WS transmission fluid is garbage . Get it out of your transmission now

Stay with Toyota WS for the Prius, even amsoil says to use Toyota WS. It has something to do with the copper windings in the transmission.

 

That's my hat, you thief.

 

No problem, I posted it for you!

 

I stand corrected, there was a time when there were no recommended alternatives to WS for the Prius, it seems like that is no longer the case. Amsoil now lists their ATL fluid for use in the prius. I'm sure the copper winding issue was more of an issue of a few forum members going around fear mongering anyone that would listen, causing fluid manufacturers to be cautious until further testing could be done. But that's kinda what happened with WS in general.... nobody was really sure what it was in the beginning, we now know that it isn't that special and despite what this thread suggests, I think WS is a pretty good fluid...how many Tacoma transmission failures do you hear about? Or toyota transmission failures in general? That said, there are probably better fluids out there, depending on your definition of "better" I guess. My personal opinion is that WS is just a semi synthetic low viscosity version of dexron, similar to dexron VI. Much in the way that Type IV atf is basically Dexron III. I haven't ever heard of mannol, It will probably be fine in your prius, but I am not in any way qualified to say for sure.
AMSOIL used in transmission fluid...not happy
2011 TOYOTA PRIUS 1.8L 4-cyl Engine Code 2ZR-FXEVariable Fuel

 

something I don't understand is that the fluid has to be at a certain temp. been driving for 40 years and every car or truck with a automatic you checked the fluid hot, even your power steering. I would drive it for 30 minutes or so and check it, longer if it was winter time. why cant you do the same thing and take the plug out with it running and wait for fluid to stop coming out. if nothing comes out top it off and repeat. now I am not taking about a newly rebuild trans or draining the torque converter [ if you can even drain it ]. I am taking about wanting to check the fluid level. to me its a bunch of bs having to take a jumper wire and trying to check it at a certain temp. you check it when its hot because trans fluid expands to get a true reading. I am old school, its stupid that Toyota did not put a dipstick on it. I drove a new Honda accord with the cvt trans and its got a dipstick.

 

"07 sport 4x4" thanks for your posts/advise. I will stick to genuine Toyota products. Do not think Toyota would like to make their cars breaking easily by manufacturing/using 3rd party products (ie: Toyota Genuine ATF WS) that are garbage.
Mannol is a product made in Germany:

https://www.oel-guenstig.de/Automat...WS-Automatic-Special-ATF-Getriebe:11.htoel:ml

Anyway semi-syntetic or full syntetic ATF WS used, it is recommended by Aisin that the ATF is to be changed every 2 years or 20.000km

http://www.aisinaftermarket.jp/en/products/atf/images/atf_a2_CFEx_AFW+.pdf

So I think Aisin has the answer to "WS transmission fluid is garbage . Get it out of your transmission now" by us simply changing ATF WS every 20.000km.

"53wick" I am going to drain the old ATF WS, measure it and add the same amount of fresh ATF WS, providing that there was no leaks in the gearbox.

 

I think WS is a pretty good fluid and serves its purpose well. That said I firmly believe that it needs changing regularly and is certainly not a "lifetime" fluid. Your Prius should be pretty easy to change the fluid in, I think they only hold 3-4 quarts. There are reports of people going well over half a million miles on their original transaxle doing drain and fills with WS every 30,000 miles.

 

Over time I have probably read each of these posts. I was one that posted early on and back then went with Mobil 1 ATF. It was recently posted that years ago, there were no alternatives to WS and we all thought the fluid was magically special in our trucks. I would also support that there was information regarding the fluid used in the Prius and some other transmissions. But with the Prius I beleive they had concerns about the conductivity of the fluid. This and maybe it cooled the windings or something so they did not want it to short out.

Back to the trucks. Today there are many alternate fluids. If you notice, many are approved under various other standards also. Gearcruncher works on or at least back then was a transmission guy. He no doubt saw various failures. No, we don't have Tacomas laying dead on the side of the road from failed transmissions. But simply, WS is really not magic or special. In my opinion WS and it's low viscosity was used to improve mileage and efficiency. The trade off is thinner fluid with less shock and wear properties.

