Quality difference between Mexico and USA

Makes sense. So comparing a GC vs 4Runner, at the same price point, you are saying American car companies are giving me features, while Toyota is giving me reliability.

Definitely interesting to see from your (engineer) POV

I wish that FCA (obviously have capable engineers), would build lets say a Caravan that is durable and a caravan that is feature rich, and let the customer pick.

Around here people would buy Oddy and Sienna all day, and not touch a free caravan, due to the poor reliability record, even though they essentially invented the van.

Or the Chrysler 200/Dodge Darts. Aside from enterprise rental cars, or credit challenged customers, Coastal demographic don't seem to buy them, they stick with the tried and true corolla/civic.


Appreciate the post! Great perspective and inside baseball

 

I know what you mean, I'm in the factory automation industry, my company is ISO 9001.

 

One thing I wanted to add that goes along with your point is sometimes manufacturers make more money on other models in thier line up by selling on volume and incentives to make up for other lines. For example, Toyota sells a lot more corollas and Camrys than Tacomas so they make up their profit margins there to cover other vehicles that they take “losses” on just to move them off the lot. So when they sell you a corolla for less, they’ll sell 10 of those at a lower price and interest free only to not budge on a Tacoma’s interest rate. Ever wonder why they offer 0% financing on a corolla or rav4 but you’ll never get 0% apr on a Tacoma? That’s why. It’s a money manipulation game. Sell a bunch of corollas or rav4s interest free and then one pro at MSRP with no less than 1.9 - 2.9% apr and they still made thier money cause that one pro covered the discounts on the higher volume vehicle, especially Tacoma’s which practically sell themselves and they know it.

 

Texas built, issues that were corrected. I don't think country of origin is really going to make a difference.

 

In theory, it shouldn’t and you’re right. They use the same automation hardware and robotics to mass manufacture regardless of country. It’s the manual portion of assembly that can vary slightly. A factory that is identical but having issues does not have the same oversight, (but is or should be) technically corrected and usually is because it all has to be apples to apples. There will be anamolies and exceptions regardless of origin in any industry. No one is always perfect but the name of the game is to try to stay on par with each other because it comes down to reputation at the end of the day most don’t know or care where it was assembled. All people know if they get a bad apple is toyota sucks, then word spreads and it’s reverse referral, meaning those who get the lemons will discourage friends and family from making that same mistake. Manufacturers don’t want that at all. Because people don’t make purchasing conditional based on country of assembly origin.

 

Just your data point. Scratched engine cylinder on an early 2016 MT, built in TX. So, I'm not really going to go one way or another.

 

We found the black belt thats triggered

 

Actually, the difference between the Texas and Mexico Factories is the Automation.

 

Question for anyone who has said they prefer the texas truck over the mexican truck citing national pride and patriotic reasons....

Did you purchase the toyota over the ford/chevy/dodge because off proven quality??
Would you purchase the least quality truck in effort to support the american auto mechanic work force??



choosing sub standard products in effort of supporting the homegrown is IMHO ridiculous.... this goes along the lines of "everyone gets a trophy" and we all know what this has done to our youth of today... entitlement is a dangerous thing....
in the long run quality will always trump quantity
the proof is in the pudding

 

Kind of reminds me of the VW debate when the Mk4 models came out. A lot of people were a convinced their German built Jettas were better than Mexican built Jettas. They all fell apart just the same.

 

I had a Pennsylvania built Golf, that was a really good car.

 

Maybe the real question is- would you pay 25% more for a comparable ",quality" American made product over an imported product?

I used to spend time in Germany, and from what I saw there, that culture is willing to pay more for German made- it's more prevalent there than here.

 

I try to spend my money as wisely as possible, if the products are equal, then I would purchase the one I think helps my economy the most.

Tacomas have been a wise purchase so far for me.

 

well said
for me I really love the toyota brand, and as much as I love and want a full size american truck those companies kinda shorted their mid size game, so tacoma seemed like a no brainer for me.
Would love to see this next generation ford ranger really take off. Toyota needs competition and the more competitive these heads get the more options we all have to play with.


