Creationism vs. Evolution

I appreciate your approach and want to be mannerly in my response. There is a mountain of evidence supporting the theory of evolution, to the point where many scientists refer to the 'fact' of evolution. This is similar to the 'theory' of gravity.

To anyone who honestly wants to inquire into the facts behind and the theory of evolution, I highly recommend Dawkins' THE GREATEST SHOW ON EARTH. It is very readable, informative and entertaining.

Also it answers many of the outdated objections and arguments against the theory.

 

I appreciate the reference. I'll hopefully get around to it in the coming days/weeks and see if I can learn enough to speak more intelligently on the subject.

 

the problem with this line of thought is for those who believe death is the end of all life and spiritual existence. For those of us who believe this is a stop on along endless journey realize and believe death is a new beginning and God sees death as eternal life and does not see it as the end but the beginning. We MISS those who die and suffer the pain of loss. But that is buffered by the knowing without a doubt we will be reunited. My wifes mother dies in her arms at 10 year old in a car accident......She has not been negatively affected by this becasue she is convinced beyond all doubt she will meet her mother again. She is not bitter. He father lost it completely and he was not even in the car with them on the way back from church. for her That is FAITH that heals. For her father he has never gotten over her death and does not believe in God. Who is suffering more?

God allows suffering because I believe He knows life itself is temporary and fleeting in the physical form. It's like He is saying "PEOPLE WAKE UP....your life is insignificant on earth. You will be reborn in death into peace and with your loved ones in a bliss you cannot fathom"

Only those who don't believe or believe in man as a finite object without a soul or spirit can think just because God allows bad things to happen to good people and therefore is not a just God. or worse no God no love...... Suffering is temporary. Physical Life is but a grain of sand on a beach. Meaningless without a search for the Creator. Purposeless. Why bother living if there is nothing afterward? Are we no better or relevant than ants? Apparently many think so. I feel bad for them. They have no hope but for this life which is waaaay too short. Their lives have no meaning. Just seeking pleasure and consumption.

I seek to better understand what comes next. My idea of the purpose for living is not to simply eat sleep work and play then die..... If that is all there is,,Thanks but no thanks...I was just as content when I did not exist. Physical Life is not all that and I am one of the lucky ones and have been blessed beyond my needs and desires and still I look forward to breaking out of this physical jail.

When I lost my grandparents uncles aunts then my mother and father, I mourned them all because I missed them in THIS life. But I know we will all meet again. I have no doubt and that is far more comforting than Darwins theory of amoebas and life beginning from some primordial soup.

When a child dies I morn for the family in pain not the child. What exactly did the child miss? Those who place an inordinate importance and finite ending in this life will find that statement incredible. When a family dies or thousands die in a natural disaster I feel sorry for their survivors and their plight not the dead who I believe are or will be reborn into a life so much better, God does not morn the dead. He WELCOMES them.

Once the lights come on at birth..I believe that is the start of a long endless journey through many worlds on many spiritual planes all in search and to reunite with our Father...like ophans and the adopted.

I really don't care from where we came. I only care where we go from here......
But that's just me and it works for me and in the end that is all that matters. I can only share and maybe someone will find what I have found and see death in a different light....other than black darkness forever...

 

Well said .

But I would ask you this as an aside , would I be just as correct as you if I beleived in Creationism but not by the god defined by your belief system ?

 

Absolutely! I don't KNOW God. I know there IS God. The form He takes in my life will be different then He takes in others. That's why i have a problem with "religion" that attempts to define that form and all that goes with it to CONTROL men. I believe Christ existed as God if for no other reason than the catastrophic and wonderment as a result of this one man's life One man caused a whole lot of discomfort for a whoole lot of people who used Him and His teachings to control other men.......all in a mere 2000 years. Man corrupted the Christ figure and the man for his own glory and power. The archeology is there. The writings the witnesses. The bastardization.

I believe Man has Christianity all wrong. From my religous background which was catholic to my search in evangelism. People chose religion like clothes. Whatever fits their lifestyle without discomfort. The people who truly believe don't CHOOSE religion. It chooses them. I envy those with the glory in their eyes and walk. I envy their freedom. Their wisdom in KNOWING without a doubt the truth and the way. Wow. Others ridicule them but others will die.....forever. That is their own fate. That is what they choose.

