1st gen brakes suck. What improvments can be made short of the Tundra swap?

I've already changed out pads/rotors/shoes/drums/lines/proportioning valve. (Valve and lines came with the new chassis). Brakes still suck compared to 2nd gen+ Tacomas, and pretty much every other truck out there. With 4-piston calipers, one would think we'd have some serious stopping power, but this is not the case it would seem. Short of the Tacoma parts swap, is there anything else that can be addressed? Is there a master cylinder "upgrade" available? I've got an old Pontiac with a mushy GM pedal, but will still put you through the windshield if need be... Thoughts from the community?

 

Powerstop setup, in short of TBU

 

Powerstop drilled and slotted already installed...

 

Dang, my previous Tacoma brake change to powerstop made a difference. Not night and day difference, but enough to notice the shorter stopping distance. Then there's not much option left beside TBU.

 

How many pistons do the factory calipers on the 2nd Gens have?

 

I am unsure what your resistance to the Tundra brake swap is, unless you have incompatible rims. It is the answer to your problem.

My old 2001 Taco has them but my current 2004 Taco does not. I drove the '01 last week for the first time in a while and was surprised all over again at how well it stopped, since I'm used to the '04 now (which also has to stop 34s with those little brakes). I plan to do the upgrade to the '04 as soon as the front brakes need attention.

I would have done the swap when you got new pads and rotors, since the Tundra versions cost about the same (when I did it). The additional parts to buy are unloaded Tundra calipers (I always got OEM rotors and unchamfered pads), and stainless lines from Wheeler's.

Sorry to hear that you keep chasing this down through other means; I've been there before too.

 

You got something else going on if you can't lock up your tires. I did new pads and rotors and noticed right after I could lock up the tires. Locked em up on interstate. Unless you have tons of added weight or huge tires or etc., your brakes should be able to lock up, unless you have ABS. but then you should feel your ABS engage instead of locking tires up. Something up with your system, would be my guess

 

Unless a 2.7 5spd has different brake calipers than a 3.4 auto, you shouldn’t have any braking problems.

I would double check your brake components. Make sure the brakes are bleed throughly with new brake fluid. Maybe changing to SS lines would help?

Btw... slotted/drill rotors gives you less braking surface. For a truck and most vehicles, the more braking surface you have the better.

 

Glad you got it working. My old '97 4Runner has the same brake components. When new it would stop on a dime. My son now drives it with 275K miles. A year ago I drove it and just about got the crap scared out of me. It just wouldn't stop. I could never get the tires to lock or the ABS to even kick in. I replaced the master cylinder, vacuum assist, all new pads, & bled everything with new fluid. It improved but I could never get a good stop like when new. Finally I just took it to a mechanic I trusted and said make it stop. I'm embarrassed to say that all they did was take each component apart, clean and re-greased everything so it moved smoothly - especially the rear brakes. $100 later and now stops on a dime again. Make sure everything that is suppose to move can move freely. Grease those contact points. Make sure the parking brake components aren't binding open or closed.

 

Yeah, that stuff should be a given and I make suggestions based on those basics being done.... Good point on reminding about it though. You should notice abnormal pad wear if the pads or rotors are binding up or sticking somewhere. That absolutely would feel like you described

 

Bite the bullet and go with the Tundra calipers and rotors. The truck stops like my Porsche with Carbon Ceramic Brakes. no joke.

 

Honestly, I've never felt that my brakes were "inferior". I've had at least a few panic stops in the Tacoma over the years, and my 100% stock brakes have always done just fine.

Sounds like you just have air in the lines... or maybe you never use the E-brake so your rear brakes aren't adjusted and you're relying too much on the front brakes.

 

I have never had an issue with brakes - all original stock brake components which besides pads and rotors I have never touched since new (1995). I have 15 inch rims with BFG KO2 30x9.5R15 tires and no ABS. Because I have no ABS and KO2 are not the best grippers even on the dry pavement, I need to be very careful to not lock wheels. But I remember even with Michelin M/S once I had screaming stop with wheels locked (someone running stop sign) on dry paved road.

I think the Tundra upgrade is needed only when you use oversize tires then stock rotors and pads might not be strong enough. But with stock wheel size does not matter if you are loaded or towing, stock brakes should be good enough to lock wheels.

 

I use the parking brake multiple times a day. Are the rears self-adjusting? I may need to take a look there. The parking brake uses the other side of the shoes than the main braking cylinder. Right now, cost is a factor in upgrading to Tundra parts. I would think that the existing 4-piston calipers would be badass, but apparently not. Dealership bled the brakes last summer when they replaced the chassis, but I can certainly do them again. If I recall, one of the rear wheels locks up before the fronts, causing the ABS to pitch a fit. I usually pull the ABS fuses because I'm certainly capable of driving without it...

 

I can all but guarantee that whatever problem you're having now will not go away if you upgrade to Tundra brakes. Rotor and caliper size is not your problem. Something else is wrong.

The E-brake is what adjusts the rear brakes, so since you use it regularly, that should be fine.

It's also possible to get air in the ABS module. It think that even though the ABS system is "transparent" to the braking system (until it's needed), if you get air in the module, that's not going to come out during normal bleeding procedures.

So do your rear wheels both lock up evenly without the ABS fuses?

 

Put on some stainless steel brake lines...the Stoptech ones I installed provided a noticeable improvement in braking on the stock Tacoma brake setup.

But I agree with the others, if your truck is all stock the brakes should feel more than adequate. Mine still feel ok even with 33 in tires and a bunch of armor weight on it.

 

That seems like a great price for the outcome. I feel like @Backinblack03 should try and clean existing parts before throwing the new parts cannon at the problem.

 

On my last safety inspection check they found my rear driver side brake does a marginal job on main brakes but still good on ebrake. What I found the center pivot point for the cable was frozen, so while the ebrake still engaged it did not adjust shoes anymore (did not retract back enough to engage the adjusting lever with the next tooth. So even ebrake works it does not mean it is fully functional. That center pivot point (mounted to the diff pumpkin) must be working. My California truck has no rust but still the pivot point was frozen.

 

good info! Thanks!

will have to check mine...

 

"brakes still suck" is a matter of perspective, what you have is probably doing its intended job but you want "more'... you could simply have the wrong pads for what you want to feel. Here is a link to a much better explanation than I can give you. https://idpartsblog.com/2019/04/11/what-do-brake-pad-friction-ratings-mean/