The LED SAE J583 Fog Pod & Fog Light Review

@Diode Dynamics for swapping SS3 lenses from selective yellow to clear to get 4000k sae fogs is there a proper torque spec (in/lbs) for the T10 machine screws into the bezel? If there is, is it the same torque for the SS5's as well?

I was going to ask this in another thread but this one is filled with such great specs and information that I thought it would be alright to ask here.

 

Personally, and I know many people I talk to feel the same, running bright fogs or driving lights or even worse ditch lights or a problem that’s gone back years and years, running a light bar during daylight hours is both obnoxious and difficult on the eyes of other drivers.

Whenever I see someone running bright LED’s in the daytime I definitely don’t think they’re doing it for safety, I figure they’re either completely ignorant or selfishly oblivious to the concerns of other drivers.

 

Or maybe mislead by companies promoting their products as something they are not, as most average consumers trust the vendor without understanding the actual lighting science. Baja promoted highly unsafe lighting practices for years putting other motorists in direct danger with complete disregard for lighting compliance in promoting their non-SAE products for street use.

 

Perhaps, but I gotta feel people getting $30 light bars off eBay running them in the daytime clearly don’t give a shit, especially as people are flashing their lights and shielding their eyes.

I feel the same about the current era of people doing exactly what we’re talking about, running extremely bright amber fogs in the daytime. I’ve seen enough people doing it that I’m sure those who do it have experienced it for themselves so they should know better.

In these cases it seems to me to be an ego thing like covering every available inch of the truck with lights, traction boards, fuel cans, storage boxes and the obligatory rooftop tent that stays on all year round.

I’ve got everything I just mentioned down to the light bar, but I don’t keep track boards or fuel cans or even an ax or shovel when I’m not heading out. Last time I needed spare fuel or a shovel wasn’t cruising around my neighborhood or heading to Costco

 

I do agree, if companies are selling these insanely bright lights as non SAE compliant fog lights that don’t have a proper cutoff or for added safety during the day in daily driving, that’s just misleading.

Diode Dynamics at least sells the backlight function. I opted for red backlight in my SSC2 flood pros I’m mounting in my rear bumper. I like to think of that as an added safety feature

 

Yes, those individuals are certainly out there unfortunetely.

Funny thing about those extremely bright amber (aka yellow) fogs, if the fog is an SAE compliant fog it will have a cut off that makes it not appear bright to oncoming drivers at all when properly aimed, regardless of how bright the light source is. The vast majority of the time those with extremely bright yellow LED "fogs" are running Baja Squadrons, which are not an SAE lamp and do not have cut offs which is why they appear so blindingly bright and hazardous to other motorists. And Baja actively falsely promoted Squadrons as safe for street use for years. And why wouldn't their customers trust a major US name brand lighting manufacture on proper light usage? See the original post in this thread as an example. The problem isn't always they end user, but sometimes the companies telling the end user that the illegal and unsafe product use is ok on the street.

 

Yeah, that is bad, why a company like Diode Dynamics is killing it now because they’ve done their research and sell products based on specific need, even if all that’s required to change their functionality is to swap a different lens cover. It’s like when I had Lightforce 170’s on the front bumper (man, weren’t they all the rage 15 years ago!), they had different covers which kind of helped, but regardless, even with the filter that made the beam spread, common sense told me I’d never dream of running them in the daytime, because why would I? And that was living in Seattle with a ton of congestion on narrow roads and people not paying very close attention, which was required all of the time.

 

Hey @crashnburn80 , thanks for the awesome thread. I've had my eye on it for a couple of years now. I'm curious about a few things. Previously, you used to recommend amber over selective yellow for foul weather conditions. I believe you based this on its lower kelvin rating. What made you decide that selective yellow is actually better than amber?

I'm trying to decide which fog light to go with for my application. I currently have the OEM headlight with the harness/bulb upgrade and stock fogs. I run my fogs all of the time, as it adds some light directly in front of the truck, and the wide pattern helps illuminate the sides of the road. I know I've read online that fogs should only be used when necessary. I don't fully understand why this is a concern. They are aimed lower than the headlights. Are the cutoffs not good enough? I've never been flashed for them. Is this more of a concern for the high output LEDs? Even then, it seems there are a lot of options with very good cutoffs.

I'm just about finished my retrofit project with Morimoto D2S 5.0 projectors and 35W 4300k bulbs. I was considering either finding a fog with a similar kelvin rating and running them somewhat regularly, or buying a selective yellow option and running them only in adverse weather conditions. I'm leaning towards the selective yellow but curious on your thoughts on this.

 

If you are worried about matching, getting a selective yellow SS3 sport or pro and swapping to clear lenses gives you a nice 4000k that looks very close to something like an Osram NBL (one of the best D2S HID bulbs out there).

 

Installed the elite fogs. Had the opportunity to test in some rain then sleet that transitioned to wet snow. They worked great in the rain but they completely packed in with snow and had zero benefit. Not he best photos it was a challenging drive and I wanted a few beers. Hopefully in colder weather they will work better. Remarkable in clear conditions.

 

They dont generate enough heat for heavy wet snow, if its cold and or dry snow they should be fine.

 

That's too bad. I'm leaning towards the Elite's myself, but it is disappointing they aren't hot enough to melt the snow build up. I prefer the round OEM look.

