TRD Pro Fox or Bilstien 6112 and 5160?

New to the game and I have some questions.

I have been looking into a bilstien set up (6112/5160) but I just came across TRD Pro Fox front and rear suspension.

Which would you go with and Why?

What are your thoughts? Is it a no brainer? Let me know. I am new

 

I’ve been researching this too recently. I have the 6112s on backorder. UCAs, 5160s, and 3 AAL packs are siting in my garage. I feel like I read everything on Tacomaworld regarding the subject.

There are two TRD Pro suspension systems that people have put on the Gen 3. The first was from the Gen 2 TRD Pros and essentially this Bilstein suspension was similar to the Bilstein 6112s and 5160s —I say similar only because the current Bilstein 6112s are adjustable for ride height.

Then there is the current Fox TRD Pro suspension which is made specifically for the Pro. If you can find one someon took off their truck, they are still fairly pricey ($1500 or more). My understanding is that this system is not really like the Fox 2 or 2.5 aftermarket setups. Most people seem to say the the current Fox aftermarket systems are more for off road racing/desert running and too stiff outside of these applications.

 

It depends on what you plan on doing with the truck. In general Bilstein are more digressive while Fox are more progressive shocks.

Digressive shocks great for on road driving (I own the 6112/5160 setup and body roll is MUCH improved over stock). And off road they provide a lot of feeling of “control,” especially if you add a lot of weight. But they can also feel kinda bumpy but it’s a damped bumpy.

Progressive shocks are very forgiving of small frequent bumps off road like water boards and you don’t really feel them too much is what I hear. They also provide good resistance at large unexpected fast hits in the road.


So.... every day driver that is a weekend warrior that loads up a heavy truck and off roads at slow to moderate speeds??? Bilstein

Have an unloaded truck and into fast moving through the desert with frequent washboards and occasional big dips/mounds? Fox


Lastly... Icon makes linear compression and digressive extension shocks. They’re kind of decent at everything and master of none. Good choice especially if you don’t know what you’ll eventually do with your truck. Their stage 2 is decent and in that price range.

 

The TRD suspension is probably the one that would involve the least other work on the truck (ecgs, shims, etc). I've had Icon and King lifts and they're great too, it just depends on how high you want to go, how much weight you intend to carry, and how much additional 'stuff' you're willing to add to make it right.

 

Nice points Sapnjack! Care to comment about how ADS and/or EMU fit into this?

 

I hear ADS is progressive compression and digressive extension, which sounds super interesting. Sounds like that’d be good for on road driving (the digressive extension helping with body roll), and light truck off road fast driving (like Fox/King).

Don’t know much about how OME is valved

 

I’ve been hearing this digressive vs. progressive valving difference/comparison and even watch some very extensive videos on it... My understanding is that shock technology still has an element of “black magic” in it, in that different manufacturers uses different valving to achieve the ride effect the are looking for... how they do it is often somewhat of a trick of the trade so to speak.

BUT, assuming this progressive vs. digressive thing is accurate, I have a couple of questions:

1) If progressive valved shocks are posta handle wash board roads so well, why is it that the cheapie TRD stock OFF ROAD “tuned” Bilstein “digressive valved” shocks handle wash board roads so well? I mean, my teeth jarring ride down 4 miles of flooded out, pot holes and wash board road to the duck club (which coincidentally totally destroyed the suspension of my Silverado 2500) feels like a ride in a Cadillac with those cheapie shocks.

2) If progressive valved shocks are posta be smooth, why is it that most everyone on Tacomaworld say that the Foxes ride so “rough” —especially on wash board roads?

3) Could it be that progressive valved racing shocks are better valved for controlling high speed impacts (say over 40 mph) than digressive valved shocks which might bottom or top out at those speeds?

4) Are progressive shocks easier to keep cool over prolonged use?

5) Do any off-road race trucks run digressive valved shocks, such as Bilsteins?

Finally, what am I missing?

 

I got a lot of my info from this page

https://accutuneoffroad.com/articles/digressive-vs-linear-vs-progressive-pistons-shock-valving/

1) Yea I mean a digressive shock will help "damper" washboard as they're engaged even at low speed movements. So they'll turn your "teeth jarring" ride into something more of a teeth jarring ride with a mouth full of bubble gum. Felt but damped. A progressive shock won't really be engaged at all. Thus the wheels should go up and down freely without any resistance from the shock. Staying with the analogy, it's like removing the teeth all together instead of dampening the teeth. This is personally why I like digressive shock because a damped teeth jarring ride is tolerable and I enjoy all the other off/on road benefits.

2) Foxes ride "rough" when the shocks are engaged. And they are engaged at high speed movements. They'll become super stiff all of a sudden to a sudden large bump in the road. This might feel "rough" but it'll keep you vehicle from bottoming out and causing damage.

3) I personally don't know which shocks will provide more resistance at 40 mph. IDK exactly when progressive really ramp up their resistance. Quote from the above article: "On G-Outs and other slow speed bottoming events digressive shock valving will feel firm and controlled. Progressive shock valving will feel out of control because the suspension will bottom very easily and then spring back up very easily." I'm not an expert, but I'm wondering if 20-40 MPH digressive might provide more dampening/resistance and progressive takes over from there? anyone chime in with more experience?

