New generation Toyota truck in 2021?

A source within Toyota told Automotive News that development of the shared-platform pickups is near completion and could be introduced as early as next year for 2021 models. Details of what the shared platform will mean, in terms of design or potential features, remain unknown...

Picture this: Want to beef up your Tacoma drivetrain? Just swap in OEM Tundra parts and you are ready to run bigger tires. UCAs, LCAs, axles, diffs, etc. Who knows what parts will be swappable once the platforms are merged.

 

This is a big piece of it. While the 3.5L isn't fast when it tows, it still doesn't struggle in the slightest with some pretty hefty loads compared to my experiences with compact/mid pickups. You aren't going to get V8 power out of it that lets you climb grades at 70mph spinning 2.5k but you aren't going to overheat or have issues on Vail Pass or the Grapevine. It's an engine that wants revs which isn't necessarily good or bad, just different.

 

I agree that the 3.5l isn't necessarily a bad engine, rather different in terms of high it makes its power. Some owners want a different sort of engine that prioritizes low-end torque over top-end horsepower...for those people, diesels or turbo gasolines would be good options.

I don't see why Toyota couldn't offer those...they have the required expertise with both engine types.

 

Buy a Tundra, leave Taco alone!

 

Durability. I've seen quite a few turbos take a shit because people don't properly care for them (e.g. idle coolodown) and it's a liability for Toyota's reputation for longevity.

Basically, if an NA engine meets the requirements, they're going with that before they toss a turbo in it.

 

Turbo engines are reliable, if they are well designed....Toyota has made more than few of its own.

 

But they aren't generally as reliable as an NA version of the same engine. Any time you add parts you add complexity and multiple points of failure.

Sometimes (e.g. diesel) the good outweighs the bad but given the Tacoma, Jeep, and GM Twin performance against the Ranger, I can't say that it's that much more beneficial here.

 

Naw. I love Cummins but the ISV5.0 is nowhere near on par with their other offerings...and its not based on the Titan. This engine is being used in many other applications as well.

- Fan support bearing/stalling issues recall.
- Overly complicated design compared to the relative simplicity of their ISB engines.
- Difficult to service with a lot of wear parts - again, against their corporate philosophy.
- Problematic emissions system across all iterations and manufacturer applications
- EGR cooler issues
- Injector failure issues
- Turbo speed sensor issues
- Various oil leaks

....so with great personal angst as a Cummins fanboy I will stand by my comments that it's a piece of crap.

 

You can cherry-pick a few bad apples here and there to fulfill your narrative. Most of those issues are not common. It's 5.0l v8 DOHC engine...I think the inline 6 5.9l and 6.7l engines are great too, but a lot of diesel-makers are moving towards DOHC v-configurations for the smaller truck segment (meaning non-commerical applications).

Toyota makes those engines for its overseas offerings and now so does Cummins...any bugs will get worked out over time.

 

Cherry picking and narrative? Stop reaching Atley....I'm a Cummins fan from a long line of Cummins fans. Have them in all of our equipment, our transports, our 10 wheelers, our supers, our tags and our fleet 3/4 and 1 tons. You will not find a bigger Cummins fanboy on this site......whenever its time to check an engine option on the order sheet I fill in the box next to "Cummins".

..and for what it's worth, I have no issues with properly engineered and reliable V8 diesel engines - I was a huge fan of the LBZ.

Go hang out in the Titan forums for a bit. The bitching about the ISV 5.0 makes the 3rd Gen forum seem complimentary. It's an overly complicated design that has already garnered a crappy reputation. No cherry picking is needed, no narrative needs to be filled, the engine sucks in the Titan or out of the Titan. The Titan just adds a cherry to the sundae of suck on this engine.

 

So you're a Cummins fan who got all of his information on the 5.0l's failings from an internet forum....sounds about right.

I take back everything I've said previously and defer to your "expertise."

 

One guy wants it to be wider, one guy wants it to be narrower, the next guy wants longer, the other one wants it shorter. One guy says it’s not powerful enough, the other guy thinks it’s got plenty of power but it needs to be available in different colors. . .

You all sound like a bunch of fucking high school girls. All of you shut the fuck up! The fucking thing is what it is!

Just kidding, carry on....

