Long Life vs Super Long Life coolant

Not sure what formulas Toyota sold in the past, but today they appear to only carry:

Long Life
Ethylene Glycol 107-21-1. 87% - 95%
Diethylene Glycol 111-46-6. Less than 5%
Hydrated inorganic acid, organic acid salts. Less than 5%
Water. Less than 5%

Super Long Life
Ethylene Glycol 107-21-1. 45% - 50%
Hydrated inorganic acid, organic acid salts. Less than 5%
Water. Less than 45% - 50%
Bittering agent

So according to the MSDS, the main difference i can see are the Diethylene Glycol content and Ethylene/water mix.

Does the lack of Diethylene Glycol in Super Long Life make it "Super"? Or are they basically the same and interchangable these days, except one is premixed?

 

You are comparing apples to oranges. The long life has to be mixed 50-50 with water. So divide all the numbers by 2 (except for the water, where you will add 50%)

There's not enough difference to measure, essentially, just with the second you don't dilute it with water when adding to cooling system. And you are probably paying significantly more for that "water" they have premixed in.

 

Thats basically what im getting at.

Its the same product right? Just one is premixed for you. And the premixed is about half the price because it has half the amount of antifreeze/coolant.

The toyota tech was telling me the Super Long Life is for vehicles 2004 and after with alluminum radiators and the Long Life is for vehicles older than 2004.

So i picked up Long Life and mixed it myself for my 98 Tacoma only to later realize that they're the same.

 

My Coolant does not stay in the radiator long enough for Long life to ever matter .

It gets drained for one reason or other.

 

My last tacoma went thru 5 radiators. all trauma realated...birds, deer, tractor...whatever. I quit using Toyota LL coolent back in 2001. No failures of radiators on my other Toyota vehicles.

Radiators are a consumable part, just like brakes and oil changes.

 

I was told the green prestone and the red super long life were interchangeable from my local mechanic, so I used prestone to top off the Toyota antifreeze. I used to change my antifreeze every 3-4 years and switched to the long life green Prestone 4 years after I bought my Tacoma and I feel doing these things cause my water pump to fail prematurely. I feel if I stayed with the Super Long Life red, My water pump gasket wouldn't have leaked prematurely, so the next time I buy a new Toyota, I will stay with the SLL red anti freeze.

 

I've been told by several that TLL coolant is detrimental to the water pump seals.

A good friend of mine has been a Toyota Master Mechanic for some time. His theory is the TLL collant is one of the reason that water pump replacement is so common in Toyota vehicles.

 

What does TLL stand for?

 

Toyota Long Life coolant.

 

Did your Toyota mechanic recommend only using SLL in the 2nd generation trucks, because I believe the TLL caused my water pump to fail prematurely. I only had like 25,000 miles on my 8 year old Tacoma and heard some water pumps can last 100,000 miles.

 

He told me I would be fine to use any decent store brand in either my 1st or 2nd gen vehicles.

My 2nd gen Tundra has had Prestone coolant in it for the last 60,000 miles. The 2nd Gen Tundra's were know to lose a seal in the water pump quite early in their life. Mine is leak free so far.

I see no reason to waste money on TLL coolant when I can get aftermarket coolant for 1/3 the price...And I can get it anywhere.

 

I guess I look at anti freeze like oil and don't like to leave it in the radiator for an extended time period, but feel I'm mistaken in the protection SLL offers. I feel the newer SLL can be left in the radiator longer than conventional antifreeze, but still feel it loses protection over time, so I would still change sooner than the owner's manual recommends, because I alway go by severe service when doing my change intervals.

 

My '15 Tacoma is too new to know about the affects of Toyota SLLC(super long life coolant) - 100K.

But, my '06 Avalon has been running it for 10.5 years - odometer right at 211,000 miles. Original radiator and water pump. No leaks, no noises.

I attribute MORE frequent coolant changes than the mfg. recommended 100K. I drain the block and radiator about every 3 years, just like I would with more traditional coolants.

Post #18 in this thread mentions the difference between the red LLC and the pink SLLC. The guy who wrote that post and started the thread is one of the sharpest techs I've ever followed on the web. Dealer tech - Bend Oregon.

 

Well that settles it. Assuming thats accurate information.

Any Toyota vehicle before 2004 can use LLC or SLLC.

After 2004 you must use SLLC because it doesnt contain the Silicate formula additive aka Diethylene Glycol.

So yeah i regret buying two gallons of LLC and two gallons of distilled water and mixing them and ending up with just under 2 gallons of mixed coolant after completing my flush that i wont need until my next flush. I could have just bought 2 gallons of SLLC premixed and saved a lot of money.

