Sub/amp question

i never said i wouldnt do it for my speakers but im really just looking for one right now

 

Alright so I've bought my mono amp and my new question is what is my multi channel amp need to be I am having 4 speakers and two tweeters hooked to it I guess ... so is a four channel 700 watt amp enough or do the resets not hook to the amp ... can somebody help me as I am pulling teeth elsewhere

 

I don't know you financial budget, but I can tell you from experience that a good system comes from spending good money....as with a lot of things. But, I don't know how picky your ears are either.

Going on to my next and more important part....when it comes to amps, besides spending good money on good shit the first time around, it's also very important to buy a stronger amp than all of your speakers need. This pays off in sound quality and the speaker's
health.
You damage speakers with under powered amps feeding them a lot of bullshit power....and they don't sound as good as intended either.

Yes, pay attention to "RMS" ratings in general. But those figures are more accurate and worthy as with high quality amps. And you probably already noticed that high quality amps are very expensive. I cant stress enough that You most certainly get what you pay for when buying amps!!!

You may want to shop the JL Audio amps. They are bad ass quality. Get one for the subs and a 2nd one for your highs.
I have their 75x4 for my highs and a 2nd one for my two 10s.
Damn it's been so long since I installed it all I can't remember the size of my sub amp, lol

 

I'm not sure what you mean by resets, but if your going with the HAT Clarus and Imagines then you will have two external cross overs for the clarus components. So you will have a positive and negative wire going from the crossover to your amp for each side, left and right. With the Imagines the crossover is built in so you will just have a positive and negative going straight from the speaker to the amp. 700 watts is more than enough for these speakers and probably overkill, but it will work.

 

So remember, get a good preamp/EQ and buy more power than you need. Don't stress over counting watts on everything....you'll spin your wheels and only stress yourself.
When the amps are hooked up, you simply turn the gains down to what your speakers can handle....and there you are, feeding good clean quality power to the speakers....nothing else!

 

FYI mike:
If it's a piece of shit 700watt amp, then those 700 watts don't really mean shit.
A cheap amp and a great amp are worlds apart of each other in reality! Don't get lost in all the advertising watt numbers on the box!

EDIT: "overkill" on amps is good....underkill is horrible!!!

 

Oh yea......and don't buy cheap wires and amp kits either! For the same reasons of quality sound. And run your RCA cables away from your speaker wires and make sure you use really good ground spots for the wires too! Don't under shoot on wire gauge or a big amp will overheat the negative cable and you will miss out on power there too. A chain is only as good as it's weakest link, and electricity knows this

 

I don't get it. 700 watts is.... 700 watts if the amp actually puts out 700 watts. Watts sound differently if they cost more?

 

If the amp puts out a true 700 watts, then no, it will sound no differently. Cheap amps are generally over rated so they will put out less than they are rated for.

 

Well no, I don't have any scientific data to explain it in definition form, but yea....the way you are thinking of that question is exactly what the Cheap amp manufacturers want you to think.

Have you ever done a lot of amp shopping over the years and wondered why it is you come across a 700watt amp that costs $200 and a different amp that has 200 watts @ $700?
Well, that 200watt will sound better than than the cheap 700watt amp.

That's just an example- which isn't far from reality. With amps, if you want good/accurate power, you really have to shop the better brands and higher prices.

 

Cool i still need my question answered a little more clearly with the HAT clarus and imagines, what do i get in means of an amp a 4 channel? then what would i have my tweets powered by the HU?

 

Oh if it makes any differenece my speakers are all 100 watt rms so i would need at least a 400x4 watt amp, so if i could should i get a 500x4 watt amp?

 

Yes a 4 channel amp will work fine. The tweeters will be powered by the amplifier also. You will have a wire going from your midbass to the external crossover and you will have a wire going from the tweeter to the crossover. Then from the crossover, you will have a single speaker wire going from the crossover to the amp for your left and right channels. Basically what the crossover is doing is taking one signal from the amp and distributing that signal, with the correct frequencies, to you midbass and tweeter.

 

God's honest truth - I've never heard the difference between two properly functioning amplifiers when their output has been matched except for those with higher noise floors. I've heard Krell amplifiers that cost more than some cars that don't sound any different than the average home theater receiver. The distortion levels are so low now with modern electronics that you simply can't tell the difference. I do however feel that an over abundance of hot air can easily change peoples' perception of how a component can sound.


