Frame replacement - dealership holding my truck ransom

Seems like you got a competent tech who is familiar with the ins and outs. Kudos.

I see what you mean.

Toyota dumped $20k into a 10 year old truck due to their own fault.
Nobody else has this problem. Not even 'shit-tier' Nissan Frontiers.
I saw a mid-80s Ford Ranger in the parking lot of my school today. I looked under it for comparison. Lots of surface rust, but no flaking, bubbling, or any other nonsense.
Morgantown, WV btw. In the mountains.

Full sized Fords, GMs, and Dodges rust through the body in no time flat, but frames don't.
This is completely unjustifiable.

Please stop using the logic of "Toyota fixing their mistake (on the most expensive truck in the sector, mind you) is somehow doing me a favor".
The cult following of the Tacoma and Toyota name plate in general has allowed Toyota's prices to balloon to the top due to Toyota building a reputation of "the highest quality".
Nobody *asked* to need a new frame.
Can you imagine paying top dollar for a truck, and this happens to your wife or teenage child while driving it? On a 7 year old truck? Then someone on the forums says "you should be happy Toyota did you a favor by replacing the frame".

I followed what you were saying. Sometimes it's fun to tango with them on the lies and BS, other times it's just stressful and a hassle. Definitely something to keep in mind when I have less time to work on my own car, but more money.

I'm sure you would

Great idea. That's the direction I should be going in anyway. Thanks for the genuinely solid advice.

Wait, the dealer broke 1 bolt, and then apologized by giving you new control arms, fixing a transmission leak, and giving you $1k credit???? WHAT?


Update:
After thinking about it for more than 5 seconds, I realized what happened.

"You should spray the truck down with penetrating oil days before you start working on it. These trucks have lots of rusty nuts and bolts"
Nah.

"You should at least spray everything over with PB Blaster and let it sit 30 mins before you start working on it...maybe even bring out the torch if some things are seized up"
Nah.

"oops. we brok--- Uh...your shock was too rusted to put back on, so you need to pay us for a new one"

What I'm not okay with is a dealership breaking my parts, and then threatening to keep my truck if I don't pay for the new parts.
Can you imagine the audacity?

An extremely petty and 'professionally rude' representative from the dealership finally called me back. After lots of arm twisting, they agreed to "internally" replace the passenger rear shock.

 

I think I can relate.

 

I just want to know what they say to you after showing them the law suit and what it says

 

They probably put upper control arms in Lower control arms are included in the frame replacement

 

From what I read I understand this:
Frame replacement.
Dealer says rear shocks are rusted and you need to pay and buy new ones to get truck.

- Dealer can't put new shocks on there and bill you without you approving the work. You do not have to pay and if they already installed new shocks you can tell them to remove them.
- Dealer can't legally release truck without rear shocks for you to drive off the lot due to liability.
- You can decline the shocks and tow the truck to your home or a place where you can get shocks.
- You can buy new shocks and give them to the dealer to install with no labor charged.
- You can tell the dealer to install new shocks (if they haven't already) and pay for them.

Now I replaced my rear shocks on my 2007 and the top bolts were pretty rusty. Maybe the dealer is telling the truth that when they removed the shocks they messed up the top bolt due to rust.

Fritz

 

That document is interesting but on that specific line it does not specifically mention something like a strut and since it is a wear item I wonder if that incidental replacement rule would apply... I am curious what the dealer says. I'd probably just pay the small amount and replace the shocks to avoid the trouble though.

 

You got the gist of the situation.

While you are technically right with the options you provided, the details are somewhat important here. For me, it's mostly the mood and attitude that was created in this situation.
Like I said before, the attitude of "break my parts, then hold my truck for ransom" doesn't fly with me.
The dealer didn't mention any of the logical options you provided, nor did they seem to care. The representative much preferred to be a blazing cunt on the phone than to nicely come to an agreement. So I told her to get bent.

Sure, it's possible that the shock bolt got pretty nasty with rust. TBH, this 2005 Tacoma is actually the newest vehicle I've ever owned(I've owned about 15 vehicles, some going back to the late 80s, and I've wrenched on every single one of them), and I've never had a shock bolt break like the one on my truck. Could the nut get rusty and nasty and chip away when putting a socket on it? Sure, I can imagine that. The bolt breaking off due to rust? Hmmmmmm.....try again.
IMO, that's 100% "it's rusted, so I'm gonna just break it off with a breaker bar"

Also, if my shock was too rusted to put back on, why wasn't I told about it 7 days ago when you took the shock off??
To me, that's evidence that they were trying to wait until the last minute so they had me over a barrel about it. "He won't argue $150 to get his truck back, he just got a new frame!"

