Let's Talk About EV Conversion

Nates green garage in Berkeley could probably do the conversion. Nate is a hybrid specialist and does conversons on the side. He's done a few..77 Volvo 240 and a 72 vw super beetle, among others. Both were clean and looked stock, til you popped the hoods.

 

Until the energy density get better, or low voltage charge times decrease (i.e. being able to charge your batts off portable solar), I really can't see EV's being good for anything but short off-road trails. I'm all over electric for commuting or around town errands, even for longer trips (as long as they are on populated routes), but EV tech just isn't there for what I typically would use it for (aside from commuting).

Either longer off-road trips or long camping trips towing a trailer where there isn't a fast charge station for 300 miles.

 

I'm glad you think my brain dump was elegant haha

 

Better than the caveman grunts that I come up with.

 

lexus rx450 hybrid have electric motor for rear wheel. we could do something like this have front and rear motor to retain 4x4 function

 

I remember an episode of Monster Garage or some similar show, where they installed a second gas motor to drive the front wheels of some old car and it was a nightmare because the front and rear wheels were trying to spin at different RPMs. That's something a transfer case mechanically solves, but it's also a weakness/inefficiency in the system.

So would running two separate electric motors really work for 4WD? I suppose with the proper motor controller setup you could get it dialed in so they're always going the same speed, but I'd be worried that one motor would want to spin faster than the other and drag the other set of wheels along.

I imagine because of the offset of the two differentials you could mount the motors side-by-side on the transmission mount. These would be up high enough to avoid water damage, I think?

 

I think one major hurdle on EV Conversions is going to be running your accessories. It's very simple to do with a gas motor that's always idling, but how do you propose to run your power steering, heating/air conditioning and power brakes?

I've seen people install a small vacuum pump and accumulator tank to connect to the OEM brake vacuum booster and it looks fairly simple. I'd be somewhat concerned about reliability, but this looks easy to implement.

Power steering would be much harder because that runs on fairly high pressure and would need to be a continuous duty pump. It's going to hurt your range. How do modern EVs do power steering? Is it just small motors that turn the steering rack on demand?

A/C and Heating. Ouch, this one is going to really be inefficient to run. Another motor to run the compressor, and a radiant heating element. Some EVs, like Teslas, have a liquid coolant system for the motors and batteries, so if you're going that route you could maybe keep the radiator and heater core in place to simplify part of this problem.

 

Might be more efficient to heat the seats and use a much smaller element to warm the air, same as mirrors and window elements. In cold climates people use block heaters and remote start. If it's already plugged in that can be easily taken care of since you'll need the power pack to be kept warm instead of the block. We already have portable electric fridge units so both technologies are already there, just need to be scaled appropriately. No more worries about running an IC motor in a closed garage.

 

Subbed out of curiosity.

 

Our trucks are fairly simple, but there's still quite a few things run by the ECU. Another concern of mine is that when you remove the engine, your check engine light is going to be permanently on. I mean, what effect will this have on the computer? I think I can skirt the issue with emissions after I hit the 25-year mark and apply for Historic Plates in AZ - no more emissions test. Or maybe converting it to electric will qualify you to apply for a "clean air" vehicle plate, which don't require emissions tests either.

Will the Automatic Differential Disconnect work? (I just looked this up and it appears to be vacuum activated, so there should be no problem here.)

What about Power Windows and Locks? Cruise control is clearly out, unless you are able to program that on your motor controller.

The Gauge Cluster will obviously not work, and I can get over that through the use of an LCD or something in its place.

What about things like turn signals and brake lights?

 

To start with you might have to go back to an old fashioned magnets on the drive shaft and throttle actuator for cruise but that seems like an obvious aftermarket EV nitch. Given that there are already EV's around it might even be possible to transplant an entire control system and pretend your taco is a Bolt or some other plug in. The harness would likely need some extensions to reach different places.

 

Electric motor controls are far more fine grained that those of a gas motor, keeping them at the same speed wont be a problem. . If you want to.

But without a transfer case the front and rear axles would no longer be mechanically linked, so there would be no binding in corners, which is great. But, since you're powering the front and rear independently, you don't have the problem of having a differential in the middle like an AWD system..

It would really be the best features of 4x4 and AWD.

 

I don't see why you would have an Engine Control Unit without an engine. It would go away. The check engine light would be disconnected.

The legal side I have not researched, probably different in every state.

You'd need a vacuum pump to run the ADD if it's vacuum actuated. I'd probably want to convert that to something electrical, although mine has locking hubs anyway.

For the gauge cluster I can find a way to recreate the inputs to run the 4 gauges we've got. It's not magic.

The rest of it is just a matter of of keeping a 12v system to run all the 12v accessories - lights windows etc.

They make electric ac compressors. It shouldn't be hard to find an electric hyrdraulic pump to run power steering.


It all seems doable to me, it's just a matter of committing the research time and money.

 

After looking at battery prices, I'm hoping my 3.4L lasts another 5 years! Holy crap. If I wanted to run a Tesla battery (and who wouldn't?), it would run $20K - for just the modules!