I should also add I think taxing as a form of protection is lame...
If you cant step up your game you stink... I see automakers similar to athletes, perform or go night night...
And going night night should not be viewed as an anti patriotic thing.
There is always market space for quality products.

 

While you could argue this point, it’s not necessarily accurate. Toyota doesn’t make a vehicle that they need to take a loss on just to sell.
Can you think of a model that doesn’t sell well?
If you know anything about the TPS and just in time, they only produce certain trims and packages for specific demographical regions. Because, they know in advance that’s what’s going to move. Less thuan 10% of vehicles produced are in the ‘limited’ trim, it’s not a guess, that’s all they sell so that’s all they make.
An outlier to this would be an over zealous GSM, who may think he can sell 5 land cruisers in a month, when the numbers say he can’t.
Using that as example, if put in that position,they will go 10k below invoice on it without much effort, and still make plenty of money. The dealer and Toyota both.
It’s actually the opposite of what you’re stating, they make more money in aftersales, so you could argue they make way more money on corollas and rav’s than they do on anything elses, just based on volume of those sales.

The point about financing incentives is also misleading.
You know why they really offer 0% on some models and not others?
Because a very small percentage of that target demographic actually has the income, and credit fortitude to qualify for it.
It’s a marketing tactic, just because they are offering it doesn’t mean everyone is getting it.
And lastly, they aren’t really ‘not dealing’ on certain models to offset losses on others. They simply just don’t when they don’t have to. Tacoma’s, 4runners and highlanders demand continually outpace availability.
I don’t need to give you anything back on the deal, because if you don’t like the price, someone will walk in right behind you that does.

 

Misunderstanding, I meant to say the ONES and few they do sell for less or take a loss on (not an entire line made to sell for a loss) are made up by say the one TRD PRO that sells over sticker. It goes along with what you’re saying,you are also right about what you are saying in terms of demographic. However, give away one car, another sucker will come in and pay full price for another. It balances out. Always does. But I do agree, all things you’ve said and I’ve said are true. I have family in the business, it’s all a money manipulation game. Give it away here and make up for it there.

A good example is when the Lexus RX350 had a body change a couple years ago, I was waiting for it, then when I went in, they wanted to lease it for $2k down, and $800/Mo payments for like 10K miles a year. I said they are out of their mind this same car hasn’t changed price in MSRP, it was the same as the price of the body just a year before that you could lease for around $369 or so a month. I said I can get a Range Rover for that price and to let me know when you guys get your heads out of your asses. I asked why they were doing that, he said it was a new body, and Asians locally in Southern California were coming paying full price all cash. I told him unless you can show me the itemized line item saying “new body” on the sticker and the price increase for it, I’m walking. So I essentially had to wait until the hype died down and now guess what, the price has adjusted back to what it used to be. I ended up leasing an ES300h hybrid that had the same MSRP as the RX350, $2k down, $365/mo, 12k miles at the time. If apples to apples, then one would look at the msrp, but they have this thing called residual and money factor that plays into leases.

 

Would you happen to know what percentage that Toyota engineers are required to over design the vehicles ? Take the 3.5L for example , is it designed to be able to handle say 10% more load than it does in stock form ? I am not sure how to phrase it but I do know the engineers were I worked would have the operators run our Schuler forming presses at 110% because they were designed to run at 100% with a 10% safety factor.

 

290 posts and you guys haven't figured out an answer? Lol

 

Actually, the answer is "Sashimi".....

 

All of your drivetrain components, including gearing, will have a maximum load rating. Different parts will have different ratings, depending on which component it is. Every component will run at max power and max torque. That is all the engine will develop! It cannot develop any more. Now, what you should consider is things like bearing life. Every component will run at max torque and load, but the life of the component will be reduced by some time. Running it at half load will definite increase the component life. Very seldom does an average drive approach max loads on any drivetrain components. Truthfully, we probably average about 25% of max load, if that. Toyota engineers are pretty damn good at robust design which is why they last a long time.