welding - worth it?

Do you weld? Is it hard?

I am thinking of getting into it, for Tacoma projects and repairs
it seems worth it. Especially if you get crashed into (normal), take the $1300 insurance payout, then spend $500 on a Coastal bumper kit, $600 on a welder, build it, then keep the welder for later uses.

Here is my theoretical game-plan if I decide to pull the trigger; I'm curious to know your thoughts
-education: community college classes, YouTube, books
-practice: on scrap metal, maybe stress testing the weld with bends and hammer blows to see if it holds
-welder: 220v, 180 amp, around there. Reputable brands, probably new, like Hobart, Miller, etc. usually $600-900
-supporting tools: auto darkening helmet, corded grinder and bits, skin UV burn protection including gloves, etc.

am worried about power supply; like if it has to be a true 220v (I hear some 220v outlets are actually slightly under that)
and grinding prep. Shops try to tell me grinding is hard and takes a while. But regular people tell me it takes 3-5 minutes.
So I am wondering which is true.
Maybe shops are just creating a lie of "Oh no! Grinding the metal bare takes hours and hours!" to try and dissuade me from DIY'ing and tricking me into handing them over thousands to facilitate their profession
Which is cool and all, but we can't all always do that

It seems to have so many uses
-fabricate armor like bumpers
-weld on sliders
-reinforce frame
-add swingouts
-suspension improvements
etc.

Honestly if you tell me grinding is quick and easy I'll probably pull the trigger.
Because that's really the only on-the-fence factor at this point. Like if I find out metal is strong as fuck (pardon my french, no other way to put it) and literally takes 8 hours of super loud sparking BZZZZZZZ causing noise complaints, then I can justify taking it to some shop that does that in an enclosed facility in a commercial building area
but if it's quick and easy, then DIY all the way...

 

Check out the welding thread.. Might even have better results with your Q's if you copy and paste everything and post it there.
https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/anything-welding.113957/page-943#post-24714794

 

Take the classes at a trade school first. They'll have all the gear for you and you can decide if you enjoy it enough to move ahead.

You should also learn enough about equipment to be able to make a good used purchase from CL or local pawn shops and save some moola.

I think it's awesome if you have the space / time / inclination and enough of a need for the investment.

As far as noisy grinders and such, ear muffs are a must. Not just foam plugs, but covers like pro tree trimmers and such wear. If you don't, there will be a day you wish you had.

Of course there are other ways to put it, with very little effort.

 

Do it! The grinding is the easy part.

All my Toyotas have been wrecks that I put back together with basic welding skills.

I've been doing this since 1999. I don't remember when I last had a car payment.

Head over to the
Anything welding thread.

@bigd9247 , @Matic , @malburg114

 

If you mean tech schools, they seem scammy and less reputable than community colleges
kind of like UTI in the car world for anyone who knows what that is

I heard you pretty much can never find a decent new 220v welder, because they're made high quality nowadays and last 10-30+ years, so anybody who buys one tends to keep it...

I have ear pro. Concern is everyone around me. I can't force them to wear it.
I don't own a private large island with a car lift in the middle. Sorry if that sounds smartass. My point is, if I make loud noise for a few minutes, the people near me will deal with it.
But if I make crazy loud noise near other human beings for 10 hours, I guarantee they will throw me off a cliff immediately.
That is the potential hurdle/challenge here
I can't be selfish about it
Imagine if I find a place to perform the work near other human beings. And then I just start making loud ass noise for 10+ hours at over 100 decibels constantly; it would drive them mad.
I mean welding, that takes less time. I can put up a sign. A surround. I can simplify notify people around if they are curious to watch, not to stare, because it causes eye harm without a mask.
That's the easy part.

Thanks!
Gonna research a good corded grinder (cordless would probably run out of battery fast) and which size/type of bits and discs to get

I understand welding is a profession. Like car mechanics. That charge for money to live. And both jobs are often DIY'd by people.
And that if a mechanic does a 6 hour timing belt 30 times, he can eventually do it in 2 hours. But still charge 6 hours in profit. That in a sense pays for the experience and education it took to reach that level.
So a fab shop might do the same. Quick disassembly, quick grind, quick weld, 3 hours. But charge 10 hours.
However like most DIY enthusiasts on a forum, I am not in a position to pay extra 7 labor hours ($1k+) on a 3 hour job; am not Bill Gates, did not win PowerBall today, etc. (Wish I did! But did not)

 

Sounds like you have an interest or else you wouldn't be posting this..

Asking if welding is hard, is gonna get you mixed answers, to some it comes natural others struggle with it...

You could get a cheaper machine for around what you are asking.. You can learn a lot of what you'd need to get you going just by watching videos.

You have different types of welding TIG~MIG~STICK... MIG will be a good place for you to start, TIG is the more difficult one, you won't be STICK welding on a vehicle.

A lot of machines now have the capability of 220 or 110... You could get you a little MIG and be able to practice getting some basics down, and you can do a lot with it... If you decide you like welding, and wanna go further get a TIG..

And based off your last post, it sounds like you have other issues that might make it hard for anyone else except you to figure out.

 

Simple question. To grind some metal off a Tacoma; does it take 10 hours, or 10 minutes? Shops have told me 10 hours.
If you can't answer that, thanks for the effort. Sorry for posting.
At this time I wouldn't know. I've never used a grinder in my life. I've used many other tools before (impacts, saws, etc.) but ever a grinder.
There's a first time for everything. Maybe I'll buy a blank 1/4 piece at Home Depot and see just how hard it is to grind. Maybe it will cut fast and easy like butter. Maybe not.
That's the whole point of forums. People research and ask (believe me, I've researched) hard shit before they take the risk of getting stuck learning the hard way in real life

here is an example (there are many); of someone asking for a part number

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/engine-cover-rear-bolt-lost.493431/

 

In terms of how long ..... Really depends on exactly what all you're talking about grinding... Something could take 10 seconds or 10 hours.

