2025 EV Tacoma thread.

My point was with the horse and buggy comparison is some think they will be forced to drive an EV. With the Amish I believe their choices are religious and for some ICE is a religion. I think the reason horse and buggies were replaced by cars, is cars are simply better. I do think there maybe some basis to the fear that gas prices will rise with the lack of demand, but that is not today's problem. (cough, Ukraine cough) Today EV's simply don't make up enough of the cars on the road to have had any impact. When the price of gas does go up it will be because the price of EV's has dropped to less than ICE cars and they are mainstream transportation. Is that being forced, not to my way of thinking. The big picture of EV superiority will be driving those changes, not what ever idiot is currently occupying the white house.

 

As much as I like clean simple design, Tesla doesn’t do it for me, especially for the price they command…doesn’t scream luxury to me. Have a few clients that have them, they get all excited…look at my Tesla! Yep is it a car…kinda boring looking, yeah? Which I get a frown in return.

Am kinda excited about the VW I.D. Buzz, mainly because we used to own a Westy for 8 years among others though my wife who also loves air cooled VWs hates it.

Like the Rivian, but can buy two Tacoma’s for that. Or one and $40K left over for fuel and burritos…

 

Price of gas rises either because of extreme demand or diminishing supply. Economics 101. The later is the case right now and it is because of the driven policies in our country. If anything, when EVs become mainstream, and they will, the price of gas will go down because of diminished demand.

 

Pay for gas or charge you car free with solar panels and get paid to generate power to boot what’s wrong with that? Solar is getting dirt cheap.

 

Tesla isn't borderline monopoly, it is a fully fledged monopoly. GM delivered 26 EV's in Q4 2021. Ford is planning on selling in 3 years the number of cars Tesla is going to sell this quarter. That's a monopoly in my book. TBH I'm only hoping capitalism hasn't become so broken that the other guys can't compete and take away some of that 30% margin. A few mega-corporations own everything. The fact that Tesla even exists is something of a miracle. The right to repair is another fuckery that I have no words for. If only owner repair were the norm rather than the exception for most everything.

I think in time you will find that EV's aren't that terrible. Not with today's crop, but what is in the pipeline. There are still problems but by the time Ford is not making ICE I don't think EV's will be a big deal any more. And, I was unaware that the Amish had to do anything other than live their lives they way they choose.

All that could be fixed, but the same forces that are driving the mega-corporations are standing in the way. No I'm not talking about conspiracy bull shit, but discussing those points will instantly turn political so I'll stay off the banned list for now.

The only thing I disagree with is the timing. I don't think EV adoption is a lifetime thing. In 10 years ICE sales will look like EV sales today, and as the ICE fleet ages to retirement people will replace them with EV's simply based on cost. There maybe some ICE still being sold for edge cases where EV's can't do the job. You can replace 10 years with any number you like, that is how I think EV adoption will go.

 

Few weeks ago I think it was at a shopping mall, or some other commercial building. There was a fire and the fire dept had to remove some of the solar panels to extinguisher the fire. Damage to the panels, and delaying their ability to quickly extinguish the fire. Causing more damage to the building.

I'm no insurance underwriter, but their premiums probably went up.

 

It is? Dude solar panels to do basic stuff on a house are pretty pricey. Average sized homes mean about a $20k upgrade. I like the idea, and people like JerryRigEverything on YT sure do make it look easy, but it's not - and it's expensive. I will admit to having limited knowledge here, but from my understanding you also get charged for it? That angers me.

See, I figured we were on similar pages. I am not bashing EV. I just don't think it's practical for the cost currently. And I agree with most people here including yourself.

Yea, the amish are similar to our local Hutterites. They pay a lot of taxes. They are pretty well off communities.

I agree that it's difficult to leave the politics out of that whole debate. We'll steer clear of it. Hell, even involving the word government is a touchy subject lol. I also agree about the forms of it

I would also love to see more self sustainable sources in shorter time frames. But it is expensive right now. Even trying to be "off grid" is pretty ridiculous. All these cool shows about that lifestyle don't ever cover the costs. They do somewhat cover the labor though... Anyways... seems most of us are on the same page, I just come off a little strong winded starting out Good talking to ya!

 

I can build a grid tie system for less that 10k so

 

so... that is not average. I know posting links is useless, but just for a reference: Average starting cost of solar panels on a home

There is too many variables. $10 seems unnaturally cheap, but if you can do it, more power to ya! Still, puts most Americans (and any other country really) another $10k+ in debt.

 

I actually took econ 101, 201, 301, 401 and 501. Supply and demand are certainly a part of the equation. But, if there is no demand then the price does go up. Refineries don't run for free, (see fucking expensive) and if there isn't a demand fewer and fewer buyers have to cover more and more costs. Without demand the price of gas will go up long term.

I have solar and love it. My payback will be after 7/8 years of ownership with another 20 years of life in the system. I will be nerding out trying to charge my Tesla using only solar, well as best I can, but I don't think it's going to be something I'll be doing on a regular basis. For now I'll just say my Tesla partially runs on sunshine.

 

I looked into grid tied solar and my estimates had like a 17 year point just to break even, just doesn't make sense but maybe prices will drop dramatically in the future.

 

If a Tacoma released that was ev, and under 60k, with a 450 km range, I’d own it tomorrow. I can’t afford the 1.70/L the gas is here. I drive 4000km a month. You can do the math on how much that is.

 

17 years?! Holly shit! I first looked into solar in 2007 and the payback didn't make any sense. When I looked again in 2019 it was in the 7/8 year range and pulled the trigger. Is a 17 year payback a recent quote? IDK maybe covid has blown up solar too, but 17 years just doesn't seem right.

 

Just in the past year or so, my average monthly electricity bill probably runs about $125 so that takes awhile to add up. The one thing l didnt like about the solar quotes was it reminded me of a shady car dealer, pages and pages of numbers showing yearly costs and unnecessary BS.

 

I wouldn't touch the battery swap model with a 10 foot pole. Sandy Munro tells it better than I can starting at about the 4:00 mark. Why would I want to have to drive some place to get a charged battery? I know it's like driving to the gas station which seems a perfectly normal thing to do. But with EV's charging at home is a game changer.

 

There is no “free”.

Was quoted $25-30K on the low end recently.

Kinda screwed if you decide to move too, which we are in couple years. Makes little sense, plus we live in a state that already has a large percentage of renewables. I can’t justify it, especially since the ROI is at least 15+ years. That is not even factoring in the cost of the vehicle. Currently that would be $80K for a Rivian to replace the Tacoma, only vehicle available now that is close. That is if you can get one, I’ll probably be dead before I can recoup my investment.

So many other things rather spend money on.

 

What about the millions of people that live in apartments. They won't have the luxury of charging at home, they have to park on the street.

Also not just about charging at home. A removable battery allows one to drive much further than a measly 300 mile range.

 

That is what I was thinking, I take an awful lot of road trips. Quick battery change would get stop time on par as petrol.

 

You want someone else’s crap batter in your car?

https://shopsolarkits.com/products/complete-all-in-one-off-grid-solar-kit-hbk-8

That’s even pricy but for the ignorant people out there that can’t built a kit this works I guess

 

That sounds like a logistics nightmare unless you're only leasing the packs.

Based on a similar powertrain as a Prius, I can be in EV up to 8

My (not-grid tied) panels have gotten 1% efficiency today, thanks to about 2" of rainfall. It's like that about half the year.

Good thing we have hydro here from all that rain... But that's not 'free' either. We're in the worst insolation zone in the country.