Yes, you are correct. I read it over a few times, and the 2nd time the rep called me, she seemed to be somewhat well versed with the details of that document as well.

Here's the full quote:
“if any perforation in the frame is found to be 10 mm or larger, then the frame will be replaced, as well as all applicable parts and service items incidental to frame replacement, such as cables, harnesses, pipes, clamps, tubes, hoses, spare tire carrier, spare tire carrier plate, bolts, brackets, and wires and all fluids will be replaced, as required."

For me, the discretion comes in the phrase 'such as'. In my interpretation, using the phrase 'such as' does not imply a complete list.
For example, I could say "when driving, a police officer can pull you over for infractions such as speeding, running a stop sign, or making an improper lane change."

This does not mean that the only 3 things you can be pulled over for are: speeding, running a stop sign, and improper lane change.
It is simply a list of 3 possible examples, and the list of items to be replaced [if broken] during a frame placement is simply of items that are commonly replaced, but does not mean that anything else is strictly excluded.


Additionally, the broken shock can fall under a different category all together - simply a dealership being negligent and damaging your vehicle while in service.
Think - what if a dealer scratches your paint while you take it for an oil change?

I was thinking about it, and I was curious where to draw the line. Surely, if the dealership strips the oil drag plug on your 2018 Tacoma, there's no question.
But what if your car is 20 years old, with 250k miles, and already has a rod knock when you take it to the dealer. And when the tech starts it up to drive it into the service bay, the motor throws a rod. Should the dealer have to pay for a new motor? "WELL IT DIDN'T HAVE A THROWN ROD BEFORE I DROPPED IT OFF TO YOU!!!"
I don't think so, but I don't know where to draw the line. Luckily, I don't own or work in a dealership and that's not my responsibility.
But, what I do know is that the frame replacement settlement is due to extremely excessive rust on an otherwise young vehicle that should not have this flaw. The truck is 12 years old, and if rust has spread to other components and shortened their life prematurely, then the owner should not be punished for making the choice to buy a Toyota under the guise of 'top-tier quality.'

 

Good points.

 

For all that trouble, just buy blisteins elsewhere ( you can get the rears for less than $200] and have them replace them. Dude, not worth the hassle. You did get a free frame out of it.

Rear shocks can be installed in about 10 minutes just using a wrench. All this arguing with them isn’t worth it. Now if it was going to cost you thousands, then I’d be worried.

 

I've already bought a set of shocks and front springs in anticipation of having my frame replaced. I haven't brought it in to get checked yet, I'm going to wait until I'm sure there's a 10 mm hole as I don't want a crappy spray job.

OP, like others said I understand your point but I'd just pay for new shocks and have toyota put them on. Now, if the dealer tries to charge you for the time to put them back on, then you have a legit case and complaint.

 

OP which dealer you take it to? If you end up looking for some used oem shocks, post in the northern va roll call thread and ask. There might be someone local who has a set and willing to let them go cheap. Best of luck.

 

I should have mentioned that as well, I found mine on the forum here, basically unused for I think maybe $200 total? If you look at the 3rd gen section you could maybe find some blue shocks that will give you an inch or so lift in the front.

 

I would think that that doesn't necessarily apply to issues that make the vehicle dangerous to drive. If a mechanic allowed someone to drive a vehicle off their lot without functioning brakes, seems like they'd be asking to get sued.

Then again, I am not a mechanic, a lawyer, or an intelligent person...so there's a good chance I dont actually know what I'm talking about.