Be more specific with exactly what you're asking and you might get a more specific answer to your question.

The act of picking up a grinder and grinding material off of metal, is it hard? I don't think so... Some might disagree, I guess that would depend on the person.

So far everyone that has posted are trying to help you..

 

Wear ear plugs when you grind and it won't be noisy!

Just kidding. My take on your question is, if you own a welder, and work on vehicles, you will make some loud noise at times. Yes, you will. Length of time and decibel level is directly related to repair/project type and the tools used.

For reference, if you posted these pics asking about the one below, I'd say I could have that frame area ground in 10 minutes. Would not have been super noisy using a 4.5" with flap disc. Thick metal doesn't amplify/vibrate, and absorbs some of the sound.

Electric tools can be quieter than air in some applications. Air tools have a high pitched, loud sound (think tire shop noise) and unless I wear my ear muffs, they annoy the crap out of me, and likely your neighbors. Using them in enclosed areas makes it worse.

Now cutting thin metal with a 4.5" cutoff wheel is fairly loud. Sanding metal with electric tools prior to painting, not so bad.

If you use a bench grinder for some of your metal prep pre-weld, they make much less noise than portable tools. Each have safety risks, so be careful. Holding parts while bench grinding takes extra thought and care since they can get pulled from your grasp if you do it wrong. I have the best luck grinding in the lower part of the wheel, say about 4 o'clock position if you looked at the wheel from the left side. If you're into math, think below the horizontal tangent at the point on the wheel closest to you.

My opinion is you are probably not going to tackle any projects big enough to result in extended periods of loud grinding/cutting.
I say go for it!

 

Looking at pictures that were posted in my opinion are a little more complex than knowing how to cut and weld metal. And would also require a few more tools than a welder and grinder...to be accomplished efficiently anyway. I myself can weld good enough to join pieces together stick or mig method, even gas welded some. So what I'm saying is welding and grinding is a little different than metal fabrication. I'm a machinist by trade and work with a half dozen or so expert welders. Those welder dudes are so good the only time they touch a grinder would be for preparing the surface.

 

I do have access to a bench grinder and thought about using it. They're cheap anyway.
Sounds like you're saying the best grinder is a 4.5". I was wondering that as well.
That seems like a common size to use those discs, and comes in many forms.
Yes, air tools tend to be louder. And use a lot of air. If anything, I'd probably go corded or cordless electric. Maybe Milwaukee since I have their batteries. One battery should last fine. If not, I can swap in another. Vs corded.
Everyone likes cordless. No plug to fall out the socket unexpectedly. And portability to use it anywhere. Quieter than air.
And Milwaukee is a reputable brand. I'd just have to figure out which specific grinder of theirs (unless going with another company like DeWalt) to narrow it down to, since their catalog has many.

Well. It sounds like the 10+ hour labor @ $100/hr quote was just an exaggeration to make money then, claiming grinding takes much longer than it really does.
Kind if like I told you it'd take me 5 hours to replace your front brakes. It doesn't. It's more like anywhere between 30min-1.5hr realistically.

I'd plan on making the cut with an oxyacetylene torch, but a grinder would be after that to just smooth down the surface bare. Since the torch cut would still leave a few millimeters of jagged metal that I'd have to shave off.

Hobart 210MVP seems like a good choice of welder,
with an Argon tank of the right size,
grinder
mask
cart
etc
I hear other welding can be better than the MIG offered by Hobart 210MVP
like stick welding, TIG, etc. but I'll have to look into which is best for this application.
Because stick welding for example, although it looks nice to not need an Argon tank because the sticks are coated with oxygen-displacing flux, I hear the method creates way too much smoke in the area.

Ear plugs are never a problem. There are ear plugs, ear muffs (both electronic and non) that can be worn overtop to double the protection. It's cheap and everyone should have it.
The only concern with that (decibel noise) is being too loud to the point of bothering other people nearby.

 

I run a Hobart 190, still learning but getting better day by day From the truck to metal gates to guns)

 

Refer to my post #6. You're not gonna be stick welding on a vehicle, MIG and TIG are the way to go... I'm not saying you couldn't, but nobody uses STICK on a vehicle..

And with where you're at, again, you'd be better off IF you move forward with this to go with MIG, and I'd recommend doing a lot of practice before welding anything critical on a vehicle, people who don't run the risk of killing somebody because of a failure.. And look into what a good weld looks like and is etc etc.. In other words familiarize yourself, maybe even get some opinions.

 

For years I only used a Lincoln Tombstone 225 Ac welder on vehicle welding before that Oxy- Fuel one does what is needed

 

I learned to weld with a Lincoln tombstone at the age of 10 in 1985 and never used anything else until I was 21. I watched dad weld with a torch and coat hanger a few times on some thin stuff.

 

What I meant was, it's not typically used.. And why I said not saying you couldn't..
I should've been more selective with how I said it.

 

@TacoTuesday1

Just to add to your list of 'supporting tools'/ PPE. Get a good set of sealed Eyewear and learn how to properly take them off and clean. Alot of people end up getting shaving in their eye while taking Eyewear and clothing off.

Also a impact resistant face shield

These are a must at most commercial jobs while grinding, its also good practice. You only get one set of eyes. You can Google how doctors get metal shavings out. Not a bad idea to have some eye wash around too

Sounds like you know how to properly take care of your hearing. That never comes back either and no one want to have to wear hearing aids

 

It's not hard, when you begin you really will just need someone to tell you whats good and what isn't and then it's all about torch time.

 

it's all practice practice practice.
the earlier you get invested and start laying leads, the better you'll be.