Shop Time w/T.W. Friends

so peaceful

 

I remember the screw in fuses in my childhood homes. It’s been so long since I saw a panel like that I really wondered how hard it was to find the fuses.

 

The panel design is poor, but the original breakers were horrible. I have a Stab-lock panel in my house (1969 build), and now that I've replaced all the breakers with new ones made by (I think) Siemens, it's fine. The main issue I have with it is that the bus bars aren't offset they way they are in other panels, so when you're trying to wire up a 220 cct, if you're not paying attention, it's easy to get both sides on the same leg and then spend a long time going, "WTF????" before you

 

You can buy them readily at Ace / Lowes / HD around here in Utah at least.

 

Past Tech with Rusty - Sparky Edition

Here is how the old main & range is wired.

240 volt Utility power in at the top left, through (2) 60 amp cartridge fuses located in the "Main" pullout. Removing it cuts the power to the house.

The utility neutral is at the top center with the ground wire too, the 120 volt neutrals are at the bottom center. Neutral and ground are bonded together at the service entrance panel.

Unseen in the photo are 2 buss bars going to the bottom of the "Range" pullout which has 50 or 60 amp fuses, functionally it works just line the Main, the heavy wires at the top right go off to the electric range. Notice the white wire going along with the range wires, this functioned as both the neutral and the ground, early 240 volt appliances only had 3 wires.

There are 4 fuses serving lights and receptacles powered by the Main, 2 on on each leg of the utility power.

Between the fuses and powered by the hidden buss bars are 2 lugs for a 240 volt electric water heater or dryer, usually (hopefully) there would be a small disconnect nearby with fuses sized for the load. This was important because those lugs were on the 60 amp side. Without a disconnect you could pull the Main and shut off the water heater (and the house) but normally a water heater is on 30 amp wire (#10).





Properly called a fused safety switch, in industry we often refer to them as a local disconnect because it will be mounted close to a machine.
Old timers called them "side arm switches" because the operating handle location.

Notice the fuses are the same "Edison base" as the main panel, these also can have cartridge fuses.



Cartridge fuse, these come in many sizes, some guys call the larger variety "candlestick fuses".



There you have it fellers, all you never needed to know about an obsolete electrical dinosaur -- that might just still be lurking in your basement.

 

My baby girl (3-yr who swears she's 14) had a fever last night too. God forbid she takes the medicine I give her without literally melting into her bed. This morning she bounces out of bed and vehemently proclaims that her head feels better! Yet she doesn't put two and two together when the next time the baby Tylenol comes out. SSDD. But man, the sleeping face is one of the best faces ever to behold.

-J

 

@Taco critter
Happy birthday bud!

 

Damm this thread is too busy to keep up!

 

I dug out the old PSP. Took me 5 tries to get the game to read but it finally did.

 

Skip to the end like I do



Just kidding

 

The breaker design is where the class action lawsuit came from, they submitted false data to UL. (A bit like the VW diesel-gate of a few years ago.)

The FPE panels are so small inside too, p-i-a to work on.

 

Federal says it’s normal.

 

Why are the neutral and ground put together in some cases? Doesn’t that defeat the purpose?

 

Todays job threw up all its wiring.

 

The neutral and ground are only bonded at the first distribution point after the utility meter. After that, they should remain separate so as not to induce current into the grounding system.

 

I love how aviation wiring is all white...

 

Neutral and ground are always bonded together at the service entrance.
In a sub panel application the neutral is always isolated from the ground.

This is where many guys mess up, it doesn't matter if the sub panel is right next to the main or in another building it must have 4 wires and neutral will be isolated.

In the old days 3 wire subs were common, as the years have passed the engineers have determined that the 4 wire layout is safer. This is the same reason modern dryers and ranges use a 4 wire cable.

If you had an open neutral in a 3 wire sub or device the panel/conduit/device could become electrically hot and without a solid path back to the service entrance no breaker would trip. If a person came along and touched the now hot item they might find themselves on the receiving end of the full potential of the system - which still wouldn't trip a breaker.

 

Easier to mark with UV lasers. Though there’s a lot more black, reds, and purples in this new monolithic harness. But they are labeled with ink dot and it’s already rubbing off. So those colors all get labeling sleeves now…

 

Thanks!