3rd gen torque converter shudder

What rpm are you feeling the shutter at?

 

Just some thoughts...

ATF-IV and ATF-WS were developed with special attention paid to the slip control (flex lock) requirements, amongst other things. Most pertinently; anti-shudder, sufficient high friction coefficient for the clutches and high torque transmission characteristics. The former and latter are a balancing act.

As the years go by, and flex lock gets more agressive...maybe the ATF-WS just isn't cutting it anymore, or never did. The Toyota torque converter shudder complaints are going on 15 years...
Sometimes, it can be programmed out...

Other vehicle manufacturers face the same challenges, as they all use some type of slip control(TCC) in their 'traditional' transmissions.

 

Don't notice any shutter in my 2020 truck, but it happens in a buddies 2019 at very low rpm or so, similar to lugging the engine. You can feel some minor shaking when sitting in the passenger seat at only those low rpm. Still don't know if you call that converter shutter, or not.

 

That's the rub though, isn't it?
Some are affected, some aren't.
My 2016 has no shudder...

note: I'm on the 1st T-SB and use 91 E0

 

Everybody that has shudders calls it a converter shudder but is it really a converter shudder ?
Toyota,s idea to save fuel gets you shifted up to the highest gear possible then they lock the engine directly to the transmission with the locking converter .
A shudder occurs when the clutch inside the converter is commanded on . When the computer in your truck commands the torque converter clutch to apply , a shudder will occur for a split second as the converter clutch mates up against the converter dampener .
If you are experiencing a constant surging or a light bucking feeling after the converter is locked , the issue is no longer considered a converter shudder . The converter was commanded on by the computer in your truck and the clutch inside the converter did its job properly . The converter clutch did not slip as the clutch disc mated with the dampener .

Most members feel surging after the converter is fully locked and this is where things get interesting and you begin to feel it in the drivers seat .
There are hundreds of reasons for surging with these trucks and these tiny issues that cause surging can be incredibly difficult to diagnose . The engine is breaking in , the engine has a very very slight slight misfire , type of fuel , improper balancing of the driveline , a rear tire out of balance by .05 of a gram . a slight warp on the rear brake drums are only a few
When the converter locks directly to the engine, all these tiny issues get amplified X 100 when your sitting in the drivers seat.
Is surging a normal characteristic of the truck as the dealerships state ? it certainly shouldn't be .

 

It’s at low RPM. Between 1000 and 2000 ... which is what the truck is at all the time when cruising ..

 

I think around 1000-1200 rpm in 6th would be pretty normal for these transmissions...some don't, but my buddies does it around 1200. Never saw it at 2k either in my truck, or a buddies. Don't know about others.

 

I agree with you. Mine only does it under 1500rpm in 6th (little bit in 5th).
Seems all of the posts I've read are at low rpm. This is the first I've seen referring to it at 2000rpm.

 

I"ve been reading through this thread about your issues. I'm sorry to hear all of it. I would be crushed like you to be driving a Taco I once loved but now hate because of the shudder. I'm about to get the '22 version of your vehicle. Is yours M/T or A/T? I def want to get ahead of any issues.

And what's the latest news? (Maybe I should continue reading further!)

 

Thats whats weird. I don't know about all trims, but the trd had the shutter, or shaking issue at lower rpm. My sr5 doesn't, plus it makes more power than a buddies x 2019 trd did. I'm guessing that has a lot to do with it. I keep thinking that some trucks just run better than others the way their tuned, or built from toyota. Could be the reason why so many feel they have the need for those aftermarket tunes.

 

I know that everyone thinks the rear diff ratio is 3.9 on ATs, but the axle code on SR5 is a different code compare to TRD AT models. This could be a variable that you see between yours and your friends TRD trims.

 

getting a manual would fix that

 

I know this is probably late for the OP but, in my experience with my 19 sr dcsb v-6... I had concerns around 500 miles. I felt what I thought was tc shudder at around the 48 to 52 mph range as well as a more prominent driveline vibe at highway speeds in 5th or 6th gears, a low speed 11to 15 mph whomp whomp rotational sound, a howling rear end, a light spark knock and a squeal in the a/c system maybe thats it. Lol. The first shop replaced the rear end and took away the howl but could not consistently duplicate the "tc shudder". Like others here ect seemed to help alleviate this shift point vs load as well as driving in s5.... second dealership recognized something was off with tc or driveline and began checking everything out. They resolved the issue with what was at the time a tsb that applied to the 16 and 17's for rear axle and drums being out of spec and replaced both. At this point the vibes were actually feathering the tires. This fixed the highway vibe and some of the lower speed vibes but not the "miss" or 5th to 6th shudder. After a toyota field rep came out he reported everything normal charecteristics of the vehicle. The a/c sound is a flaw in the system but only a sound basically described as missing a dampener in the line to prevent this noise. In the end within a few thousand miles everything from the rear end back had been replaced and still had the shudder. I switched from 87 octane to name brand 89 octane sunoco, exxon or shell... after about 100 miles I could see a drastic difference in shifting and performance of the truck. Mpg even went up by about 2. I had a luv and hate relationship with this truck until about 20k.... today, I luv the truck. Fortunately I had two pretty good dealerships to use. My suggestion for anyone with issues is if you don't get help at one dealership, go to another one. They all have different experiences and in my case different terrain and highways to test drive on.

 

A/T. Only automatic transmissions have torque converters. Sadly the news is that i havent been able to do anything with the truck to make it better. Kdmaxx pro with premium gas helps but shudder is still there. I am now selling my truck for what I originally paid for it and getting a 22’ TRD off road. Hoping the next one doesn’t bring me any headaches. If it does ill just sell it lol. This market lets you do these things. I can’t believe after a year and a half, and 20,000 mi., im getting exactly what I paid for the truck back

 

Totally! I totaled my truck beginning of last month. I paid 33,999 for it in 2017 and four years later I got an insurance check for practically the same amount! It was actually higher, but less the $1K deductible. Now I poured all that into a 2022 Sport. Should be coming next month.

 

Awesome man good for you (except totaling your truck) My 22 Off road arrives next month too. Excited and hopefully this headache is over

 

Wishing nothing but good news for you brother. Post pics when you get it!

 

His trd was the same as far as being an auto 3.5 as mine. I assume a 3.90 ratio was the same for his as mine? Only big difference was his was a 2019 double cab trd. I doubt toyota would make a more expensive trim as a trd have inferior performance to the sr5....as least not knowingly.

 

No shudder on my 2022 although milage is super low. The trans seems better than older models too. Sure it likes getting to top gear but no tip in issues yet, no bump when changing gears. Much better than my f250. This is when only drive selected. Im happy with it so far.

 

Look at the door's sticker or the label on the pumpkin. Do you have A04A (A4)? Per toyota axle coding, 04 represents the diff ratio.
Compare to TRD trim with AT.
On the web, 04 is not 3.9 for US and Australia markets. Some references point to gen2 TRD 3.7 diff.
SR5 drivetrain is not the same as TRD per the sticker.
This could be the reason SR5 drives better and doesn't have some of the issues.