Transmission R-A60 manual transmission information . Your 6 speed transmissiom (WRITE UP )

I just read this entire thread, and it's been interesting. I think I can stabilize this discussion. At first after reading Gearcruncher's post I was convinced. Particularly because my knowledge of the way TO bearings work is the same. Then I read the counter argument in which on newer cars the TO bearing stays pre-loaded for good reasons. I then read on with excitement because I had no side to be on without some sort of proof. Then someone mentioned inspecting their own and seeing that it does in fact stay in contact. And now we have a video.

Gearcruncher, why have you not responded to the person inspecting their's on a vehicle with only 700 miles on it? Surely that vehicle as not fallen out of adjustment in such a short period of time. And then the video? I think I know why. And I understand. Judging from your apparent many years of mechanical experience and the photo in your avatar, I suspect you are overall up there in your years. You probably went to your transmission school a very long time ago. I'm quite certain you are a very experienced mechanically, but maybe it's hard to teach an old dog new tricks. It seems that auto manufacturers have changed the way they do things now.

This way, there is no need to adjust the clutch. Also, intuition tells you a bearing that spins more wears out faster. Well someone pointed out that the sudden increase of speed and temperature fluctuation wears it out faster. And besides, your argument is very poor. Because clearly we can produce a bearing that can handle spinning constantly. Heck, wheel bearings have a much tougher life to live. I'm sure if you took a TO bearing from a vehicle not designed to be preloaded and put in a truck that is designed to be preloaded that it wouldn't last. These bearings designed to be preloaded are surely built for what they are meant to do, wouldn't you agree?

As for the explanation as to why Tacomas have issues I think is because, well, yes the preload spring in the clutch slave is too weak. But not really, I'm sure it's strong enough when the vehicle is new and the pilot shaft is not worn yet. It is my understanding that the difference types of metal causes wear, correct? So a sloppy guide for the TO bearing with not be able to easily slide against the clutch pressure plate with the small force of the spring in the clutch slave cylinder. This is my theory, what does everyone think? So in order to fix the problem, extra force from a stronger spring gets the job done to keep constant pressure so that it doesn't rattle and screw everything up. Also, Gearcruncher, you mentioned that having constant pressure will wear the clutch out. Yeah, sure, pressure from someones foot. But the pressure applied by a small spring in the clutch slave is not enough to partially engage the clutch, causing premature wear. The solution of a stronger spring is effective as long as it does not cause this to happen. A happy medium sounds like the answer. Just enough to fix the problem but not cause partial clutch engagement.

Gearcruncher, maybe it's time to admit your expertise are not without errors? Realize that this being true explains why Toyota didn't allow for the extra clearance for the TO bearing that you keep bringing up. They didn't need it.

 

Do what you want with your trucks, but it doesn't make sense that toyota would manufacture the TOB to do both; spin only under contact(witness by the material used, and the factory spec - a new TOB doesn't spin when not engaged) and spin constantly, as they do with very little wear. This is probably just planned obsolecence or design incompetence... Our clutches fail because the material wears out from constant spinning, I think toyota would have used a material that could handle the constant load if they put the effort in to redesign how the clutch works.. Doesn't make sense that they design it with materials suited to the way gearcruncher understands them to work while completely redesigning the way they're supposed to function, its half of a good idea..

There are a lot of duct tape fixes for design errors in our trucks, but just because you made the noise stop doesn't mean it was designed to work that way...

 

bdbrown, you obviously don't understand the problem, but you've had a rant. Feel better now? Nothing new here folks.

 

I have a crazy squeal starting now, but I don't feel any real issue with clutch. Would be be enough to just replace the TOB or do I need to replace the whole clutch assembly?

 

If you're in there, you may as well replace it all.

 

Even that isn't enough. You might want to actually read this thread.

 

and now on to a lighter side...

I have a late 2nd Gen. 6 speed apart at the moment and am going through it. If there is anything that you would like to know about it......holler.

There are a couple things I can say about the unit. First, there is nothing inside the later units compatible with the early ones, even though the cases are the same configuration including bolt patterns.

In sourcing parts, just about everything has been revised. For example, there are 4 shift forks used. The early units had all aluminum shift forks. The fork that was frequently breaking was the first gear/second gear/reverse fork, and it is now cast iron or cast steel. The other 3 forks are still aluminum but appear to have been beefed up. Most of all the syncros have been upgraded to either a better multi-part syncro or had a special friction material added to the cone part of the brass, as in the 5-6 syncro, or just beefed up a bit. Even the main input and output shafts themselves and several of the gears have been revised.

