Crush washers need to be re-torqued

What do you mean by come loose? Does oil start dripping out?

The reason the torque backs off is because it's a washer that is designed to crush. If it was harder steel like a regular washer the torque would stay at 30. It's not the kind of fastener that has to "stay at 30" to do its job, it's just a drain plug. It just has to crush the soft washer a little

If you keep torquing and torquing you're just squeezing it thinner and thinner.

 

We torque to 30lbft, with a Snap-On recalibrated quite often, every-time I change the oil. The drain plug was hardly tight and slight seep of oil around the plug. That happened several times, so, I would drive for several hundred miles and re-torque. Problem solved.

I know the wrenches are as accurate as they can be because they are used, not by me, for a lot of engine work that accuracy is important. My buddy didn’t even believe me until the next time I made him loosen it. Then he believed me.

The fiber/aluminum ones they give are shit. They did give me, early on, some normal aluminum ones. The stock one was a fiber one that was a bitch to break loose. Way more than 30lbft. The truck has 70k with 5k OCIs.

 

Have you tried a different bolt? Sometimes they stretch

Fiber material stuck on the pan?

There shouldn't really be any wetness at all. I wonder if the threads in the pan were somehow damaged on that first installation at the factory.

 

Have not tried different bolt, no crap on the pan. At first we didn’t torque them, just tight and a little more. We thought that was the problem, so then we did torque them.
No damaged threads, bolt threads very nicely and after I re torque no problem at all. It’s like fiber crap shrinks? Don’t know, but Toyota did give a regular aluminum one maybe 1 to 2 times and was perfect.
I’ll ask if they have the aluminum ones and go that route,

 

Would definitely just use original Toyota oil drain crush washers. Or install a Fumoto valve, witness-mark it & call it good.

On the subject of torque wrenches -- anyone recognize / use / have an opinion on the

$304 Tohnichi Adjustable Torque Wrench QL150F-4A (30~150ft.lbs.)

Tohnichi brand? Japanese, made-in-Japan, fairly expensive. From the look of their website they make a very large variety of industrial-grade torque instruments, so I figure they must be legit.

As a DIY / own-vehicle-only mechanic I don't need to use a torque wrench very often but it's nice to have when needed.

 

This is a little inaccurate, as related to the type crush washer I've been discussing. Initial torque is attained @ 30ft lbs, after the crush washer has deformed. Something is happening to the crush washer shortly after this though, I do believe it is the crush washer's two sided gasket material that is degrading afterwards, thereby reducing the tension against the aluminum portion of the crush washer. A secondary application of torque seems to rectify this anomaly.

 

I don’t get the point of your post it serves no purpose in the conversation

 

Maybe not creep backwards on its own. But these little bastards leak if you don't replace them every time. They are very specific crush washers.

 

Thats because Mr Gorilla arms doesnt understand that you just need to tighten until the crush washer crushes plus a smidge more. Its an easy thing to feel if you dont go bore. Lots of stupid people out there and they exist on both spectrums.

 

I believe this is possible. Esp given when I worked at Toyota there was always some blue fiber on the pan and plug. Some were over torqued and required a larger ratchet to remove. Most likely caused by the fear of it leaking.

 

Fair enough, if it's gotta be 30 then its gotta be 30..

For me, since I never have problems with anything dripping or leaking, I'm not obsessed with a specific torque. The bigger priority is to get a few uses out of the washer before it's paper thin.

 

Half their factories are in China but seems to be a competitive price for a cheaper torque wrench. I personally don’t like the open head nor the lack of NM measurements.

 

Well if you read the post just before mine you’d figure it out, or maybe not.

 

you quoted my post, why because I use a torque wrench instead of just using feel?

 

Quit being obtuse re read what you said and you’ll see I gave you exactly what you asked for.

 

If you say “laugh at me if…” and then someone laughs, it shouldn’t be too hard to know why, lol.

Jeff

 

Been doing my oil changes on various vehicels for the last 50 years... never torqued a oil drain plug (too easy to miss the click.) Never had a problem with oil leaking. On my 2007 Offroad i use the crush washers sold by Toyota... when it's time to remove the plug it's never been loose. OP... are you sure the crush washer from the previous oil change got removed?

 

The drain plug isn't loosing or relaxing post installation. Used washers are not the same as new washers.

Plain washers are annealed aluminum. When tightened they are under compression, this causes the mating surfaces to work harden. Reuse that washer and you will need to tighten it to a higher value to achieve compression. After a few uses the part is work hardened enough that the slight compressive force of tightening a drain bolt no longer create a seal.

You can heat and quench the washer to anneal it but it's difficult to do in a shop setting because aluminum doesn't change color when heating. You will probably melt it or not get it hot enough for the metallic structure to change when quenched. Copper washers are simple. Heat until red hot, quench and it's as good as new. This is why so many horror stories about stripped drain plugs exit. Tighten it more each time the washer is reused until...

The Blue Washers - these have a fibrous cement coating over an aluminum washer. Instead of relying on the aluminum slightly compressing to achieve a seal the coating creates the seal. When tightened the compressive pressure activates the cement creating the seal. (It's the same principle as used on cement coated framing nails you buy at Home Depot, that create a grip when driven in) These are one-use items, the blue seal becomes much harder after the first use.

TLDR: It's beyond ignorant to preach that it is imperative to use a torque wrench on every non-critical fastener while simultaneously demanding that re-using a cheap ass expendable washer showcases your brilliance.

 

it seems like a lot of these responses are assuming the OP is using oem washers. he is not, hes using an equivalent. I dont believe i have come across any user that uses actual oem washers and has one come loose, torque wrench or not. I have personally come across "looks like oem" washers and found them to compress much easier than oem.

 

Ah now I see, my apologies ive been doing tons of transit overtime lately