HELP....Towing question before I sign papers on new RV

Wife and I have decided on a new travel trailer but I'm not sure if my truck can handle it.

Can someone tell me if this is ok or am I gonna be in serious trouble?????????

Here is what I have:
2013 Tacoma DCSB V6 4x4 without factory tow package (GRN245L-PRADKA)
It has a class III receiver with 4 pin connector

The truck manual says 3500 lbs w/o tow package and 6500 lbs with tow package.

The receiver's decal has:
Gross Trailer Wt - 5000 lbs, Max Tongue Wt - 500 lbs
Wt Distribution - 5500 lbs, Max Tongue Wt - 550 lbs

This is what we are wanting to buy:
2018 Gulfstream Vintage Cruiser 19RBS
Specs: Dry Weight 3,161 lbs.
Payload Capacity 1,219 lbs.
Hitch Weight 380 lbs.

I told the salesman up front I do not have the factory tow package.

The salesman claims all I need is the 7 pin connector, brake controller and a WD hitch.
The dealer is going to install the connector and brake controller.
I will purchase the WD Hitch (and sway bars?) and we will set it all up before I leave the dealership.

I took the salesman for his word (probably a mistake) but now after reading the manual and a lot of the posts here I am honestly scared to death that we've gotten ourselves in a bad situation.

Is this gonna work or do I need to stop this deal somehow? I do not want to put my life or others in jeopardy.

If we went forward with this deal, what else would I just have to absolutely do to my truck to make it where its safe......Do I need to spend a ton more on aftermarket parts? Buying a new truck is out of the question.

Thanks in advance!!!!!

 

I am by no means an expert but based on the specs you listed you seem to be within the limits of the trucks capacity. But keep In mind your towards the upper end of max. Personally I think you will be fine just don't expect it to pull like an F350 Diesel.. It will work a bit. I'd think most would agree that trailer brakes are a must. not a huge investment. I would personally add a sumo spring or equivalent to the rear to help with the weight.

 

You're almost at the max towing capacity without including the weight of any gear that you will add to the trailer. You only have 339 lbs of play when it comes to weight, so this is something you might want to think about too. Remember that the tow package has more than just a hitch and light connectors. It has a transmission cooler, brake cooler, oil cooler, etc. If you have an automatic you might want to consider getting a transmission oil cooler. Since it's a V6 it should pull the weight fine, but it's rated at 3500 lbs max for a reason (some mentioned before). If it were me I would look into getting a lighter trailer.

 

You might want to add a transmission cooler if you're truck doesn't have one. I think those came with the factory towing package only.

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong

 

3500 is based on bumper pull (ball in hole in center of bumper).

If your aftermarket hitch is rated for 5000lbs on a truck with an OEM rated hitch exceeding that I would say it should be ok but you might want to have a talk with someone at your dealership to confirm. I don’t like say “it should be ok / don’t worry you will be fine” like many on TW do. I prefer facts and unfortunately this is in a gray area.

 

Tow package stuff can be added (bigger alt, oil cooler, tranny cooler). Airbags or sumo springs help a lot. Brakes and a GOOD wd hitch with sway control are definately needed.
Biggest thing that would make me say no to that trailer is that it is single axle. At that weight on a single axle, you will be less stable. If you lose a tire at speed, you will be more likely to not enjoy the outcome.

 

I tow a 4500lb boat with my factory tow package but dont do long tows. It will pull it but i would recommend a bigger truck if you plan on hilly roads/long drives.

 

Do not buy this trailer as your truck currently is rated to tow only 3500 lbs with a max tongue wt of 350 lbs. It appears that the dealer is trying to sell you a trailer that is more than you’re rated for.

My suggestion would be to find a lighter weight trailer closer to 2500 lbs dry and a tongue wt around 275. You’ll still have to get the 7 pin connector and a brake controller to operate the electric trailer brakes but it won’t be a white knuckle experience.

Again, don’t buy the above quoted Gulfstream.

 

I tow this camper and I have the tow package on my truck. The camper box is only 15 feet long with an overall length of 19.5 feet. It weighs 3200 from the factory but with the stuff added (AC, Gas Bottles, etc.) it weighs 3600. We travel lite so I figure we are at 4200lbs. I did add a larger tranny cooler, brake controller (Prodigy 3), a set of 2K Hellwigs helpers, and a scanguage II to monitor tranny temps. I do know it is there when I tow. It shifts a lot between 3rd and 4th (don't tow in 5th)

 

Ok, I usually harp on safety when towing. Mainly because people try to treat tacos like f650s. But let's take a look at this rationally.

