans!

 

No way can I see a buy-back happening, even though it would be cheaper than the fines.

One of mine is out of warranty, the other is getting close due to mileage. Neither will be going in for this update unless they enact some sort of registration ban until it is updated- no emissions testing in my county. My biggest concern is not the MPG loss or even the power loss from making it compliant, it is the increased risk of fuel system and emission system failures that VW is known for. The HPFP failures are costly and prevalent. I still really dig both cars- my daughter took my Golf to college (drive the Xterra now) and my wife has her Beetle, which is a great car to drive and a lot of fun still, but I certainly don't anticipate the lofty feeling of very good performance and great MPG together will stick around.

 

I was one of them

 

I was close to buying one before the taco (but ended up with an outback) I still like the concept of having a MT TDI wagon...I drove my taco over 400mls on tank stock so I could do some damage with a TDI wagon

 

I agree, a buyback won't happen unless they are forced to do so via class action suit or Justice Department ruling. I could see both scenarios as possible but unlikely. I do think though all VW owners effected should hold onto their VW's because there will likely be some sort of compensation coming.

 

They will settle for way less than 18 billion. The VW groups worldwide profit alone last year was only about 12 billion euros. 18 billion would force them into chapter 11 and if that happens then nobody wins, especially the consumers that were fooled in the first place. Also the 18 billion is just the EPA's fine which is only for about 500K TDI's in the united states since 2009. Over 10 million TDI's have been sold in Europe since 2009 so the EU will also probably have some pretty hefty fines as well. I would feel bad but when the your company was established by the Nazi's you ain't getting any love from me.

 

Does anyone know VW's cash on hand? I think it doesn't matter if the fine is higher than their profit as long as they are financially secure and have some equity they can borrow to cover the fine. I mean, it's not like courts decide fines or payments based just on how much someone makes in a single year. Usually it's more complicated then that.

 

Why would anyone buy a VW in the first place? Those cars are so shitty. I knew 5 people that all had to carry extra coolant in their car and all lagged take off. You would literally hit the gas at a green light and it would just sit there then suddenly take off.

 

They just told stockholders that they set aside 7.6 billion Euros to deal with fines. Their stock price has been dumping so their cost of borrowing money has definitely gone up. And if they filed chapter 11 it would be the US entity alone. VW in Germany is too big to fail and It would get help from the Government if need be.

 

Because DEZUL. Dem mpg's attracted a fair chunk of people.

 

I had one and it never had an issue in 75k miles...it wasn't a diesel though.(<--- those are supposed to last 500k according to some, with a little help)

 

I would trust a Cummins to run for 500K. Not the European crap.

 

I have one thing to say-

-FARFROMSMOGIN-

 

VW has lost 20 billion in stock price alone.

 

Everyone who says diesels burn dirty are right. In a sense it would be better for diesels to get better mpg and pollute less than be clean and get horrible mpg.