 

I don't agree that distilled water is bad and I think it's better not to have the dissolved minerals. My reasoning is based on iron blocks and aluminum heads and the galvanic reaction of dissimilar metals in the presence of an electrolyte. Having the wrong chemistry in your water seems like a chance I never wanted to take so distilled water and Toyota Red is what ran in my 22R-E. However I run Toyota Pink in my Tacoma.

Otherwise the only thing I found (and which coolant to use in Toyotas has been a debate for at least 20 years that I know of) is that you do not want to mix Toyota Red and regular anti-freeze. I know first hand that doing this leaves a slimy goo in your cooling system. I'm talking about traditional green inorganic coolant, not OAT which can sometimes now be green, too.

 

I have always mixed regular water with coolant for my life if I have had any adverse effects I have not seen them'

I should add every time it has been well water

Most vehicles I keep till I give them away

 

Someone posted this on ToyotaNation and thought it gave some insight to the coolant madness in today's cars, especially Toyota:

Perhaps I can help with the coolant issue. I researched this almost an entire day a while back. I came to the conclusion that there is a specific type of coolant that the Asian engineers decided works best in our cars. The coolant should be made out of ethylene glycols, phosphates (inorganic acid salts) with Organic Acid Technology (which makes it a Hybrid Organic Acid Technology or "HOAT"), no silicates, and no borates or amines (2-EHA is an amine). This means that most coolants on the shelf at your local auto parts store will NOT fit the bill. BUT, it does not have to be the Toyota red or pink coolant, as long as the ingredients are the same. There are a couple of non-Toyota coolant brands that I know of that fit the bill: Beck/Arnley,

Pentosin 8112206 Pentofrost ++ Phosphate Free Antifreeze - 5 Liter

Pentofrost A1 (Made by a German company named Pentosin), Zerex Asian Vehicle formula (but I can't find it in concentrated; only pre-mix). There may be others, but as long as it's a phosphated OAT (HOAT) with no silicates, no borates and no amines, you are good to go. The color DOES NOT MATTER. It's just a dye. As long as the ingredients are the same, that is what counts. Do you think your Toyota can sense what color dye is in your coolant? Huh? I personally don't mix the colors, but if you do it's OK as long as the ingredients are the same. I confirmed this with a Beck/Arnley specialist who told me that their four colors (Red, Pink, Blue, Green) were actually the exact same thing (two are concentrates and two are diluted with a slightly different additive). The colors are ONLY for ease in identification of the coolants because certain auto manufacturers used certain colors. Toyota uses Red (concentrated) or Pink (diluted). The Toyota Red is forward compatible to the newer years as well. The Toyota Pink is not backwards compatible for the older years, like our Camrys. Other Asian companies may use Blue, Green, or whatever. The coolant is THE SAME. Think about it. Car company A sells their own brand of coolant that is X color. Car company B sells another that is Y color, etc. The coolants are the same, but the color dye is different. They do this on purpose to control you and manipulate you into being freaked-out about other colors so that you will buy their over-priced coolant. It's a marketing gimmick designed to burrow deeper into your wallet like a blood-sucking parasite. Follow the money, and you will find the tricksters! Just use a HOAT coolant, and you will have exactly what you need. Why pay $37 for Toyota Red when you can get Beck/Arnley or Pentofrost A1 or some other brand for $25 or even less?? Check the MSDS and see for yourself. Concentrated is more economical, so that's what I get and mix with distilled water. Hope this helps!

 

I think what I'm going to do is buy ZEREK Asian Vehicle Antifreeze/Coolant 50/50 and flush it with distilled water at least 3 times to get as much of the green coolant out as possible, after using prestone flush. ZEREK Asian Vehicle Antifreeze/Coolant 50/50 is about $10 cheaper that Toyota SLL and has the same components needed according to the owner's manual. I was so used to using the green stuff over the years and didn't really think coolants were so different, but now I have a better understand why it's worth paying extra for it.

 

Thats the opposite from what ive been hearing.

My understanding is that SLLC is for vehicles 2004 and newer and is backward compatible with older vehicles. Whereas LLC has added low silicant and was designed for vehicles under 2004 and should not be used in newer vehicles.

 

X2, I think im going the ZEREX ASIAN route when the time comes, the manual says 100k miles for the LLC but I think im changing it out at 75K miles with a flush and new thermostat. seems to have all the recommended by Toyota ingredients plus its half the price of LLC at Walmart.