There are many ways to the Father or god or Creator.....Christ provided the best paved road for me. Perhaps Budda or Mohammed did for others. Its when they force their beliefs on me or me them ...wars happen.

That is why I find all this mumbo jumbo about Darwin and evolution silly. I focus on the future and could care less about how we got here. The birth and study of Christ was like nitros in my tank on my journey. but i could not simply accept the Catholic teaching or Billy Graham I had to seek my OWN truth as a doubter. One bible thousands of Christian "religions" is proof none of them is right as a group. Only as individuals can we come to find our own truth.......whether its Mass on Sunday or a walk on the beach on Wednesday with God

 

Good answer , I gotta give you that one .

 

"Frank" has an open mind and I believe is still searching for something greater then himself......

LOL There was a time when i would not have read it either.

 

Don't get too invested in my reading habits , I like the funny papers too .

 

Good post.
My first rebuttal is admittedly just poking you with a stick and being argumentative - how do you know there IS God... as opposed to "are gods" ? Up until Christ, polytheism was more the rule than monotheism. Why the big change? Too hard to remember the dozens of lesser gods? Good debate skills by early christians?

No doubt.

Amen, brother. So many freaking interpretations off a single book. Way to twist the message.

Yup. Or long-winded internet posts. Or late night dorm room debates. That's one reason I really hate prosletizing (and, yeah, I misspelled that. Sorry). Have your beliefs, fine. Don't force them on me.

In a way, I do too (I just like to be antagonistic). I mean, I'm catholic by upbringing, and still go to mass occasionally. My personal take is that religion provides a good foundation on how to live, wonderful ideals about the potential goodness in mankind, and some good explanations about some attitudes or beliefs. But I think it's ridiculous to think it's the end-all and be-all of explanations. Really, to me, thinking that life can be explained by the stories from 2-3K years ago is a bit silly. Why not choose Mayan, Babylonian or Egyptian beliefs then? Ancient Greek or Roman? What made those beliefs be eclipsed by Judiasm, Christianity, or Islam?
Is Darwin right? So far, to the scientific community, yes ... but that's not to say in 200 years the world will be like "those idiots, what were they thinking?" I'm at least willing to admit I could be wrong. Lots of creationists aren't (not aimed specifically at you). They're so damned sure about God making everything in 6 days...

 

When one says he 'knows' there is a god he is not using that word the way a scientist does. The reason I mention science is that it is the way of knowing that most people have the most confidence in. It is the only way of 'knowing' that can be demonstrated to be objective.

Faith in a god is not based on science. The reason I have a problem with opinions about the belief in god, is that to the religious their type of 'knowing' leads to beliefs and opinions that are not based in fact and can be dangerous. Non objective thinking leads to all kinds of patent silliness such as belief in astrology, voo doo, and all the other superstitions that have held back man's quest for knowledge.

But if your imaginary friend gives you comfort, no one is going to talk you out of that with reason.

 

BTW, the notion of an afterlife is merely wishful thinking. Wanting it to be so does not make it so. The idea of the 'soul' originated out of ignorance of what caused consciousness. Now that we know consciousness arises out of electrochemical processes in the brain, it is time to put away childish things like a belief in the 'soul' or that lightning and thunder are caused by 'gods' playing or fighting.

 

Exactly.

Suit yourself. It is so for me. No theoretical "science" will change that. In fact Science proves it by only concluding with theory. Science either proves facts with universal acceptance without failure or they don't exist for me anymore than my "imaginary friend" for you.

 

That's exactly what science has done regarding the theories of gravitation and evolution, among others; if by 'universal acceptance' you mean the peer reviewed qualified scientific community.

If you mean EVERYONE, than you must still be open to the idea the Earth is flat and that there was no holocaust, and also open to every superstition, religion and false belief around the world.

 

I mean EVERY Scientist.....not every person.

Real Science in my opinion delivers facts based on experimentation under controlled circumstances that doesn't waver and is not open to speculation.
LAWS that are irrefutable..like gravity.

Otherwise it is nothing more than theory and supposition with many different results and opinion. Music is theory!!! That is not science in my book. It is no more than my belief in what others call supposition without fact. In my case I believe in the written word and archeological back up and the resultant forces on mankind based on one apparently extraordinary man.

 

You mean before Constantinople merged the gospels into one version?