Also, it would be an interesting challenge to distribute the weight. The Tesla Model S (78 kWh) has 15 battery modules weighing in at 58 pounds each (870 pounds total) and having a dimension about the size of the truck bed if laid flat (6 ft. x 4.5 ft). Google says the 5VZFE weighs 420 pounds, and a Hyper 9 electric motor weighs 120. So we could fit about 5 modules under the hood, leaving 10 modules (558 lbs) for the bed area. Wow, I can see why most EV conversions compromise severely on battery capacity/range, with the cheapest conversions having a range of 30-60 miles on a charge.

I drive my truck about 150 miles a day, so the no-compromises approach is starting to look unattainable unless I can wait for prices to come down.

 

A diy ev dd is a bad idea if it's your only vehicle. If the power goes out, you have 1 charge and then you're dead, no 5g savior can is going to get you to work.

I looked into doing an ev a while back, haven't done it yet.

Batteries and weight are the problems. Cost for new is insane if you're going the tesla route. The cheap way to go is used lead acid and a forklift motor. But you're going to have slow speeds, no bells and whistles, and your entire truck bed is full of heavy batteries by the time you get any usable range. If your daily commute is 20 miles round trip, pretty doable on the cheap.

To get better range you want to upgrade to a better motor, that will also provide some regenerative charging. Those motors and controllers are $$$. For batteries you can look for wrecked tesla (still $$$$$) or other ev and part them. Tesla actually uses a LOT of AA sized cells, wired together into bricks, wired together to actually make their 'battery'. You can buy a LOT of new cells and the holders and wire them together yourself. $$$ instead of $$$$$. The same cells though are used in many laptops and power tools. When a laptop battery goes bad, usually only a few of the cells are actually trash, the rest can be salvaged. A lot of diyers buy a ton of scrap batteries and keep the good cells. That is only $ but it can take a long time to get enough cells to make a useable battery.

Tesla can do what it does because it was designed from the ground up to minimize weight and drag. Even the tires are designed to help. They're not starting with a solid steel brick on wheels.

Getting 150 miles + reserve out of a diy project.... I'd just buy a tesla.

 

Toyota did such an amazing job with these trucks why would you butcher one in the name of an EV conversion!?!?!? If you really want to do an EV get a mid 90s manual ranger lol. My grandfather helped his neighbor do a conversion on a 94 4cyl manual ranger 2wd. Pulled the engine and put a big forklift motor in there, connected a bunch of lead acid batteries in the bed... I was 7 so I don't know the finer details but I know it ran, and I know it got about 100miles to the charge and took 11hrs to charge from his wall

But on a more serious note this isn't cost effective at all... @jbrandt is correct about the energy density being the biggest hurdle as far as usability of the truck and @Indy is correct about cost. Do NOT think you can safely construct a complete battery cell from recycled AA sized cells in laptops. Sure you can solder contacts together and have something that works, but what about an accident? I work with industrial electricity so my battery knowledge is minimal in comparison to everything there is to know, but let me tell you guys .. your DIY battery pack is a cake walk to trying to make a DIY battery controller. And the cost of a commercial off the shelf one is going to be equal to that of propane conversion.


Which brings me to my point in this debate and what I would like to do. Get a propane conversion kit and change the jet sizes to accept CNG instead.. Ive done this conversion on power equipment so I know it works, and I've seen tractors run off wood gasifiers so it's feasible (sure distance goes completely in the shittier) but that way I can make my own "fuel" with rotting biomass and be completely off grid but still keep full functionality of my truck

 

This is only "extremely simple" on paper. The amount of electrical engineering knowledge you would need to even be your own maintenance guy on an electrical vehicle is a multi year degree. Not to mention motors still have moving parts, bearings need serviced and such. Industrial motors last like they do because they get set up perfectly once and then never move! Electric motors in vehicles is a whole new world we haven't touched yet for longevity.. lotta road vibrations you know?


why do you think there are more mechanics than electricians?

 

Just NO! It is easier to grab 5 gallons of gas when you run out fuel in the middle of nowhere than it is to recharge a F'n battery. On top of that, once you have an electrical problem, the whole system is affected. It is a novelty idea and very "tree hugger" friendly, but in the real world where logic is used, reliable electric driven vehicles that can be comparable to fossil fuel vehicles are many decades away from being even close. Just no.

 

I can kind of buy the "butchery" argument on classic car conversions, but come on... our trucks were never rare or collectors items.

There are plenty of examples of DIY'ers without a specialized degree who have done these conversions and to suggest that it's required is baffling. The actual formulas for voltage, wattage, amperage, etc. are very simple multiplication. An electric motor has like 10 parts, vs. hundreds of parts for an ICE, and that is part of what makes them so reliable, even in vehicle applications. Troubleshooting and maintenance would be a piece of cake compared to what we're dealing with now.

It's okay if you're not on board with electric cars, I just don't see these as valid criticisms.

 

I'm not interested in an EV conversion because it's easier or cheaper than gas. I'm not even making the argument that it's more practical. Certainly if you use your truck for going deep into the wilderness, it's just not going to be an option for you (yet). I use my truck almost exclusively for driving around town, with the occasional camping trip or something. I'm the perfect candidate for electric, and I am attracted to the benefits of what an electric motor can do. After looking at batteries, though, I am feeling a bit discouraged by the price.