In short, it would not be possible to collect a bunch of parts from various years and build a unit without detailed research of the production dates. Without a doubt, if you need to source a replacement transmission try to get one if you can from a Feb. 2014 thru 2015 production end of the 2nd Gen. as most of the factory upgrades have been completed.

Noteworthy though there is no magnet at all inside the case except for the tiny wimpy one used on the drain plug. This is real strange as many of the automatic transmissions and other manuals, and even our transfer case has a large magnet. For this reason alone I would suggest modifying your drain plug to use a stronger neo-magnet or source one. I am installing them in both the drain and fill plugs.

 

Why do you have it apart?

 

It developed a 3rd gear grind early on. Typical response from dealer as it being normal. Sure...

It never got better and I never have had a manual that ground any gear so I wanted to diagnose the problem. The transmission had an amazing amount of grit in it despite frequent changes of gear lube. There are various low spots in the casings that can accumulate stuff that will not come out during draining. The only way I can describe it is most of the debris was not ferrous (not magnetic) but looked like what you would find from sweeping the floor. Honestly. I suppose casting sand from poor washing and who knows what else. There was at least a tablespoon of detritus. Anyway, this stuff ruined most of the bearings including the 3rd gear needle bearing.

 

Mine is getting kind of bad too, but I don't think that is a job for me.

 

It all depends on your skill level and comfort zone. I can tell you that parts in the U.S. are outrageously expensive and replacing just a couple of things will ratchet up the cost real fast. I almost backed out of doing it because of costs but found some foreign sources for substantially less. I guess this is your '08. I just finished a couple minutes ago and am reflecting on what I would advise others. At this point I believe the best route for people would be to find a wreck in the 2/14 to July 2015 production range and swap it.

 

I swapped in a new clutch a month ago, but I won't be cracking the case...at least by myself.

 

There was a revision of 3rd gear so I suspect that you either have a bad gear, bad syncro, excessive clearance between the tips of the gear fork and the slider on the syncro hub, or the needle bearing or all these.

FYI just normal tools will get you a long way but the following are essential:

- The factory manual. Follow step by step to the letter.

- 60mm socket (saw one on ebay last night for about $18 shipped)

- Snap ring pliers. Get a decent one with different size fingers. I used Lisle 49200
for the whole job and not real expensive.

- Press or really good gear puller. I used both but the gear puller can't hit (touch)
the edges of the gears as they may (will?) chip. I have the Harbor Freight 20 ton.
Do not go less, or have a shop do the press work.

- Some way to counter hold the input shaft. It is splined and the Toyota SST is $$$
so I greased the lower couple inches of the shaft, placed a piece of furniture wrap
(Saran Wrap would also work) over the greased part and formed the wrap to the
to the ridges and valleys of the spline. Then I took a cheap oversize socket and filled
it with JB Weld (the traditional stuff), placed it over the wrap. I rotated the shaft for a
while until it started to set to keep it from flowing out. Left it on for about 10 hrs.
and then gently tap, tap, taped it in reverse. Perfect mold and it has worked well.
Let fully cure a few days.

- FIPG. Use only the Toyota orange and not the Permatex stuff to sea the 3 parts of the
case.

 

I saw in the first page that the FJ 6 speed has a different last gear. Does the smaller number mean a lower cruising rpm in 6th? Is it possible to swap this trans in to the Tacoma with no modification?

 

Cool. Thanks for the info.

 

Yes. The FJ version is technically called out as the RA60F1. 6th gear just floats in there (it is not pressed on) and there is some space in the case at that point so I'm thinking the answer is....maybe. The clue may be to see if they share the same shaft. The part number for the case is different but I wonder if it is just the shift tower mount or something??? Who will be the first?

 

.........also, when I was searching sources of parts the RA60 was used in the early Tundra, FJ Cruiser, Cadillac CTS, Camero ('10+), and Holden, an Aussie version of some GM, and maybe some others. As I recall, all of these used a higher 6th (with the Taco being the lowest 6th for some reason.

 

Happy to help.....and I'm just a PM away!

 

I'm doing FJ transfer case end of the year. Maybe I'll do a trans too

 

Well, so much for the JBWeld-spline-socket..........it gave up.

It worked well for turning the input shaft for testing but the JBWeld splines ultimately sheared when trying to use the thing as a counter hold to tighten to 60mm nut on the output shaft.

Better....I took a clutch disc and put it on the input and wedged wood shims around the edge of the disc in about 10 places against the inside of the bell housing, then strapped the trans down to the bench with 2 ratchet straps and torqued the large nut...success. On my trans it took about 165 ft.lbs. to get the nut.