AZ BS Thread 4²0

Well from what im reading they are considered pistols because of how small they are. The mossberg 715p is almost identical.

 

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/mobile/product/90866/redirect

 

Sbr:
As defined by the ATF, a “rifle” is a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder. A short barreled rifle is a rifle with a barrel length less than 16 inches, or overall length of less than 26 inches. As a title II weapon, short barreled rifles are regulated by the ATF and require a $200 tax stamp before being purchased or built. It is important to note that while it is legal to put a stock on a pistol, doing so will create a short barreled rifle. In order to legally create this firearm an application to make and register a firearm (Form 1) needs to be sent to the ATF, and you need to receive back the proper paperwork. If you already have all the pieces to make a short barreled rifle without the proper paperwork you will be in violation of the Gun Control Act and could be charged with possession of a title II weapon.
AR PISTOL:
As defined by the ATF, a “pistol” is a weapon originally designed, made, and intended to fire a projectile from one or more barrels when held in one hand and having (a) a chamber as an integral part of, or permanently aligned with, the bore; and (b) a short stock designed to be gripped by one hand and at an angle to and extending below the line of the bore. An AR pistol is composed of an AR 15 type rifle receiver that has never been barreled and/or stocked as a rifle action. Unlike the short barreled rifle, an AR 15 pistol does not fall under the definition of a title II weapon, and therefore does not require a tax stamp. A receiver that has been previously completed in a rifle configuration is classified by the ATF as a short barreled rifle. In order to prove that a receiver has never been completed in a rifle configuration, you need to obtain certification from the receiver manufacturer. Furthermore make sure your dealer does not describe the receiver as “rifle” on ATF form 4473, the form that is mandatory for a dealer to fill out at the time of purchase.

 

Yes and that doesn’t have a stock on it, as soon as it has a stock installed it is now considered a shoulder firing weapons rather then a single hand pistol and is now an sbr and not a pistol.

 

That is the only type of “stock” that can be installed on it and still be considered a pistol, besides the sig pistol brace that looks like. Stock but had a arm hole to put your forearm in.

 

Yeah but it clearly has the mount for a stock the same as the other guys. He just took a picture with it on.

 

Yeah, im not trying to argue with you about it.

 

That’s because it’s still is an ar15 upper and lower so it will have the same mount holes, but as soon as you install a stock it turns it into something other then a pistol, if it was left the empty hole it’s a pistol.

 

I’m not either just educating, keeps people safe and following laws. I know mike has a lot of guns and other tax stamped items so I’m sure there is nothing wrong with his setup, just explaining the system in response to your statement/questions.

 

Yeah I understand that and appreciate the links. But it does it stay illegal with the stock removed?

 

Trust me on this, I worked for a Class 3 dealer, and I've had many official and unofficial meetings with very nice ATF agents.

"Removable" does not factor in, if you put a stock on a pistol it becomes an SBR. Period.
Taking the stock back off doesn't "undo" the manufacture of a class 3 item, in the eyes of the ATF.

The whole crux of it is that adding the stock "manufactures" it into a short barreled rifle, and that can't be undone.

 

I’d say the only way that it stays legal is if he converts it to a brace and not a buttstock.

 

If there was no stock then it’s legal and would be considered a pistol. But since it’s been pictured with a stock, if the atf saw it they would say it had been created at one point in its life into a rifle, and once that happens it can’t go back and is forever a rifle. Silly rules but that’s how they do it.

 

CERTAINLY!

 

None of my guns are illegal. They are just undocumented.

 

Some of y’all need to take shit to a text message, instead of sitting here debating the legality of other people’s firearms.

Mike ain’t no fool btw, he knows his laws. As with anyone else who makes an informed decision, he either made the legal one, or knowingly made the one he did. Ain’t none of our business. Prob just an extra lower that he already had stamped anyways.

BTW, FTHEATF

 

there are other braces now too.

 

It was the sun lighting up the expended fuel. That particular Elon Musk rocket was headed to deploy 10 low orbit satillites, all were finishing deployment 72 mins after launch according to different articles.

We here in AZ typically see the aftermath of contrails from NM. It was cool to see that out of Vandenberg.

 

Saw it driving home from Buckeye and it was a pretty cool sight. Anyway I think I need to replace my leaf springs finally these AALs on the stock leafs are going to shit.

 

I know but the info was already enough to explain my point and didn’t want to keep beating a dead horse.