 

more or less....

dropped it off around Feb 15th

my service advisor quit after my truck was inspected. frame and parts weren't ordered until after a month had passed from inspection date.

they finally got the frame some 8 months after i dropped it off. while swapping the upper control arms, they busted a bolt. that resulted in another multi week delay while they waited for control arms and bolts to arrive.

sometime in late october i emailed the toyota North American CEO to express my frustration of driving rental cars and pointed out the fact that i bought a truck to do truck things. they offered me 1K credit for my pain and suffering to be used to pay for any parts or service bought at a toyota dealer

when i received the truck back, it was leaking from the rear seal on the transmission. i argued it was because it sat around for 9.5 months. toyota picked up the cost of the seal after i put a new one in. it was only the cost of the part since i did the work. they also replaced a brake line after i saw the old one looked nicked up. these items were not deducted from my credit

 

What you say isn't wrong I think but also does not apply to the OP's situation

 

Did they already install new shocks without getting your authorization? Pretty sure they are not aloud to do any repair or replacement of any component without prior authorization.

 

I feel I'm being trolled. No way can someone complain this much.

I think you are being petty. If you got a bitch about the treatment, write a review.

You will never get this much repair or replacement on anything the rest of your life for such a small investment. Be prepared for much disappointment in the future.

 

I wouldn't assume the dealer will replace parts that you supply for nothing. I brought in new (actually slightly used) UCA's and they wanted to charge $200 to install them. I argued that I was doing them a favor by saving them the trouble of swapping out the crusty old ones. We went back and forth, but they refused to do it for nothing. We finally compromised on $100. I was mad at the time, but looking back I got a new frame, leaf springs, LCA's, etc for nothing on a 11 year old truck so I really had nothing to complain about.

 

I mean...they'd be having to put those parts back on anyway if they were in usable shape, so it's not like they're doing 'extra' work on customer supplied parts. They (the dealership) get paid big $$$$ from Toyota to do frame replacements, so anything else they push for is just them wanting more money.

Of course customer supplied parts won't be warrantied, but that's normal policy for any shop.

 

A lot of people seem to be missing the point here, because I keep getting the same "but you can buy ~brand new 3rd gen suspension for like $200."
So I'm just going to address it here as a group reply.

Yes, I understand. I can buy shocks elsewhere. And I fully intend on doing so. BUT that isn't the issue. The issue is that the dealership tried to claim that they would not release my truck to me unless I paid THEM for THEIR shocks.

The issue is that I'm in Morgantown, WV during the week, and the truck is being serviced at a dealership in DC. I'm only home for the weekends. Because they did not offer other options, we did not discuss any possible compromise, but I assumed that I would not be allowed the time it takes to order parts online, have them shipped, then come back NEXT weekend, and have them put the parts on. BTW, the techs aren't in on Saturday, so it would have to be done monday, and then I couldn't pick it up until the next Saturday. So an additional 2 weeks. They would not (I think I'm assuming the obvious here) allow me to keep the rental car, and hold my truck (racking up storage fees and taking up space on the lot) for another 2 weeks just to avoid paying their ransom. I don't think that would fly with them.

But I'm just assuming you know.

Again, yes, I understand I can get 2017 TRD Off-Road suspension for $200.
I have already looked and found several craigslist listings for people locally with that suspension for sale. Yay me!
That's not the issue.
The issue is that they were trying to force me to pay for new OEM shocks, which I would then have to throw away once I wanted to put MY desired suspension on.

Not to argue with you here, but it seems to me that the compensation you got wasn't really due to a busted bolt at all. It seems the broken bolt was pretty minor, and was simply 'the straw that broke the camel's back'.
It seems to me the real reason was that they took almost a year to give your truck back. That's kinda serious. I'm sure you lost much more in depreciation, car insurance, deterioration of your truck (your trans seal for example) than they compensated you for, but that's a moot point.

Nah you got 100% cheated here buddy, sorry to say. Just grinds my gears. This is beyond ridiculous. You were on the money by doing them a favor having them re-install new, clean UCAs instead of messing with old ones.
Toyota corporate shelling out the 1000s of $$ for a frame and etc doesn't excuse the dealership to be crooks.
Just because your tax return is $5000 this year doesn't make it okay that your TV gets stolen.

Yeah. Couldn't agree more. The dealerships are raking it in on these frame replacements. I'd think they would bend over backwards to have corporate foot the bill for 'questionable' parts to be replaced.
If a customer is happy to get new parts, then they will certainly be more likely to go back to the dealer more often. "John Smith Toyota took real good care of me!"
It seems like a win-win but who knows.

Throw in a year of free oil changes, tire rotations, etc etc etc when buying a new car, but giving the young guy shit about a $100 shock, when he's the target market audience for new Tacomas, and his truck is getting older, high mileage? Come on now, be smart.