2005 Tacoma V6 clutch slave cylinder rebuild

The $500 option is designed to continually ride the pressure plate springs.

Similar to other cars on the mark. The two that I can think of off hand, are the T56 transmission in Camaros, and Hyundai Genesis 2.0 Turbos. Straight engagement, not angular like the Tacoma.

Chirping TOB means the bearing is dry, and your quill is likely scuffed and worn as well.

 

I have already read that page and it confirms that the OEM throw out bearing is designed just like ANY TOB on a diaphragm clutch. It is NOT designed for constant contact. It is designed for a gap at the fingers/TOB. Might as well drive with your foot on the pedal. Putting a longer/stiffer spring is doing exactly the same thing albeit at a more controlled pressure.

It appears that Toyota failed to build in sufficient adjustment at the fork to allow for clutch plate wear that reduces the free play at the pressure plate diaphragm/TOB interface. I'm going to try a shorter spring and or make pushrods of varying (shorter) length if the stroke of the SC allows.

 

You can adjust the push-rod behind the pedal.

 

If the throwout bearing is failing it will squeal when the clutch pedal is depressed. That IS NOT the case here. As soon as the pedal is depressed the slightest amount, the bearing is quiet. The "chirping" in this case is from intermittent contact. I once bought a 1978 Dodge Ram that had a bent clutch fork. The TOB would contact the 3 fingers on the Borg & Beck PP when I would put on the brakes. It would rattles as it made uneven contact with the fingers due to the bent fork.

How old were you in 1969? That was when I installed my 1st diaphragm clutch in my 1957 Chevy. The fact remains that this OEM bearing IS NOT designed for constant contact.

How would the quill cause the chirping as long as the TOB can slide freely to the rear under it's own when the SCis removed,. I will be getting into it this weekend. I will see what will need to be done.

IF the fork/TOB will slide freely to the rear to allow more freeplay at the TOB on its own when the SC is removed, I will try shortening the spring.

In 1990 we bought a 1985 VW Golf from a heavy equipment operator. It had 55K on the clock and we sold it in 200 with over 275K on it. It never so much as had a clutch adjustment in all that time and the clutch was in good working order when we sold it. My wife and I will shift a manual into neutral at a red light to prolong TOB life. If a clutch is use properly, the wear on the friction disc will be minimal. It only makes sense to then prolong the life of the TOB.

 

<Sigh> That does not remedy the situation in the bell housing. The design of the slave cylinder will limit the rearward travel of the fork and thus cause issues with the freeplay at the TOB itself. The clutch pedal already has some freeplay however that will be the 1st thing I check. I am already familiar with how the clutch pedal is adjusted.

 

finally somebody who understands how a diaphragm clutch functions . Until Toyota follows through with a revised clutch release bearing like they had to do using the same transmission in the General Motors Camero , we are beating a dead horse here . There is not enough adjustment to prevent the bearing from turning in our Toyota trucks . If you put 10k on a new Toyota truck , the clutch disc wears enough to create constant contact . A horrible design from the very beginning . A factory flaw that Toyota fails to remedy . The new 2017 trucks are already having the same problem . A shorter clutch release bearing giving more adjust-ability is the answer here . This was also an issue with early Fords and they came out with a short release bearing as well .
Its no dam wonder some of these clutches are finished in 15 k

 

I didn't say it'd fix it. Just said it is adjustable. Don't over think it.

Secondly, where did I say the quill caused the chirping??? That is an independant problem, associated with the factory design and material used.

Quit capitalizing "NOT" in reference to my quotes, about the OEM TOB not being designed to continually ride the springs.

If you re-read my earlier quote, you'll find the sentence which says that the "bearing is dry."

Figure out who is debating you and who isn't. I only offered available solutions on the market. But if you want to keep arguing with me, I give you this emoji instead.

 

Problem is, none of your "solutions" solves the problem of no adjustment at the bell housing and the constant contact "solution" is laughable to anyone that understands how a diaphragm clutch and TOB is supposed to work. The $500 solution is a very expensive solution when something much simpler would solve the problem.

If my sone keeps the truck and I end up breaking open the bell housing I will design a real solution that will last 300K miles and cost less than $20 beyond the OEM replacement parts and some drill press style machine work... It seems that everyone else is "over thinking" this when a simple solution is possible with a few modifications to the fork and slave cylinder.

For right now I want to devise a short term solution that will extend what life that is left in the TOB, not shorten it. If it is something that I have to re-visit every 2 or 3 oil changes for now so be it. The access cover and SC are easy enough to get to.

And your generalization that the chirping is due to a dry TOB is making an assumption without specific knowledge. It has been stated in many places that the "chirping" is due to intermittent contact", a 'dry" bearing would also make noise when a load is placed on it and that is not the case.

 

Not my solution. Available solutions. For the record, MY GM TOB works beautifully and precisely, without a peep, nor odd wear, in my T56, which is bolted to my Tacoma. Laugh at that.

And since ranting is getting you no where here, how about you hop off of the interenet and make the fix. Be proactive. I am certain that the community will appreciate the fruits of your future labors, should it the tree produce a fruit.

Here's the thing. No one likes problems that annoy them, and don't get remedied. This forum has thousands of motivated people to make shit happen. Be one.

 

You remind me of that famed epic member of recent. From the "Fook me" thread. Lol

 

Oh shoot. My apologies. I didn't even read the last part of your post, Powerwagon.

With regards to the sentence, "And your generalization that the chirping is due to a dry TOB is making an assumption without specific knowledge." You see, you're the only one assuming here. As I have pulled many of the OEM transmission, repacked, watched others repack the oem TOB, replaced the TOB, installed sleeves, assisted in installing sleeves, and all the related tinkering in there. Dependant upon the miles of the truck, the TOB's were absolutely low on grease of dry.