The only factors that affect safety on your rating is the hitch. With a bumper pull you're limited to 350 tongue, 3500 total. That's the weight the bumper can safely handle, not the truck. As far as the truck with a factory tow and without, they're identical.

You've got a class 3/4 receiver which puts you at 600/6000. So as far as weight, you're in spec.

Brakes are next. A small trailer, sub 1500lbs, generally no brakes. Most states require brakes on anything heavier. You're over that. The trailer has electric brakes. What your truck is lacking is a 7 pin connector and a brake controller. A truck with a factory tow package has a 7 pin, still lacking a controller. The truck with and without the package, identical except the wiring.

So for the ops truck to be on equal ground in every way that is important he needs a receiver and 7 pin connection. Safety wise regarding weight with those 2 additions, he has a safe tow package.

Next up is a tranny cooler (assuming he's got an auto). A cooler is not a safety item, at all. A bajiliion miles are towed every year without them. They are a longevity item. It will help an auto tranny live a longer life. It will not help you tow safer.

And then an extra oil cooler. Longevity again.

Next, and I honestly don't remember if the taco package has it, is charging. A heavier duty battery and alternator. Also, not a safety item. It will help you charge the trailer battery without stressing the àlternator. Longevity again.

So tldr, the op already has the hitch, is getting the 7 pin connector installed which puts him on equal ground with factory. The last MUST HAVE is the brake controller. Safety wise he is then 100% ready to tow that trailer.

I'd highly recommend the coolers, again assuming an auto, and would consider the charging upgrade.

Otherwise that trailer is in spec as far as weight. Length wise I definitely wouldn't look any longer and would prefer shorter, but weight he is fine.

It's actually kind of refreshing to see someone asking about this sized trailer compared to the usual "I just bought a 50 foot trailer that weighs 42 bilion pounds and am going to argue with anyone that tells me not o use it" threads we normally see.

 

I pull this trailer without a tow package. It weighs 2900lbs dry. I had the seven pin wiring harness installed along with a brake controller. I use a weight distribution hitch and a sway controller. I have the V6 with a manual. For that reason my truck wouldn't have had the trans cooler, so essentially all I was missing from a tow package equipped truck is a larger alternator and an auxiliary engine oil cooler. As someone above said, nothing that comes in the tow package will make it safer to pull a trailer. I think you'll be fine pulling that trailer.

 

Based on reasonable, rational logic, he's fine (although if automatic, add a transmission cooler...), but based on the truck's supposed specifications, it has a capacity (officially, i.e., in the vehicle's registration, if the cops feel like looking it up) of 3500 pounds, and that is regardless of whether he uses a bumper ball or an aftermarket hitch with a generic "5000" sticker on it.

 

I'm waffling on this one. On paper it will do fine. In reality your weakest link is the 550 tongue weight limit. 380 pounds sounds like the dry tongue weight to me. Add a single 20-lb propane tank (45 pounds tare), a basic group 27 battery (60 pounds), basic WDH (50 pounds), and you are already at the 550 pound limit before you put a single cast iron skillet in your kitchen cabinet.

If it were me I'd replace the hitch with one that can take a 600 pound rating, and even then I'd consider relocating the battery closer to the axle line to offset the cargo weight.

 

The aftermarket hitch can take a lot more than 550 tongue weight. That number doesn't come from tested limits, but rather from the hitch "class", which is 3. They are labeled as "class 3" because the only factory option for a Tacoma with a tow rating above the limit of class 3 comes with a factory hitch, there is therefore no justification for them to sell a class 4 hitch aftermarket, and they have to label it as a class 3 to avoid anyone thinking that the hitch itself can change any element of what the vehicle is registered for.

From a physics point of view, the size of the hitch has more to do with the towing vehicle than it has to do with the load you are pulling with it. Whether you are pulling 3,000 pounds or 10,000, the same amount of force is being exerted on the hitch when you're accelerating full throttle in first gear at 3000 rpm, and similarly when braking, the trailer brakes will reduce the force on the hitch to the same level. In fact, the braking force could be much lower on the hitch with a very heavy trailer, since it is more likely to HAVE brakes. Who *really* installs trailer brakes for 3500 pounds?