 

When I started this thread there were only white LED SAE fogs, the KC G4s had the best color temp at 5000k, but all the others were at 6000k+. 6000k makes for a poor foglight for use in poor weather conditions, which is the sole purpose of a fog lamp. 6000k is highly reflective off of rain/snow/fog or wet road surfaces and people are more sensitive to short wavelength blue light so that reflected light is going to have disproportionate negative effects on visibility. Anyone with 6000k LED headlights driving in snow has experienced this compared to driving in snow with halogens. There is a significant Star Wars light speed effect that makes it difficult to see the road beyond the radioactively glowing snow fall in the foreground reflected by the the high color temp lights. Bluer light is also more difficult to visually process than warmer color temps. Personally I would not run any of the white LED products and after testing nearly all products on the market I continued on with my OEM H11 halogen fogs, which also had the benefit of melting snow.

When the KC Amber G4s hit the market, they were the first non-white SAE LED fog. For the first time an LED SAE fog didn't have the problematic short wavelength high color temp light. It was a step forward for actual poor weather use. Morimoto followed soon after with an amber version backed by Kustom54lighting. While eliminating the short wavelength high color temp light was good, the amber fogs were very monochromatic (especially Morimoto) and the output intensity was rather poor. OEM halogen fogs were still higher performing. At this point in time for those wanting LED fogs, amber did look appealing over white.
Reviews: KC Amber, Morimoto Amber

You can see how the ambers remove the sub-500nm reflective light from the spectrum, whereas the white LEDs have a huge short wavelength high amplitude spike. Unfortunately though total output intensity is also low, as determined by area under the curve.


Rigid then came out with the first SAE selective yellow fogs with the D-Series Rigid Selective Yellow. Monochromaticity was no longer an issue, the output was substantially improved over amber, and for the first time color filtration produced a heated lens. Everything for performance was better than amber, but the square pod did not mount easily in a fog location without drilling and the use of adapter plates. Then Diode Dynamics SS3s came out with selective yellow fogs that mount into the OEM location, provided substantially higher output than Rigid, had higher power options that ran hotter and provided a richer yellow and it made all other LED fogs obsolete at that time.
Reviews: Diode Dynamics SS3 Max, Diode Dynamics SS3

You can see that selective yellow also eliminates that sub-500nm light, but doesn't take the same output loss as amber. There is more output in the 500-540nm range, but it isn't in the offensive category like that high amplitude spike of the short wavelength light of the white fogs.


So the recommendations have continued to evolve over time based on new technologies and new products.

It is not a concern for other drivers as an SAE fog will not affect them, it is a concern for you. High amounts of foreground light from a fog reduce your distance night vision and constrict your pupils at night, especially if you are using powerful white LED fogs. Headlights are designed to have peak intensity at the cut off for distance projection and minimize the foreground light so you can see that distance at night. Flooding the foreground with fogs is counter to that purpose and counter to your ability to see distance at night. Unfortunately people judge light output based on what is close to them, aka foreground light. So many people run their fogs all the time because it feels better, as you feel like you can see better. But the opposite is true, flooding the foreground with light has reduced your ability to see distance and can also be distracting as your eyes tend to track to perceived peak light intensity which is now much closer to the vehicle with the fogs rather than at the headlight horizon.

Certainly not surprised, this was called out in the review. Good pics though backing what was stated in the review. For snow conditions the SS3 Max in selective yellow is what is recommended. Data in the selective yellow max post shows the extreme lens surface temps and I've personally put them through blizzard conditions in the mountains where all lights failed due to snow but the Maxes remained perfectly clear.

 

Nice and bright yellow LEDs I suppose so I just installed some super yellow hella bulbs in to my fog lights these are rated at 2900k
I was more in to the way they look when I’ve seen others but these did added some easier. Visibility in the dark; I literally had them on for 15 minutes and started this search so I might post later once I get to drive at night some more and share my thoughts.yours look awesome
I’ll post a couple of pictures in case it helps anyone to compare

 

Yellow bulbs are lower output than stock bulbs due to the yellow filtration coating which removes short wavelength higher color temp light to shift the color to yellow. All filters remove output. That said halogens do not have a lot of high color temp light, so output loss is minimal vs trying to make a halogen whiter by removing warm color temp light, which is the bulk of the halogen output.

These look like your stock bulbs in the Hella blister pack, since the Hellas are visibly yellow.

What are you running in your headlights? Those appear pretty high in color temp, but cameras can sometimes skew the perceived color when photographing light sources that differ in color substantially.

 

Thank you for such a detailed response!

 

I’m actually running Sylvania LEDs they are quite brighter than stock as my truck was not originally equipped with LEDs
My understanding is the same brand makes The fog light LED replacement bulbs I might try those in the future instead of the yellow Hellas
I went driving for a few minutes they are actually cool looking and the current LEDs are bright enough to the point I don’t think I need anything brighter but the pursue of change will most likely kick in and I might try something else in the near future lol!

 

Here is at the Golden bridge in sacramento California

 

The Sylvania LEDs are actually a downgrade from stock. You've lost distance projection and output intensity while shifting your pattern to foreground light which makes you believe you can see better even thought the opposite is actually true. Sylvania does not sell their headlight LEDs in North America as replacement LEDs for use in headlights on public roads is illegal in the US, so Sylvania only sells their low powered, low output replacement fog LEDs in the US. Many vendors will mislead consumers selling the fog bulbs as headlight bulbs, even though they are far too underpowered for a headlight product. To have the actual Sylvania headlight LEDs you'd need to directly import from Europe or Japan, if bought domestically you have the low powered fog LEDs.

But let's just assume you did the research and went above and beyond to import headlight grade LEDs out of Europe like I did, rather than running domestically purchased Sylvanias which Sylvania explicitly warns should never be used for headlight applications due to inadequate output. You can see the Sylvania LED headlight bulb review posted here. Not a recommended product. If wanting to run LED the recommended product is OEM LED covered in post #3626 here. If set on wanting replacement LEDs, the Morimoto 2stroke 3.0s is by far the best option covered here, however they are easily outperformed by halogen upgrades in the halogen projector.