Apparently I must have been in a

 

Torspd , is there a way we could lubricate the factory release bearing ( PACK ) while the bearing is still in the truck ?
Is there a modification we could make to eliminate the chirping ?
I doubt Toyota will release a shorter bearing or change their bellhousing clearance .
Is Toyota installing inferior bearings that are under greased from the factory ?

 

Had it a hose installed, with a remote nipple perhaps? Could a fitting even have room to be threaded in. I haven't had to mess with one in years.

Better seals would keep the grease in and clutch dust out. If better seals are available?

Either of those requires dropping it though.

Engagement characteristics aside, two things always happen. The OEM bearings dry out, and the aluminum quill gets scored up to a point where the TOB will hang up on it, in worst cases. Seen it.

So regardless of the engagement characteristics, the quill problem needs to be remedied when going in there. Or you'll be going back in there.

Another point to bring up is that the two points of contact between the TOB and the fork, where the TOB pivots on it, are either caked up, or dry as well. Thus preventing the TOB from free floating and inhibiting equal engagement to the springs. Those must be re-greased. However, that grease cannot last before clutch dust impregnates, repeating the cycle. Just the nature of design and environment.

For that last point, that is why the URD TOB has a boot over it. Otherwise it'd look just like this...

 

Same issue as Ford all over again . I have been down this road many times as well .
The boot from URD makes sense .
I wish I had a Tacoma with a manual transmission just so I could experiment with this issue . Even adding a remote grease tube to the factory quill would only possibly solve 1 problem and there are a few issues at play here .
Thanks for the pics as it really helps with diagnostics

 

You're welcome. That is also my current TOB.

Friend's '85 4x4 Toyota pickup, didn't have one chirp. While my '06 did. This was in '08-'09.... I haven't looked, but have always been curious how that TOB design was.

Correct about the tube. This is must have just done the sleeve kit. Greased it and loctite'd the set screws.

Some haven't used thread lock, and had the sset screws come loose.

Had one where the guy's quill was in such bad shape, it snapped off, while trying to repair it. Others have been so worn, that JB weld had to be used to fill the voids between the aluminum quill and sleeve....

 

You are correct in your train of thought but this throw out bearing is set up for constant contact and the noise starts when that solid contact is lost. You already know this based on all the facts you present. Everyone blames the bearing for the noise but the problem lies with the contact between the two not the bearing itself. Everyone that eliminates the noise after replacing the bearing also put in a new pressure plate. My theory is the new bearing and pressure plate are rougher when new at the point of contact which lends to better adhesion and as they wear from use become more polished. Also the finger alignment on the pressure plate with use becomes slightly staggered so you lose contact area so now the chirp starts. I guarantee you with the knowledge you've presented here if you spend one hour under the truck with the slave removed moving the fork by hand with it running in neutral you'll see what's going on. First of all, even when you remove the slave cylinder the fork still keeps the bearing in contact with the pressure plate but without pressure. Be careful with your fingers around the spinning flywheel! Everyone that thinks this bearing doesn't spin 100% of the time is wrong and hasn't checked it out for themselves. Let me explain my personal situation at about 105,000 miles after listening to the chirp for most of its life, I had custom springs made for the slave in varying pressures. When I hit the right one it was silent until I took it apart at about 165,000 miles for other reasons. After taking it apart it was apparent that my release bearing was still in great shape but the fingers were noticeably worn from a lack of pressure earlier in its life. If you doubt these facts look at what Toyota did with their TSB I own all these parts as well. The updated slave cylinder has a longer stiffer spring in it and a longer pushrod, they also have a slightly longer pivot bolt for the fork. All these things add pressure to the backside of the release bearing. I just don't think they added quite enough, my spring was stiffer yet and it silenced it 100% even with all the wear and finger alignment. I strongly encourage you to do your own hands on research before removing the transmission. I agree with everyone about the improvements that are offered in the aftermarket if you do take it apart, but I bet you won't need to.

 

Except my train of thought is that the TOB is not originally designed for constant contact. The fact is, the fingers of the diaphragm will reduce any gap as the clutch disc wears, not increase the gap. If there was constant to start with, the contact pressure would increase as the clutch disc wears.

My "train of thought" is that as the clutch disc wears, the gap that was originally present when new is reduced until intermittent contact occurs thus the "chirp" ensues.

If you got 65K miles after the spring upgrade, then perhaps it would be worth it. Perhaps the light pressure of the sping tensin on the TOB is not enough to cause drastically increased wear.

What I am looking for (if/when I have to break open the bell housing) is a solution where the TOB will last 300K miles or more, as it should, if the only contact is when shifting gears or starting form a stop.

 

It looks like trhey may have done just that. See picture below.

I've been trying to find the thread that showed pictures of the TSB throw out bearing, slave cylinder and fork stud. While the SC push rod is longer and the stud for the fork is different, the TOB is also significantly shorter/thinner.

The way I read the TSB, the fork stud and thnner TOB are to be tried 1st and the longer sc is then employed as a last resort if the fork stud and thinner TOB fail to fix the issue.

HERE, I FOUND IT.

The link above shows PIX of all the components. Here are the old (left) and new (right) TOBs.

 

I don't want to burst your bubble but remember there are two different sizes of release bearings offered but only because there are two different pressure plates used. The TSB bearing if matched correctly will be identical, you are looking at one bearing for the AISIN and one for the LUK. You'll find that when the truck is running and slave is removed you can pull the fork-release bearing away from the pressure plate. Then back in contact trust me it makes an ugly noise every time you do this and would be short lived. This bearing is designed for constant contact the only people that argue this haven't torn one of these apart or don't understand what there looking at.

 

One other thing that might help will be to look at the illustration of the internal components shown clearly in the service bulletin. T-SB-0365-10