Bilstein 6112

Bra-fucking-vo! I love Calvary Blue. I wish they had it for the 2020 model year, I would have much preferred it but Apple Car Play and Power Seat were a must.

 

Pure BS. Tell us how useless the band aid was? Plenty of folks running AALs with toppers everyday. That's close to 200lbs right there. Add camping gear, food etc and yes you get a little sag. But to call AALs a band aid, useless etc with no facts to back up your claims is BS.

Yes, full aftermarket leaf packs are going to be better but AALs work for many satisfied folks everyday. Call Wheelers and ask them.

 

I'm not going to waste my time verifying my credentials to you, but feel free to look through my build thread instead of getting mad. I have installation reports, reviews, and comments on each setup I've ran. I went through two sets of Icon 3-Leaf AALs for nearly a year. No matter what when the bed rack and tent went on (~200lbs) I was riding the bump stops over every speed bump and railroad crossing. Lost nearly 2" of overall travel offroad with a full camping payload.

PLENTY of people on here will vouch for not running an AAL with a topper or constant weight. You're doing yourself a complete disservice by doing so. They are the bee's knees if you're not running constant weight or towing, but if you regularly have hundreds of pounds in the bed and/or tow, the stock leaf pack is a really, really bad option. Have you ran both an AAL and an aftermarket leaf pack to be able to compare firsthand?

You look to have a 2019 which has no real age or wear on your stock leaf pack. Give it 3-4 years and you'll know.

 

No

Not mad at all. It's your claims that AALs are useless and band aids which is the real disservice not only to members but to the vendors and makers of AALs as well.

I've owned and ran two previous Toyotas 17 yrs each (1st Gen and an 85 SR-5) as DDs and both had toppers with stock suspension. And those toppers were alot heavier than the current topper on my 3rd Gen. I haul both camping gear and sometimes even pull light trailers on annual out of state hunting trips. Sag, yes but these trucks are very capable stockwise. At no time did I ever ride the bump stops as you claim you did.

My current 3rd Gen is a DD, has a topper with roof rack and its clearly capable of hauling 400-500lbs without riding the bump stops. A 200-300lb load is nothing for these trucks even as a daily driver. I paid about $200 for a set of Wheelers AALs and even if they do sag in 3-4yrs as you claim I can then spend more $$ for a full leaf pack.

 

Can confirm. OME medium ride so nice. Huge improvement over stock in all aspects.

 

Okay, two quick things and I'm moving on. Arguing about truck parts is kind of pointless. Everyone has their own opinions and preferences, which is the beauty of the amount of options we have for these trucks.

1) If you read back to Haun's post he said the following, "the stock pack on my sport is almost always riding the OL leaf with any weight in the back." An AAL does not increase payload, it takes away from it. If he's almost always riding the OL leaf without an AAL, he'll still be riding the overload leaf with one as well. That is why I said it would be a band aid for him... just the exact same as it was for me.

2) You said, "I paid about $200 for a set of Wheelers AALs and even if they do sag in 3-4yrs as you claim I can then spend more $$ for a full leaf pack." That is the exact thing any reasonable person would want to avoid. Why would you spend $200 + install time on something that does not fix the problem when you could spend $500 up front and be DONE with it?

Anyhow, logic tells me we're all grown adults on this board and everything is subjective. You're free to argue with me until you're blue in the face, but at the end of the day I gave my suggestion on his particular application. Feel free to provide a counter-suggestion but there's no need to get into a dick measuring contest calling me a bullshitter.

 

@MtnFisher
@iKONik
OK, I know that this is the thread on the 6112's and 5160's and not the forum on a "Should I buy a New leaf pack or AAL", but I am going to try to hopefully put this to bed. Now, keep in mind, what I am about to post is not from me, it is from a leaf spring builder and manufacturer. This is someone that I trust knowing that he has been the leaf spring industry for over 30 years and trust his advise when it comes to this. His answer was this:

Since there's never an easy answer, here's what I'd say... it depends.
There are two somewhat easy answers...

