WELDING damage electrical multiple failures coincidence or not

Anytime welding is done to any vehicle disconnect the battery and the ecu.

 

funny you should mention the ground clamp... I was looking to pull under the covered Parking at lowes last week and I couldn't... one guy had his truck nosed up to another guys truck who was backed in the stall, both with the hoods open and jumper cables between the 2. As I shut the door on my truck I heard the distinct sound of electric arcing and then a flash and flames. I went over to look. The first rocket scientist grounded the jumper cable on the second dudes brake lines coming out of the ABS unit. The spring clamp and the amperage plus the shitty connections sawed its way through at least 2 brake lines.

 

If the guy welds professionally, even if he doesn't disconnect the battery, he probably (hopefully) grinds a clean spot on the rear diff and gets a good ground. Also, the springs/shocks have rubber bushings isolating it from the frame. I know, there are smaller connections to the frame, like brake lines, but I am again assuming he tried to get a good ground.

If you go back to the shop, in addition to asking if he disconnected the battery, I'd ask him to show me where he grounded for the welding. I'd want to know the odds he had a good ground, in case he "accidentally" tells you he disconnected the battery, but he didn't.

This info would help me decide if I think it's coincidence, and how hard to push back on them for any damages if I think he had a poor ground and maybe did get into my electrical system.

Good luck.

 

UPDATE : Just finished talking to my local trusted mechanic friend and also the Toyota Dealer my several Toyota trucks have known for a few decades. CURRENT STATUS:

ANSWER: COINCIDENCE REPAIR NEEDED: Power Steering Rack replacement GO FIGURE ! Details below:

1) Starter GOOD, Alternator GOOD and reported to be charging, Battery testing GOOD (after 6 cycles of CTEK recharge), 12.6-12.8v, starting fine now. Have not given it a real work out yet, only Winter will tell..... and it definitely does not start up as enthusiastically as it did before, so I am betting it is "fine" but no longer "great" like it was before the welding.

2) NO "Parasitic Drain", says the Dealer (BTW, total charge of $59 to diagnose), their meters and testing show no issues, and started fine. I will proceed as though this is true, with an eye open to the possible getting stuck somewhere someday. Both mechanics suspect the welder just made a simple error and left the key ignition on overnight, maybe even a couple times, or some such, door ajar, etc. causing battery issue, and think welder was wrong to tell me there was a parasitic drain.

3) A/C system empty NO FREON due to a new leak, even though yes the lines were already replaced a few years ago. They did not troubleshoot the A/C past that, but said there was "no way no how" that it could be related to welding. NOTE: My concern was that the A/C compressor might be related to the parasitic draw, but if there IS NONE, then I will no longer worrry about A/C and let it remain broken, and chalk it up to COINCIDENCE !

4) As suggested here, I wondered: Is there a set of LINES that got damaged during moving things for welding, knicked, crimped, or the like, and the Dealer mechanic said their team looked carefully and saw no evidence of anything. They said the WELDER DID AN EXCELLENT JOB on the rear differential cover welding. YAY ! Go Welders ! Welding is a true ART and SCIENCE ! The common event turned out to be WHEN I drove the truck. As in, it is , after sitting around alot, it was WHEN the OP drove the truck, that was when ALL of the broken items were discovered simultaneously.

Now Here's the big surprise winner, coming from behind the pack.....

5) DIAGNOSIS of REAL problem needing repair: POWER STEERING Rack Failure due to RUST !! The power steering fluid was completely EMPTY, so must have started and gotten worse during the sitting around process at the welder shop. Maybe the welding zapped new life into the rust and turned it into a super villian !
I had noticed it low, but did not see it suddenly become empty.


6) CHOICES: A) they refilled the power steering fluid and steering now works fine... no other front end problems, so both suggested I could just keep refilling the fluid and see how it goes
or B) Replace the power steering RACK for $1300 ish. I cannot do this work myself, and my local trusted mechanic does not do this work either.
Dealer seems like the only option, or another local shop (that I do not already have a trust relationship with) might save a couple hundred bucks, but quotes are actually very close to the Dealer quote.


7) QUESTION on the table today is: Does the OP go for option A (just MAINTAIN FLUID, i.e. keep the fluid it up and drive it, waiting for the other shoe to drop, or the next unknown future failure to occur), or does the OP go for option B) REPLACE THE RACK, pay someone to do it.

Keep in mind, this truck is 2004 Tacoma 4WD, auto 2.7L Xtracab, with NEW FRAME installed by Dealer, along with the new springs, new brake lines, and has a new gas tank, a new oil pan, and a list of other new parts and lines, and of course, the newly welded rear differential which is no longer leaking.

8) So the ANSWER to the query seems to be COINCIDENCE, not the welder. Which course of ACTION do YOU recommend....

A) Maintain Fluid, or
B) Replace Rack

Thanks again for all of your posts.

 

The number of things that "just happen" to crop up right after welding is highly suspicious, for sure. Not sure what plugs the welder needed to disconnect in order to jump it, that sounds weird...