4) probably since they only provide large resistance at certain times.

5) idk...

 

This is about 4" corrugations for about 180 miles. With potholes going from water drops to axle snappers.

I can only speak to fox because that's what I have a ton of seat time with now. The faster you go, the more they stay planted. Our average speed on those roads is north of 65. Stock, I was lucky to hold 40 and was just absolutely abusing the truck.

I also got the DSC to combat the body roll while going slow on technical trails.

The magic is in the valving and if you really want to get technical, the shimming.

 

I'm undecided on what to purchase, as well. I go back and forth on almost a daily basis between getting a simple 6112/5160 setup with Dakar leaf springs, or going all out with a complete adjustable King or ADS 2.5 kit, shims, Deaver springs, diff drop, TC UCA's, etc.

When it comes to the suspension, I have total mod paralysis at the moment.

My variables and use cases:
1. Fully loaded rack, bed, and RTT, but only in this config for 30% of the year.
2. Light to moderate off-road use when camping/exploring.
3. Longbed sliders, front bumper, and winch.
4. Towing 4000 pound boat+trailer every other weekend during the Spring, Summer, and Fall.
5. Daily driving to/from work, 50+ miles, all year.

I have the money to do either type of setup, but I really don't want to spend extra money if/when I don't really need fully adjustable racing shocks on my rig for the above use cases...or do I?

 

6112/5160 with Dakar leaf pack but stiffer springs in front for the bumper/winch. But I'm also biased haha

 

I run a rack, RTT, about 400lbs in camping gear. Maybe another 100 between spare parts / tools / recovery. Canoe. Battery. Miscellaneous stuff that accumulates.

I actually adjust my rear compression a bit between towing, driving heavy and normal driving.

My set up works well for me. Fwiw

 

an adjustable progressive shock sounds very versatile

 

Haha aren't we all? I think it's just easier to share what we have experience with. And there's certainly value to that

 

I shaved so much time off my trips moving to these. The corners. The corners are so key. They don't push you to the outside on the washboards anymore. The best way I can describe it is you can certainly feel the bumps in your body, but the steering wheel just stays put.

I work 3rd shift and do about 15 months of labor in a 12 month year as a welder. So when I get out of work Friday morning I bang out 5-7 hours north, and the last hour is normally high speed trail. By getting out there faster I now get an extra evening to enjoy. And it's just less stress in general . Love em

 

Nice to hear I'm not the only one! Well said.

That's me as well, and I'm pretty impressed with the stock Bilsteins on the OR. 45mph on gnarly dirt roads, rock crawling, payment in town, etc. On one hand it's pretty great and I don't want to mess that up but on the other hand if there is a next tier up, I want it. And I want the best of both progressive/digressive worlds. ADS's progressive compression and digressive extension, as Sapnjack puts it, sounds pretty cool.

Unfortunately there's rarely a way to try before you buy on these things. I did get to ride a 4runner with a new set of 2.5 ICONs. As people have said here the digressive extension is pretty cool on road and its amazing when jumping off curbs for example, but hitting bumps is kinda harsh. We can have the best of both worlds can't we?

So for me it feel like the Bilstein 6112/5160 clearly represents the best bang for the buck, but I'm curious as to how that might compare to an ADS 2.5 setup.

 

Ya that’s eventually why I went 6112-5160. They were “good enough” at what I wanted to do and obviously a great value. Then I could use the money saved on more camping gear and truck upgrades (rock sliders, lights bars, radios, etc)

 

Smart. Well I like the way you talk about this stuff. Far more intelligent and informed that 99% of what I read. If you get your hands on an ADS suspension I'd love to hear your thoughts.

 

I'm really torn on this as well. I'm getting tired of the hard hits I take in the city on rough downtown streets/manhole covers as well as the body roll and inability of me to take my family off-road much b/c of the roughness of the ride on all but gravel / dirt on the stock OR suspension. It does perform decently on a bit of washboard and gravel/dirt but beyond that it can be rough...

Seems either 6112/5160 or Pro Fox would be an upgrade over the cheap OR Billys so I end up in analysis paralysis myself.

 

All I can say is that the Fox Pro suspension seems to be smoother off road than the stock Bilsteins or the 5100s I had on my 2012. It's just easier to drive and doesn't seem to drift as much over washboard at speed. At slower speeds on rocky trails, it smooths out the bigger bumps well. Hit them at higher speeds and you will feel it, but I can't say the Bilsteins were any different (probably shouldn't be hitting big rocks or holes at speed anyway).

Still, this is far from a no-brainer. If the shocks are all you are doing, maybe the Fox Pro is a good choice if you are going to do some light wheeling. If you are staying stock height and mostly pavement, the Bilsteins are a good, inexpensive choice if it is time for a stock replacement. If you are going to change some other things, like lift, etc., and really want the best off road performance, I'd be looking at other options (King, aftermarket Fox, ADS, OME, maybe ICON). Personally, I was OK with the 5100 Bilsteins for mostly on-road use and occasional off-road, and especially for the cost -- I still have them on our 2WD 4Runner -- but they didn't seem to be much of a game changer off road. Larger bodies than stock gave me more confidence in cooling. But I was just using them as a replacement for worn-out stock shocks.