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Should just apply the tax at the charging station like they already do at the gas pump

 

Might work... but then you'd need a separate meter on the charging circuit at home, too. And all that infrastructure and software to record and manage the data. So IMO probably easier to just to go by mileage... either automatically recorded from cars' black boxes (that would be the easiest but I don't see that happening in the US) or by annual reporting and/or inspections.

 

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Well would be easy at the charging stations no need for anything special just software change but at home could be a motor vehicle fee or flat fee at tax time. Dunno. But in most states EV's don't need to go through inspection. Maybe some do.

 

True, now only if they actually did a good job at building and maintaining roads. Grew up in PA those were horrible, until I moved to AZ…those were even worse. Which is amazing since AZ doesn’t get nearly as much freezing and thawing. Have been in Idaho for the last 7 they don’t do too bad, though the new interstate they have been constructing in the Treasure Valley is awful. Would never know it is a brand new multi-multi million dollar project, that thing is rough.

They’ll just go off the vehicle’s GPS is my guess. Sure there are pilot programs now such as insurance companies tracking you, but will become mandatory.

and yeah stevesnj, the roads will become safer once self driving EVs become prevalent, gawd people are horrible drivers…think I am one of the very few that actually drives the posted speed limit. Not much in a hurry these days.

 

That is another interesting angle... safety inspections. I suspect states that require them for ICE vehicles will also require them for EVs. But at least they won't need emissions inspections, which is all we have here. in MD vehicles only get safety inspections once and that is at sale. It'd be easy to report mileage to your home state... but then how do states capture revenue from travelers? Pretty much have to be at the charge points somehow. I didn't read all the details of the proposed tax by mileage plan to see how they intend to deal with this... or if they just intend to let the travelers pay their own states and that it all comes out to be sort of a wash.... although big tourist states like FL may not be happy with that.

 

Nice thing about charging stations, they can be installed just about anywhere. Won’t happen overnight, but it will happen. Plus they are working on systems that will charge while you drive.

https://interestingengineering.com/new-method-could-make-charging-evs-while-driving-a-reality

 

Yeh neighbor had a Tesla for 5 years never needed to get it inspected. At least in NJ you don't. Also paid no sales tax on it since it's a 0 emissions vehicle.

 

Yes, sort of, but... you also need to supply them. At the scale we are talking about the entire grid and generating capacities will need a lot of improvement... and if you make the electricity with fossil fuels... particularly coal... it doesn't really help things all that much. Sure solar is being built out... but the sun don't shine at night when most people would have their cars plugged in at home.

 

Great discussion, guys. I am logging out for now, will check back later.

 

Luckily in my county we use nuclear on our grid.

 

We are hydro, wind, solar, natural gas, and no coal powered utility plants. There is one nuke plant that I know of, but think it is experimental.

Hydro might not be as viable as it once was if the West keeps on having droughts.


https://www.eia.gov/state/analysis.php?sid=ID

 

I am an old navy guy who once upon a time served as a JO engineer on nuke subs... and spent most of the rest of my career in nuclear matters. Pretty amazing technology. Enviros get a lot of the blame for killing it but that is really only part of the story. IMO most of the enviro regs are necessary if only to keep the operators and utilities from cutting corners, as corporations will always do if you give them a chance. The real issue is that fossil fuels are still cheap, partly because they are subsidized in many ways and protected by powerful lobbies. The problems with that are two fold... first this makes doing anything about climate change next to impossible, and second, in spite of the increased supply from fracking it is still a finite resource and will run out. Not this year and maybe not for a couple of decades. But when all of a sudden demand, which is still growing mightily around the world, gets above the ability to pump, the world economy is done simply because we will have ignored it for too long and not developed the alternatives to the necessary scale in time. Some of the advanced nuke power plant designs look interesting, too. Safer and cheaper to deploy. Those along with the green tech need to be subsidized at least as much as fossil fuels in order to level the playing field so we are ready for the future and not headed for a cliff. Or cliffs. Don't get me wrong, I love my gasser Tacoma and Vette. But that is not going to be the future for long.

 

There are companies working on nuclear tech. Scroll down and see who is chairman of the board.

https://www.terrapower.com/

Terra Power Wyoming Plant

 

I am very familiar with this. "Working on" is fine as far as it goes but really doesn't mean much. The lead time to bring something like this online is *very* long so the "working on and testing" part needs to be supported and speeded up as does the regulatory framework. Then plants need to start being built. There is this fallacy that much of the country believes that when gas runs out a switch gets flipped and voila, everything is cool. Guess who pushes that mentality... the FE industry that is busily trying to pump every gallon of oil and every million cubic feet of gas just as fast as they can get away with, to include sending massive amounts of LPG abroad which will only increases our costs here... AND will have us run out sooner. IOW, they are encouraging the shortsightedness to their own benefit with no thought to the long term.

 

https://www.geekwire.com/2021/bill-...-for-next-gen-nuclear-power-plant-in-wyoming/

 

I have some buddies working in the larger DOE organization that is running that program. I will ping them sometime to get a reality check, but 2028 seems very very optimistic, even if they don't run into technological snags. And by then some new administration may try to appoint as the DOE Secretary one of those geniuses who says he wants to eliminate DOE. That is until he gets to work and discovers that, Oh, DOE's main mission is to produce and manage the nuclear weapons arsenal. Who knew?? LOL.

 

Found this interesting article. Another thing to consider is that these plants have finite lifespans. The design lifespans can usually be extended somewhat by analyzing the condition of critical components and spending some extra $ but you can only do so much. Any replacement source would need to be ready on that schedule.

New Jersey extends $300 million in nuclear subsidies for Salem County reactors (inquirer.com)

 

This is 2 week old news, but check out cold fusion for your self.


https://www.sciencefocus.com/future-technology/fusion-power-future/amp/

…Sounds like the stuff of dreams: a virtually limitless source of energy that doesn’t produce greenhouse gases or radioactive waste. That’s the promise of nuclear fusion, which for decades has been nothing more than a fantasy due to insurmountable technical challenges. But things are heating up in what has turned into a race to create what amounts to an artificial sun here on Earth, one that can provide power for our kettles, cars and light bulbs.

 

Not only is basic fusion technology so not ready for prime time, the issue of where does the hydrogen come from is never really mentioned. These experimental reactors generally use the hydrogen isotope tritium... which comes from... wait for it... irradiating a target in a fission reactor and then separating the tritium out. Can you say $$$$ children? I thought you could. And on a scale large enough for power generation? Forget about it. And even if they eventually get it to work with regular H2 where does that come from. Well, you separate it from water with electricity ($$) or reform (also $$ and requires continued drilling for nat gas along with all the leaks) it from... wait for it... natural gas. And cold fusion is absurd snake oil.

If your memory is working you'll remember a certain dumb president from a few admins ago repeatedly touting the coming hydrogen economy when in fact nothing was even remotely forthcoming. He, like some today, use this sort of news as yet another red herring as if to say: don't worry, be happy, it's covered... go ahead and wastefully burn up all that oil as fast as you can. It's not just wishful thinking. It is calculated disinformation.

Maybe this works out in the very long term. I certainly hope so. But we need to deal with reality and work with what we have as this research continues.