What have you done to your Tacoma today? 1st Gen Edition

more as in the cast seam the runs down the spindle on both sides and has the texture from a cast???

 

Andre:

I generally like everything you post in this thread, but there comes a time when I call severe bull shit. There is no crime in claiming you are not sure.

Who gives a shit if the spindle warps after welding in gusset?! It WILL be deformed after you weld in the gusset. You WILL be getting an alignment after you weld in the gussets.

What you stated makes sense, but that dog won't hunt. It's not the final answer.

I'm not here to prove myself correct. Im only here to learn and teach others what i have learned.

Let's express things we have experienced as well as have read about.

If someone wants gusset, then weld those things in. Heat treating isn't going to help or hurt things.

If I was to offer an educated opinion, I think gusset are a very bad idea.

Toyota intended for certain, cheap things to break before more expensive things broke.

Examples:
Tie rods
Control arms
Spindles.

These things are to sacrifice themselves first before you get into bending the frame. They are all super cheap compared to rebuilding the frame.

 

Dude this is basic welding stuff..i don't know how else to explain it. So i will try and find an external source to show what im talking about.

 

Idk if you saw this massive failure.

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/another-spindle-failure-backcountry-dv.473931/

But several professional welders came in and talked about it. I shall dig up where that starts.

 

Still, you can't come out and say you are not sure?

I know you are a young dude, but admit it clearly. You stock will only rise.

FFS, I give up

 

Spindles are cast steel. You can see the seams and rough finish from the casting. Holy crap people are posting too fast to respond to.

You want to preheat the spindle to avoid residual stresses in the spindle after welding on it (or any cast part, like the center section of an axle). By adding a lot of heat to a small area, the more massive spindle will cool down quickly as the heat is dispersed throughout, while the gusset will cool down more slowly. The difference in thermal expansion will cause residual stress, which will lead to cracking and brittle fracture.

@koditten and @Blackdawg you are both basically correct. In fact, good practice would have you preheat anytime you are welding a small piece to a large piece. Also, it is quite possible that the spindles are heat treated to some degree after casting, to make them more malleable (which is why you can bend them back into place @koditten). However, by welding on them and re-introducing heat, you are effectively un-heat treating them, which makes them also more prone to brittle fracture.

 

What?

No..im not saying i am not sure. I have DONE this. I know its the correct way to do it.

I always thought that it was well know that that is the correct way to weld on spindle gussets. I've know about it for years before i even really starting moding my truck...

THANK YOU.

That is what i've been trying to say..

In fact..said it here...https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads...e-backcountry-dv.473931/page-11#post-14349020

Thank you for explaining this better then me

 

After a year, I finally got past my fear of cutting a hole in my fender. Finally installed the snorkel.

 

Which snorkel?

 

I didn't post up in that thread, but I'm of the opinion that the most correct way to do gussets would be to preheat, weld, post heat, then re-heat treat. That way all residual stresses are removed and you have a part that is no more prone to fracture than the original, with the extra strength of the gusset.

 

Well that was one of the four I asked about so my thanks to drr for that info and thank you for reminding me. Tan4x4 was good enough to provide the other 3, which were different.

 

As a fabricator, welding sheet metal to a cast part(or cast steel) isn't going to add much heat to the total part. ( MIG) I guarantee if there is flex on that upper part of the spindle, the sheet steel will tip first.

I've enjoyed this debate, but am not entirely convinced and i hope others are not as well. Like i said. I want to be proven wrong.

BTW I'm not sure cast seams indicate cast parts all the time. Please educate me.

 

This one
https://www.google.com/aclk?sa=l&ai...hUKEwifqPjv-Y7TAhVV9mMKHb0nDvMQpysIjwE&adurl=
Bought it at least a year ago. Leaves a bit of gap at the very front which I already knew was gonna happen. But, I really didn't want to pay $450 for an arb. The compromise was worth it for me. Works great.

 

Much more wallet friendly! added to my watch list You can always add an ARB or Airflow sticker to it

 

If I get industrious again I was thinking I'd heat that area on the front and mold it to fit a little better. IF I get industrious. No hurry.

 

Well, there certainly aren't seams on forged parts
You're right, just the presence of seams doesn't necessarily indicate a casting. I'm going along with your theory that the spindle is designed as an expendable part to save other components (why else would it have that ridiculous 90 degree angle?) and is therefore a low cost, replaceable item.

Edit: also, those gussets aren't sheet metal, they are bent plates. A full seam weld would add a considerable amount of heat to the spindle.

 

I'm heading to bed. Let the discussion roll on. I want to learn.

 

many expo points added..level up!

Was an interesting thread..haha

Id agree with that technique.

Well..you forge steel..and i guess stamped steel other then cast..yes?

http://www.atcgroup.com.au/customcastingforging/thedifferencebetweencastingforging.aspx

Cast things are literally poured into..well a cast. Then the cast is split off the part. They will always leave a seam because of that.

Can it be shaved down? sure. But that's expensive and most things won't be done that way. Be better off just forging it.

 

Would some weather striping fill the gap or how bad is it? Pic?

 

Thx, the plan is save for a trip to WY (wife is from Cheyenne). They have a cabin in medicine bow area. Going there in August in the 4 runner. Wedding.