Dirt King LCAs

I took some rough measurements this morning. It appears the setup would work, the Dirt King setup has a bolt which is slightly longer than the Delta Joint overall height. This is not an issue however because there is space above the top of the control arm which is wasted by the upper misalignment spacer and the bolt itself. The Delta Joint is flat so it would sit recessed inside the control arm so that makes the need for a longer overall bolt unnecessary.

After taking some rough measurements I appear to be missing just about 2mm in overall length for the Icon Delta Joint over the Dirt King LCA bolt which is trivial really. I may take measurements again and do the math again just to be sure, but speaking on a preliminary basis, it appears like it will work! I'll update during my lunch in the afternoon.

 

I have an update and though small, most likely not significant in impact and not what those in interest may want to hear.

Just to humor myself I spoke to Dustin at Dirt King and he indicates to me that both the upper and the lower ball joints for our trucks are two different part numbers if you search up OE reference and if you search Moogs website. He says it would not be a good idea to attempt a Delta Joint retrofit into the lower control arm because the taper on the bolts are specifically made to fit uppers and even if it fits, if the joint locking point on the taper pins sits somewhere different the joint as a whole would not necessarily sit perfectly center and that may create travel issues both upward and downward. Now how much merit in what he says has I'm not sure and the small possibility that he may just be trying to sell me brand new lowers it does exist.

As of right now I have no inclination to say one way or the other, but based on quick specification references that I came across on Moogs website tells me the difference in taper between original style upper and lower ball joints is about .230 inches. Translated to millimeter readout is about 5 mm. This is NOT the uniball design which we run and difference in taper may exist between OE and DK uppers and lower uniballs designs.

The thing that bothers me and what he is talking about is that upon comparing upper and lower misalignment spacers they appear virtually the same and fitment is 100% equal as far as upper and lower uniballs goes. I guess the only real way to know would be to actually buy a Delta joint kit retrofitted on to the lower arms as needed remove my coilovers and cycle the suspension to see where everything with land and how much movement that would be in the Delta joints.

Bear in mind what I'm saying which he told me is not verbatim, but that was the basic gist of what we spoke about.

I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place right now on what my next move should be for the lowers. $280 for a non returnable item is a big gamble to take.

 

Can you not get a Moog retrofit like the Gen 3 version of the Dirt King LCAs? Or was the mount changed so you have to replace the whole LCA?

 

Well there are two options in this situation, either get new lower control arms or remove the uniball portion of the cup and weld up a new cup which accepts the size of the new Moog style ball joint. One is easier than the other, but it also requires fabrication, the other takes the obvious amount of work. Neither is necessarily a desirable nor easy venture to head down.

Part of me really is tempted to just say screw it and try out the Delta Joint anyways and prove Icon and DK wrong.

 

No I don't think I have them anymore. Here's another pic that really shows the camber. Is it a defect in the LCAs or an adjustment? The UCAs aren't heim joints so idk what else would be causing the camber. Almost like LT UCA combined with stock length LCA

DK gave me a deal on these LCAs saying they're were slightly used from a show truck. I'm working myself up here.

 

Definitely looks like a LT UCA, and stock length LCA...
Looks like a kid having the pee pee dance

 

oh. i see. that is hard to miss.

 

No the bolts on the Delta Joints do not use misalignment spacers. What they use in place of the spacers are a pin which starts off a certain size and then gets bigger at a certain part of the length of the bolt which allows the bolt to stop going into the opening of the spindle.

Does that make sense? I hope it does. Lol.

 

I still hope you do it. Seemed like such a good idea.

 

Your camber is HELLA positive!

Get the alignment inspected and if the camber is further adjustable than what it currently is then you are good to go and shod be able to get them adjusted.

I'm still incredibly tempted.

If I decide to shoot for it I will update those following in interest.

If people want to donate to the cause for the R&D (so the speak) just in case the Delta Joints don't work out that would be awesome, but a pipe dream I'm sure. Lol.

 

Pulled from @deeezy build

Here are some pics of the new taper on the BJ cup and the recessed shock mount.

 

Regarding the taper, as I have a 4R currently with taco spindles and 4R lower spindle adapter, I am quite familiar with the tapers on both UCA and LCA. The first set of DK UCAs I got were universal for 4R and taco, however the spindle tapers are different. At the time I was running my original 4R spindles. The UCA adapter seemed to fit well, it would fit into the spindle hole and seem snug when trying to shift it around pushing perpendicular to the mounting plane of the spindle, but when applying force to the top to "tip" the adapter, it was loose (this was discovered after the following issues). As a result I cracked 2 pairs of the SS adapters and DK couldn't figure it out, they just kept sending me new ones.

I then bent my spindles and got a new taco pair, and at the same time called DK about a new set of adapters and they informed me that they now have 4R and taco specific adapters. These are quite snug in the spindle and you cannot tip the adapter in the spindle. I will also note that they just sent me my 4th pair for the UCA when I ordered these LCAs and I cracked the taco version on the taco spindle, so IDK, and yes the bolt has always been tight as I am very anal about them with the issues I have had.

While this isn't directly applicable to the LCA, the taper may appear the same and the adapters may look to be identical, but a very small difference in fit can result in failure of the adapter and possibly other parts like the bolt if driven with a broken/loose adapter for awhile. I am not saying that they are not, but beware.

 

I made the switch to the BJ version as I needed new bushings and unis anyway and DK hooked me up with a scratch and dent pair for a great price. I am going through unis once a year, I believe the issue is mud and crap sitting on the uni wearing it down, I wonder if vertical unis like many of the long long travel kits use would have this issue as crap cant sit on the top of the uni.

I will also add that I had the loose uni in the cup issue as well, resolved by putting some small tacks on the inside of the cup and pressing the uni in.

The above set of uni LCAs will be/are for sale once I clean them up if anyone is interested, will need bushings and the correct adapter if you are putting them on a taco, pm for details.

 

I was just talking to someone yesterday about how all of the lca's with uniballs puddle water and crap on the top. Too bad there isn't a way to seal off the uniball and keep it protected from the elements whether it be an actual cover or layer of grease or both. Yes, grease will attract grit to the uniball, but it wouldn't if it was sealed.

On that note, mine are still good and I've had them for almost two years and well over 10,000 miles.

 

It seems it really just depends on the environment, they well last in some and horrible in others, my UCA ones went 4 years before needing replacement last year. I have been using FK unis, I was considering switch to a budget brand for the LCA before getting the new arms, and honestly its not the cost that bothers me, its dealing with them wearing out/noise and then the effort of replacing them.

 

whos got gen 2 DK LCA's for sale?

 

has anyone tried the emf uniball in these lower control arms?