1. If your existing leaf pack is in reasonable shape and you're not regularly hauling heavy loads (several hundred pounds) in the back of your truck, go with the AAL. It'll give you a lifted look, will work fine for the occasional load, and will be the most economical option.
2. If your existing (probably stock/original) leaf pack is not in good shape (it looks completely flat with no load, or even like a frown), or you are going to carry a consistent heavy load, then skip the AAL and get a new leaf pack - a slightly more expensive (but higher quality) aftermarket pack.

If you don't easily fall into one of the categories above, then here's how I'd approach the decision making process...

First off, remember there are trade offs,
Whenever you update your suspension - front or rear - you need to remember that each option has pros and cons. If you are going to raise the rear of your truck, you're going to be changing the geometry of (primarily) the drive shaft, which can be hard on your drive line. You'll also be changing the weight distribution (and therefore braking characteristics) of the truck - another thing to keep in mind.

Additionally, some options will allow you to adjust the amount of lift - so you can minimize these types of changes, or at least "adapt" to the circumstances. Others won't. But, as is often the case, being able to "adapt" often means that it won't be as good as a dedicated solution for some set of circumstances either.

Ok, So here are your options:

AAL

• pros: cost, lifted look, a bit more carrying capacity (periodically)
• cons: no adjustability (change the drive-line and braking geometry), not (usually) long lasting, not a ton of carrying capacity,

Air Shocks

• pros: cost, easy install, more carrying capacity, lift/capacity-adjustability (doesn't have to change the drive-line and braking geometry), lifted look
• cons: often leak (slowly, over several days), limited additional capacity, aren't usually the best-of-breed "shock absorber"

Custom Leaf Pack

• pros: more (constant) carrying capacity, long(er) lasting, lifted look, allows use of best-of-breed shock absorber
• cons: harder adjustability (changes the drive-line and braking geometry; adjustable by adding/removing leafs), cost

And here's my recommendation:

If you rarely carry loads, you're a good candidate for an AAL or air shocks, and I'd give the slight advantage to air shocks. Both will give you a lifted look, but air shocks have that adaptability - you can lower them (closer to stock levels) if you want to relieve the stress on your drive line. If you go the AAL route, make sure to look into a brake proportioning valve as well, since you'll have changed braking characteristics.

If you regularly - but not constantly - carry loads and don't want lift, then you need some way to keep from overloading your leaf springs. In that case, you should consider either air shocks or a heavy duty leaf pack (possibly custom). As long as your truck didn't have a constant load in the back (loads were for remodeling supplies, landscaping, constant over-landing equipment etc) go with the air shock route, first installing Gabriel HiJackers and then Monroe MA-820's. They work great and were significantly less expensive than a custom leaf pack. They also have the benefit of adaptability - when carrying a big load, you can leave the truck in the "stock geometry."

If you constantly carry heavy loads with some lift,(several hundred pounds) then you are a good candidate for an after-market leaf pack. Neither an AAL nor air shocks are up to a "constant" load. The AAL will relatively quickly go flat, and air shocks have a weight limit as well as (generally) need to be refilled over time as air slowly leaks out - inconvenient if you always have a load.

You may decide to go with an off-the-shelf option, like OME or you might decide to go the custom (for additional cost) route - Alcan or Deaver for instance. Base this decision on the load characteristics of your situation (how heavy is your constant load) as well as budget. So you can choose to go with a custom Alcan pack since there was no way to get a 600lb-over-stock pack from one of the off-the-shelf vendors.

 

Agree 110% on all possible fronts. Very well said. Very useful information for those browsing through this thread for advice.

 

As far as AAL's It also depends on which ones you go with. They're not all created equal. I've had the deaver aals no OL for 5 years. I can carry 400lbs + without bouncing on the bumpstops. But I did get the TSB spring set just before adding the aals, so that helped for sure. Solid stock springs (3) to start

 

Requoting your post again. You have no experience with Wheelers AALs yet you make baseless blanket claims regarding AALs?