Op, to answer your question about your speaker/amp configuration. I'd run the rear speakers off of the head unit (you don't really need them at all) and buy a 2 channel amp for your front components. The crossover included with your front speakers basically combines the tweeter and woofer into one speaker for brevity's sake. Therefore, one amp channel can run both the tweeter and woofer.

 

So I power my tweeters off of the woofer amp? I don't understand this beause there's so many different ways to approach it and I don't know what's the difference when someone says a speakers a mid bass and the highs

 

No, your tweeters will be powered by the same amp that powers the clarus and imagines speakers. Your subwoofer will be powered by a mono block amp, just completely take that out of the equation. This link may help you understand the wiring a little more. http://a248.e.akamai.net/pix.crutchfield.com/ca/reviews/20041109/15-ReceiverampXO-spkrs.jpg This would be the case if you were running no rear speakers. Since you are running rear speakers,if you wanted them amplified then your amp will have 2 other wires running to the imagines.

 

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Ok, I've gotta jump in here because we have waaaaaay too much misinformation flying around. Let's break this down into sections/topics so we don't get mixed up..

Amp A sounds better than B
In the car audio world, generally, a watt is a watt. If an amplifier produces clean, unclipped power, it will sound great. Two amps producing the same power will be almost impossible to tell apart. The only things that will likely differ are the total harmonic distortion (THD) which I mentioned in an earlier thread is irrelevant considering how much distortion a speaker creates; and of course the noise floor as was mentioned above. You want a noise floor that's low so you hear mostly music in relation to hiss.

I NEED X-amount of power
No, you don't. First things first, an amplifier that states it makes 100watts RMS only makes 100watts at it's full output. It does NOT make 100watts at all times. When you listen to music quietly the amp will only make a small amount of power. When you crank the volume knob it makes more power, that's why it gets louder. Think about it like a Bugatti Veyron, just because it CAN go 254mph doesn't mean it goes 254mph at all times. You can tool around at 20mph just like any other car. So anyone that says that underpowering a speaker hurts/damages it is delusional. The amount of power you're ACTUALLY using is far less than you think. Would you believe me if I said you probably don't normally listen to more than 4 watts of power at any given time? If you don't believe me, read on..if you do, read on to find out why.

Power required for a certain noise level is a very interesting science and depends largely on how efficient your speakers are. Let's say you are running a speaker that has an efficiency rating of 84db 1w/m. You put 1watt of power into it you'll get music that's 84db loud. Logical right? The decibel scale is logorythmic so you only gain 3db every time you double the power. Check out how this breaks down, you'll shit bricks...
84db Efficient Speaker
1w - 84db
2w - 87db
4w - 90db
8w - 93db
16w - 96db
32w - 99db
64w - 102db
128w- 105db

Now look at this shit.

90db Efficient Speaker
1w - 90db
2w - 93db
4w - 96db
8w - 99db
16w - 102db
32w - 105db

See what's happening? You need 128 watts on the 84db efficient speaker to reach the same output as the more efficient 90db speaker. You'd need an extra 96watts; holy shit!

Earlier I mentioned THD being a spec that was pretty much irrelevant. So I'm quoting myself on an earlier post because it's relevant to our discussion here. Not sure y'all are ready for this yet but I'll let you in on a little secret. Ever look at amplifier specs and see the specification 'THD'? That stands for total harmoinc distortion. Most amps spec WELL below .1% at their rated power; that's one tenth of a percent. How much distortion do you think a speaker adds to the signal path? Any idea? Even really high end stuff has WELL over 2% distortion....yes, that's more than 20times the distortion of the amp!

Conclusion
Now tell me, where do you think you should be spending your money? I'd argue that you should buy an amp that makes 'enough' power and fits (geometrically) in the spot you want to mount it. I'd spend my money on good speakers since as we've seen, they make the most difference.

 

Thank you. Should be a sticky forced upon anyone posting in the audio section.

 

Thanks man you really cleared it up for me so im getting the jl 13tw5 and it will be powered by a 600watt mono amp the sub is rated for 600 is that ok or will I be hurting the sub?

 

Bricks have been shat indeed haha....good response. I didn't know about the THD of the speaker being that high, but it makes sense in a way. Time to go read up on the noise floor, I've seen that mentioned several times in threads.