The power steering is more than likely a coincidence, as I can't see welding doing anything there.

Definitely get some straight answers from the welder. Did he disconnect the ground from the battery before welding??

 

Cant get straight answer out of welder, not taking my calls and did give me the bum's rush after welding, wanted no part of troubleshooting the battery/parasitic drain issue (even though he is a full service shop, which is why my antenna paranoia alerted). We will never know if welder did or did not disconnect the battery. Highly respected shop, but very small circle of friends he works for....I was lucky to get him to do the welding, and I truly appreciate his work and his skills, just taken by surprise at the pile of failures left in my lap that he did not want to help at all with ....

But, the reason I believe he pulled the connector to jump to battery is that the truck is very rusty and hard to find a ground. I had the same problem when I went to jump trickle charge, which is why I saw the connector off, and then I also used that grounding prong when I set up the CTEK. I assume he just forgot to put it back, can't see any reason why it would just be hanging there an inch away from its mate. Will point that out to Dealer when I pick it up and see what they say the wire connector goes to...

But what do you think, A) just drive, keep refilling fluid, or B) pay for the enchilada

 

What do you intend to do with the truck? If you are hanging on to it, its a coin toss. But it sounds like with the rust issues you describe, you wouldn't get any return on your $1300 investment if you tried to sell it. I'd probably just top off and call it a day. You can buy a lot of PS fluid for $1300.

 

Plan to keep the truck. only 105k and great engine. also got new power steering lines and new transmission cooler lines, etc when new frame put on it. BUT the RUST is eating it alive, so I know that more things will fail. Speed sensors are rusted in place and working. Front end good. Thought to sell it, but really, why?! I love my taco. ymmmm. hate the new computer-heavy machines.

 

Yeah...

As an ex bicycle mechanic, any time someone had work done, but had some unrelated failures show up right after working on it, you'd always take the time to work thru it with them. You could always tell the people who were just trying to scam free work out of it, like I had customers where after you fixed the front brakes, and they'd complain about how the shifting doesn't work and demand you fix it for free. But when you have a bunch of highly coincidental failures that are possibly related (like welding + electrical issues), it should be their responsibility to go through it and at least be able to show it wasn't caused by the work you did. It's too bad you had to take it else where to diagnose. And then spend the time with the customer to explain it. Sometimes it's better to eat a little bit of labor cost or a cheap/easy fix if it means you get a repeat/loyal customer.

There were countless times where a mechanic of mine did some work on the rear wheel, and then the customer complained about the shifting afterwards. I would just go and do the repair for them unless it was obvious that it was impossible for us to have screwed it up like the cable was rusty or something like that.

As far as what to do about your truck. That's a tough call. It sounds like it's a rust bucket, and all the repairs you're having to do on it are rust related. I guess eventually you'll end up with an all new truck, lol, but is it worth it?

 

If I go with the option A) pour in the power steering fluid as necessary, then does it matter which brand or kind of power steering fluid to use?

What is the "best" power steering fluid to put into a leaking Rack on 04 Tacoma ?

 

People and Mechanics (who are people, afterall) are "all sorts", eh? The biggest challenge in keeping the truck running can be people sometimes. Appreciate mechanics with honor, and know that you 'take one for the honor team' sometimes, from customers who are dishonorable, but thank you for your committment to "be honorable anyway"... thank the ones that do ! Appreciate all of the good hearts found here on tacomaworld !

 

It sounds like you got some solid input from the dealer service dept. That's great to hear!
I agree with what they told you. Just by following along in this thread and hearing the different things from those that worked on it and/or diagnosed it, what the dealer diagnosed sounds legit. Hard to say with absolute certainty over the internets but sounds realistic.
I like the idea of keeping the power steering fluid topped off as well. Our power steering systems use Dexron II or III ATF. Power steering system won't notice the difference between brands of ATF so keeping the PS pump from sucking air (keeping it topped off) will be the key to making it last as long as possible

And when you do have the steering rack repair done, based on experiences folks have had here on forum, I would definitely say to go with OEM rack, as you looked into.

 

Great advice, thanks !!

 

The cheapest, lol...

Lowrange Offroad has steering rack "kits" that I've heard a lot of good things about.

https://www.lowrangeoffroad.com/toy...t-by-low-range-off-road-tac-sp-1gen-urpk.html

 

Update, just for fun. Leaking power steering fluid got worse, total empty after 10 miles, and the pump does not like that. Dealer clarified that $1300 was for the Aftermarket Rack, but it was $1600 for the OEM rack (not counting any other extra stuff that crops up during the repair). Just cannot afford that so went with a local mechanic but in a nearby town (good, honest shop) who is putting the Aftermarket in for $875, using parts via "Advantage Auto Parts" (not "Advance", and they say "No, it is not Cardone"). Worry that the OEM rack really is the correct choice, but sometimes we don't get the top shelf stuff. Cringe, hoping the luck is with me.