Says the guy who bought not one but two sets of Icon AALs and then bought a leaf pack. Btw Haun stated an icon leaf pack runs about 1k Canadian unlike the $500 you claim they run.

Where's your proof Wheeler AALs go flat in 3-4yrs. Have you ran a set? Go back and read what I posted my friend's experience is with Wheeler AALs.

Plenty of satisfied folks running AALs for well over 3-4yrs with toppers and hauling loads.

I've ran stock suspension on 2 of my previous Toyota trucks w/toppers for 17yrs each with no ill effects. Worked as intended both on and off road.

 

Plus one.

 

You can make a AAL carry weight but will it ride well? I'm saving for Deaver U402 Stage 1 springs. Buy once, cry once, add the stage 2 AAL when I need it. My stock springs are basically flat already with 14k miles after just a few heavily loaded camping trips. Sure you can get a AAL for a good price compared to a full pack and it may work but it's not optimal like most of the shit people put on their vehicles. If you really want to play, you gotta pay.

 

Ok sorry way too deep a thread but I'm sure this has been answered. I'm getting ready to install 6112/600lb coil up front with 5160/OME HD leafs and JBA UCA. My 2015 AC has a 250lb shell on the back and will probably be a bit heavier when I add drawers in the bed. Also have 285/75/17's if that makes any difference.

I'm trying to figure out which notch I should set the front to. I think an inch of rake would be a nice look too but doesn't really matter. Any advice?

 

How hard is it to change clip settings if i want? Not completely sure how high i want to sit and i plan on adding skids hopefully before i need them. How long does it take the average person?

 

Hi John, ok.....there are a couple of questions I have to ask you first. I have your exact truck just 3 years younger so my experience will apply here.
1. What weight is on the front of your truck now?
2. What weight are you "planning" on adding (front bumper, how many skids, type of skids i.e. custom or trd, wench, sliders etc.?
3. How high up do you want to go before and after you add more weight to your truck now?
4. What do you have for a rear suspension set up?

The reason is that most companies that will sell you the 6112's can pre-assemble them for you on a specific clip. Changing them can be a little PITA due to taking the shock off of the truck, compressing the spring, taking off the top hat, pulling the clips out and then everything in reverse. I live in Western MA and have experience from starting from no weight, adding weight, and changing things out.

 

Awesome thanks, i purchased WOR 6112 trail kit w/700# coils and swapping rxt's for the expedition leafs that come with the kit.
1- 110# steel bumper, winch, sliders(SOS on your referral,thanks) planning on fullskids but with covid waiting for a deal or something. Carry 200+ pounds of tools in the bed always
2- planning skids down the line, probably steel or trd, but not picky
3- going for at least 2.5 maybe 3"
4- it's a work truck, dd first. 200#s and up in the bed sometimes way more.

I've heard the 650 and 700# coils can be a pain to compress and I'd have to use the loaner from the parts store or pay. Thanks for any advise. Side note, I heard I need to see your onboard air setup. I will PM you soon as it seems I'm trying to copy your truck or we just like the some of the same stuff.

 

Did the kit come pre-assembled with the clip already in place with the 700lb coils?

 

Ordered through Wheeler's with 5/4 and worry or over worry that I'll want to change it 2 weeks after

 

This is what I ended up going with...trucks up on blocks as I wait to get a new top hat from Toyota on Monday though. Except I had to compress them myself on the truck. Wish I had ordered them that way. Hopefully it'll all be finished soon

 

Plan on 4 to 6 hours depending on tools, rust and experience. I know because I swapped my coils out to 650# last weekend which is same effort you need to change clip settings. Took me 6 hours start to finish but about an hour of that was removing the anti sway bar and replacing the ball joint links on it and also includes time to get truck up on jacks and put tools away afterwards. Did not change clip setting but it’s a snap ring so would have taken another 10 minutes to change setting assuming it does not fly off and get lost. I was taking my time so If you got a good impact gun, minimal rust, and no distractions you might do it in under 4 hours. Local shop quoted 3 hours so 4-6 hour seems ballpark for first time you do this.