 

We get a shitload of professional publications and equipment periodicals - it's part of owning a maintaining a fleet of diesel equipped trucks and equipment.

The ISV 5.0 has had a boatload of issues, the Titan is a only a part its market....but you knew that right? You were aware that the issues are not exclusive to the Titan - right?

You've met with Cummins reps at regular tech talks to discuss their products? Right?

You've attended trade shows and talked to fleet operators who have had to maintain these engines - right?

Good for you for admitting you were wrong and taking back everything you said. Takes a big man to admit he's talking about something he knows nothing about. Here's a "like" for your post.

 

If you showed some actual evidence and documented examples rather than relying upon internet gossip and anecdotal stories, I might take your argument more seriously.

 

Ditto:

Show any positive feedback on this truck outside of the Titan Forum or a press release.

I'll wait

Edited:

Let me walk this back a few notches....let's talk about specific issues with the design. I was in the process of scanning magazine articles and decided we should move this back into civility.

The big draw for many of us with regards to Diesel engines are their serviceability. As you put miles on these engines, you begin to appreciate less moving parts and the overall simplicity of the design.

The Cummins inline engines are renown for their simplicity. When side by side with a diesel V8, they have more than 30% less moving parts - which also contributes to its superiority in frictional horsepower loss.

The 5.0 ISV is step backwards. It uses 4 (yes four) timing chains where the current 6.7 uses none. The components are hard to reach and hard to therefore service.

However, there are some excellent V configuration diesel engines, so let's cast aside my personal bias for inline engines and focus on what I consider the worst issue with the ISV 5.0.

The most alarming thing about the ISV is the use of the Bosch CP4.2 HPFP. the 6.7 uses the CP3 which is a proven reliable unit. The CP3 is the unit that VW and Audi TDI owners have turned to to avoid the catastrophic roller failures associated with the CP4.X in that application. Unfortunately, it cannot meet the higher fuel pressures needed in other applications.

https://pocketmags.com/us/diesel-world-magazine/june-2019/articles/554048/why-the-cp4-2-fails

https://globalnews.ca/news/3454109/...-repairs-after-high-pressure-fuel-pump-fails/

https://www.injectorsdirect.com/duramax-lml-lgh-cp4-pump-failure-technical-bulletin/

The CP4 series HPFP has a track record across several product lines for having catastrophic issues due to the lack of lubricity of US spec diesel. The coating on the roller wears away or scores/crazes at which point it eventually seizes, sending shrapnel into the fuel lines and the CR.

This is a catastrophic event that necessitates the removal, cleaning and or replacement of the entire fuel system. In the TDIs this was an 8 to 10K repair. It has also plagued Duramax and Powerstroke diesels and the repair costs are roughly proportional.

Now here's where it gets slightly confusing - several aftermarket companies began selling conversion kits upgrading to a revised CP4.2 HPFP. Eventually, reports began first trickling in, then flooding in that these also eventually fail. In 2019, GM completely abandoned the 4.2 and went with a Denso pump.

At the time that Cummins specced this fuel pump for the ISV 5.0 application, they were well aware of the issues that VWAG, GM and Ford were having on this component, yet they went ahead with speccing it for the ISV.

For this reason alone, I would not touch an ISV 5.0 with a 50' pole.

 

So are 80's Mustangs.

 

You just making my point man.

I realize they're the vehicle of choice of Isis and terrorist cells everywhere. They may not let you down, but the chance of a Tacoma letting me or you down is infinitesimally small as well, and the Tacoma will beat it every day of the week in speed, price and towing capacity (by 100 lbs.). And in the US petrol is almost 10% cheaper than diesel.

I'm not antidiesel (see posts above), I just don't see the rationale for a HiLux here.

 

I don't know about other turbos but Subarus have been a headgasket waiting to happen for years

 

Fake news.

Turbo fear has been around forever. I remember when I bought my Saab in the 80’s people said, don’t buy the turbo version, it’s nothing but trouble. People still saying that.

I’ve had 2 WRX’s and read a ton on forums. The infamous ringland failure is much feared but rarely seen in the wild, except among modders who stress the engine too much. I’ve never had any major issues with any of my 4 turbo vehicles.

Seriously, WRX and Subaru and turbo reliability in general is very good compared to other vehicles.

 

A MT Tundra...