Brake Upgrade?

I guarantee you they can lock up their 35s.

 

That was what I was referring to.
Another thread recently made me think of it where the guy was asking how to increase payload capacity.

I was at the dump the other day and upon leaving realized unloaded with just me, full tank of gas, recovery gear bin and tonneau cover on my truck is already 5400lbs (gwvr is around 5700)

That's from dual battery, skid plates, sliders and 33s.
Obviously yes you shouldn't overload but I mentioned in that thread how the hell is anyone who off roads and has camping gear etc with them not overweight when you add winch, bumpers etc it's easy to be over that weight.

So in that case although weak point can still be axles and frame at least brakes aren't the weak point if upgrading.

When you're dealing with a bigger heavier wheel it has more inertia which will make it harder to stop. It can get to the point where a it takes a lot more force on the pedal to get it to stop vs if you had a bigger friction point (bigger caliper and rotor)

You're saying the physics is only in the tires and road but it's also in the brakes.
Surface area and friction can all change that stopping power.

If bigger brakes didn't net more stopping power no one would be making them and you wouldn't see cars designed for speed having massive brake systems.

 

When you add in all the weight some carry it's not as easy to lock up lol

I don't get where you get this idea bigger brakes can't help braking. Yet everyone with a big brake kit will tell you the stopping power is different.

 

And everybody who buys an electric supercharger off eBay will tell you they got 15 horsepower out of it. Single-stop performance is down to tires, vehicle weight, suspension geometry, and road surface. I have never encountered a vehicle that even gestured slightly at modernity that was incapable of locking its brakes.

Bigger brakes can add heat capacity, better pedal feel, ability to run a wider selection of pads, or any number of other things, but they are extremely unlikely to add to single stop brake performance. On non-ABS cars you might get a little bit better performance just because less flexible calipers can be a tiny bit easier to modulate.

I get this idea about brakes, btw, from having worked on racing cars for a long, long time.

This is true. The large brakes on performance cars is because of their ability to absorb heat, like on a race track environment, before fading. That's not what you're talking about, you're talking about single-stop capacity, where heat dissipation is not a factor.

 

I'm saying that, if your brakes can get to a locked rotor condition, then it is only tires and the road.
The reason they add big brakes to performance cars is brake fade and heat sink.

Think about it... an example: I am traveling 60 mph in my stock Tacoma. I slam on the brakes and get it to activate ABS. I stop in 120 feet. What would be the advantage of adding bigger brakes? I am already in ABS condition...

Next example: My Tacoma is loaded to 6K total weight. The road is wet. I slam on the brakes at 60 mph and the ABS kicks in. It takes me 200 ft to come to a stop. Why did it take 80 ft more to stop? The answer is heavier load and wet road, not because the brakes didn't do their job.

Lastly, there is a huge difference between slowing down and stopping. Maybe you are getting the two confused?

 

Guess I'm using them as the same, yes obviously if you're locking up the tires will dictate.

But in the case of slowing down and coming to a stop you would get a difference in performance from a bigger brake.

Balance obviously is another big impact on stopping. Some cars lock up much easier than others. Changing the braking system can also change that.

 

i got the EBC slotted rotors and green stuff pads as well. I still have a vibe though in the 38-40mph range

 

I hate how every brake conversation devolves into false axioms about the ability of the OEM system to lock up the brakes.

There is more to a braking a vehicle than how it reacts under ABS in a lock-up condition. It’s a pedal, not a switch.

What do any of us have to gain by shooting down conversations about how to make improvements, anyway?

 

Stopping is different than slowing down. People use it as interchangeable and truthfully, if I am designing a circuit to stop versus designing a circuit to slow down repeatedly like a race car the circuits and components will be vastly different. HOWEVER, in the case of pure stopping distance, both circuits will perform the same.

"Improvement" is in the eye of the beholder. Unless it can be measured, then it is just an opinion. Stopping distances can be measured. Slowing down performance is tough to measure. Brake feel is tough to measure.

Axiom is a good word. Can't figure out how you can have a false true statement tho lol.

 

Lol

 

Just because something is regarded as being true does not make it true. Axioms change. For
Example: The Earth is no longer believed to be flat. Therefor your belief as to the meaning of the word “axiom” is false.

Also, supply does not always equal demand. There is a false axiom in your demonstration against false axioms.

But we should get back to talking about brakes at some point.

 

Back on point: I’m looked into changing my Master Cylinder to one made for the 4Runner, then upgrading to Stop-Techs on all corners.

BUT: I’d need one for a VSC equipped 4Runner, and it looks like the part numbers for the “Hydraulic Brake Booster” which encompasses the Master Cylinder already match my own.

With that in mind - I’m tempted to pull the trigger and see what happens with big-discs all around, powers by my Hydroboost. First I would have to upgrade my wheels to something larger than 16”...

I’m okay with current stopping power. I want finesse. My wife’s 4Runner brakes are fine, the brakes on my H3 were fine, but these feel... less than refined.

 

while driving? If thats the case it may be relating to a balancing issue of your wheels

Prior to changing out my pads and rotors when I hit the brakes my steering wheels shook around so bad I don't even understand how I maintained going in a straight line

 

The earth is flat...
there's even a dedicated group to it being proven that its flat.










I dunno if they need to stop doing drugs or need to start doing drugs though.

 

Just showing you the definition man. If you believe something different that's cool.

 

I dunno if it was real or just a gag online but there was one with Elon Musk asking their twitter why there isn't a flat mars society and they replied because Mars has been observed to be round...

 

OK Back to my question. 2017 Tacoma. Which pad is best?

Brembo?
Hawk?

Other suggestions? Not a lot out there. No TRD, No EBC. Thank you.

 

Stainless steel lines front and rear helps some, but a lot of that spongy/unpredictable feeling comes from the way the drum brakes activate. Only way to solve THAT is to do a 4runner disc conversion or other aftermarket disc brake upgrade in the rear but it's a PUTA install that takes a lot of time, experience, and a good amount of money. Just being real with you man