My 2010 will be 6 years old on December 31, 2015. It has less than 52k miles and the last 30k or so have been with the M1. Again, in 2010 / 2011 we had no real or few alternative fluids. I plan to do the fluid change before the end of the year, even with choices, it will get M1 again.

Some of you may also recall I run a completely isolated transmission system. I installed a stand alone cooler so no fluid is run into the radiator and I also installed a spin on filter setup that runs a TRD oil filter, same as the engine, in the trans return line from the cooler.

I run a Scangage II, always on is the trans pan temp. Typical South Florida days in summer see right around 160. Most I have ever seen was 172.

This place is good to share ideas. Whatever fluid you choose to run is fine by me. The distance you run it is also up to you.

If I have any negatives to report after the upcoming flush and fluid change, I will report back.

All the best with it.

PK

 

You obviously know what you are doing... I've got two questions. Do you have pics of your modified trans loop? I'd like to see the location of the filter, and trans cooler.

Secondly, why use M1 again? I looked at the MSDS sheets on it and it looked good, but Mobile 1's official position, was that it was not suitable for WS replacement. Why not use a product that is within spec, such as the Valvoline, or one of the other two dozen alternatives?

 

I went looking for photos, none on this computer or in my gallery which seems odd. Maybe a search might found more info. Anything I have is on the other computer. If I remember, I will take a few photos during the trans fluid change in the next couple of weeks.

M1 again. I do not like to swap fluids if possible. Unless the M1 comes out super nasty, it will go back in. I have had no issues and no complaints. Honestly, I suspect our trucks are pretty easy task for M1 with slightly more viscosity than WS.

PK

 

Right on. Thank you.

 

To clarify, the M1 atf that comes out will not be reused. It will be replaced. My wording sounded like I would reuse the 30k M1 atf. That will not happen.

PK

 

i realize this thread is old and my head hurts from just reading the whole thing but lots of good info so i thought i would share mine. 2009 corolla with 210,000 on it. i took it upon myself to change the pan oil every 30k and oil\filter ever 60k. not knowing how much of it i was actually leaving in the tranny. i have used toyota ws and aisin ws only. i have had zero problems, shifts like it did new, no discoloring when changed at these intervals. thanks

 

150,000 miles, no issues. Evidence just says Toyota WS is not that bad.

 

Flushed the Toyo WS Crap out of my 2013 Taco at 5,000,30,000,and agin at 50,000 miles and added Lubegard platinum and Dr Tranny too now !Shifts much better and cooler too!

 

Bingo. Its an insanely low change interval. It basically screams "this product is crap and wont last" and/or "open your wallet, gaijin!"

 

First point - I freely acknowledge that this forum is made up of die hard Toyota/Tacoma owners who are passionate about maintenance. It still most likely represents a tiny fraction of Toyota/Tacoma owners.

Second Point - The general public most likely listens to whatever Toyota (the manual) recommends. I asked my Toyota tech about changing my transmission fluid at 60K and he said it's not really necessary and recommended against it. I naturally asked "why not". His response was "I've been here for over 10 years and have only done 2 transmission fluid flushes in that time.....and I've seen hundreds of Tacomas with over 100,000 miles and many, many with over 200,000 miles that have run just fine with the original fluid".

So it can't be that bad based on that experience. Good enough for me!

 

My question is when is an aftermarket mfg going to make a tube that is the right length for when the trans is at operating temperature(at idle). This would make the check refill etc. significantly easier.

 

I can summarize it all my own way

AISIN only exists because Toyota. period. research the history of AISIN
to say Toyota owns AISIN (though false) is not much of a stretch

AISIN supplies transmissions for dozen of manufacturers and hundreds of vehicle models and types, not just Toyota
to say AISIN knows transmissions better than anyone else on earth is likely true

If AISIN and Toyota work out a use for a transmission and specify an operating fluid,
to stick with what they recommend can not be, and is not, a wrong choice