The maximum tongue weight is mathematically calculated as 10% of the maximum gross weight of the trailer for the given class.

 

That's a scary thought. If I tie a rope around a 400 lb refrigerator and try to drag it across the driveway or tie that same rope to a little red wagon with my granddaughter in it and pull her, it will feel the same on my hands?

 

Um, what? It honestly terrifies me that people who think its ok to exceed a rating are out sharing the same highways I drive.

The rating does indeed come from tested limits. That's why engineers are paid to be great at math and terrible at parties. They know the sheer strength of every mounting bolt and every weld that goes into a class iii hitch. They design a hitch that can safely handle a given category of tow rating, vehicle placard be damned. We have commercial class V's on our company vehicles that go well beyond the vehicle capabilities. For our work trucks, the vehicle placard is what we use for the tow limit because its the lower number. For OP, his hitch is the low number, and he absolutely should adhere to the limit. What happens if he has 600 pounds of weight on his 550 pound hitch? Probably nothing...the first few times. But that's the terrible truth about stress/strain physics, if you overload a hitch it isnt going to suddenly snap and break in your driveway. Rather, its going to fail a couple of years from now after repeated flexing has weakened a vital part. After 50 trips that went perfectly fine, you hit one perfectly ordinary dip in the highway, and bang. You just killed whoever happened to be tailgating you.

OP's tongue rating is 500 pounds or 550 with WD. (By the way, tongue rating is the uppy-downy force, which is different than the tow rating, the fronty-backy force. Trailer brakes have nothing to do with it.) It's going to be incredibly easy to exceed that rating by orders of magnitude if OP isn't careful.

 

First off, NO aftermarket hitch company is going to put that much into "engineering", and
SECOND, they ALWAYS build in an enormous margin for error on things like this, and
THIRD, once again, the force on the hitch is a function of the vehicle PULLING the trailer, not the weight of the trailer.

 

I think that the physics went completely over your head.

Force = mass * acceleration.
The force comes from what is pulling the object, not the object (fridge, trailer, etc) itself -- the object itself just has inertia "an object will remain in a state of rest or uniform motion unless acted upon by an external unbalanced force".
Your truck pulls a hell of a lot harder than your hands.
400 lb is the mass. This is a constant.
That means that force and acceleration are directly proportional.

So you need to think about it like this: what is the rate of acceleration that you can accomplish with your hands, compared to with your truck at 3500 rpm full throttle in first gear?

Now go at it from a different point of view;
At 3500 rpm full throttle in first gear, what amount of force does your truck generate?
Now we are holding the FORCE as a constant, which is the maximum amount of force that the truck can produce, and we are setting the *mass* as a variable.
When the force is constant, and the mass is a variable, then the *rate of acceleration* changes inversely with the *mass*.

For example:
If Force (F) = 1000 (constant) and Mass (M) = 1, then...
F = M * A
1000 = 1000 * A
A = 1000/1 = 1000.

Now we change to M = 1000
F = M * A
1000 = 1000 * A
A = 1000/1000 = 1

Now we change to M = 10,000
F = M * A
1000 = 10000 * A
A = 1000/10000 = 0.1

You see? Force remains the same, but as mass increases, acceleration decreases.


EDIT: And about the fridge vs little red wagon with your granddaughter.... do you know what would happen if you pulled that red wagon with your granddaugter **as hard as you would have to pull that fridge**? In the least, you would scare the crap out of her, and in the worst, you could hurt her. The force being applied is not constant in that example.

Also, what kind of super heavy duty industrial fridges are you moving around on your driveway? A regular fridge is around 100-150.

 

I'm don't know what kind of safety margin they build into towing hardware, but you can be sure there is one. I know that rigging will have a breaking strength that is 4-6 times the working load limit, just to give you an example. I'm not suggesting that towing hardware has a breaking strength of 6 or even 4 times it's rated capacity, but to suggest that being 50lbs over weight on tongue weight, that's only about 9% over weight, is super dangerous, is false. That's just my opinion, but there it is, to counter what, when it comes down to it, is just your opinion.