NEW UPDATE!!! Steering and Alignment Woes. I'm at my wits end.

Post up your latest printout. Lets see those numbers!

Sometimes, that is exactly what is called for - find a new shop.

 

Derp, yeah, I guess that's important useful info.

Here is the spec sheet from the new shop. It still pulls to the right just barely but that's probably mostly because around here all the roads are crowned really bad. If I drive on the left side, it pulls equally to the left. Maybe having even more caster on both sides would help with that.

Now that I'm looking at this new sheet, how did the first shop get it done so badly? It's not even close to being in spec.

 

Did you ask them to keep your caster in that range? I have no experience with JBA UCAs, do the JBAs limit the amount of caster? With the SPCs you had +1 degree of caster built into the UCAs and of course adjustable even further.

881s, SPCs at default setting and 255/85/16s here - This is where I'm at. Stable AF and solid tracking - no drift.

Bottom line, glad you worked it out and finally have it where you want to be.

 

JBAs are non-adjustable but have 3 degrees of caster built in. I'm using 883 springs because my front end (back end as well) is pretty heavy with an ARB bumper and a winch, and is likely to get heavier as soon as I get a 4x Innovations skid plate installed. The springs make it sit pretty high, I'm hoping they settle a little bit.

 

Yeah, no I get that. I'm just wondering why they couldn't get your caster up higher.

Prior to my most recent alignment, I had it at 4.5 | 4.5. When I went back in after the 4WD conversion, because I didn't mark my upper ball joints, it was off. My alignment tech was able to get to 3.9 | 3.9. We'll see where it sits once the 882s go on with the winch.

 

Welp, I was feeling paranoid again, so I went out and looked. Still, 2 of the alignment cam bolts are upside down. I'm gonna take it back in tomorrow and have them fix it. Frustrating because I specifically pointed at them when I brought it in the first time and explained what needed to be done and he confirmed that he understood. I will also request that they try to get the caster as close to 4 as they can.

 

Whatever works for you. They definitely need to keep those cam adjusters in the correct orientation and not upside down

4 might even be a bit much - I actually was going to have him bring me down to 3.5 and keep everything else where or close to where it was but he was the one who said he likes to get tacos at 4 or better. This guy's shop is quite popular amongst the NorCal/Bay Area TWers so he definitely knows his work. I've yet to touch the pinchweld and really don't want to so I stick with the SPCs. So far it's worked out for me.

 

Picked up the truck last night. Alignment cams were all good and had white paint markings on them. Drove about the same. They got the caster to be 2.8/3.7 degrees. Still pulled to the right just barely and just didn't feel right. The feeling of defeat was heavy. Literally the entire front suspension and steering systems are brand new. Sitting at home drowning my sorrows in bourbon, I had to go outside to shuffle cars around so they are parked in the correct order for priority of leaving in the morning, and an idea popped into my head as I did a sharp u-turn in my truck in the culdesac. The steering wheel at full lock wasn't even close to turned as far as it should have been. I KNOW WHAT THE PROBLEM IS!!!

When I paid a mechanic to replace the rack back in November, they must have installed the steering column at least 1 spline mis-aligned. That is exactly when my problems started. If the rack isn't centered, even if the wheels are centered, then the pump is constantly fighting to "straighten" the steering but actually just makes it pull to the right. In spite of the alignment numbers being perfect, if the valves and stuff inside the rack are not centered, it will put constant strain on the system that would feel like the vehicle pulling to the side.

So, I just dropped it off at the shop again and talked with the Service Manager. He agreed with my hypothesis and said he'd get it into the shop immediately. I told him I'm happy to pay whatever they needed for their time since this is basically an experiment and because my girlfriend and I are supposed to be heading out to the desert this afternoon. The caster and camber are already set, so just moving the shaft over one spline and resetting the toe should take less than an hour.

I'm excitedly hopeful this will be the end of my steering problems.

 

In all seriousness, I hope centering the rack fixes your pull.

 

A good alignment tech (seems so hard to find these days) should be inspecting everything and test driving as well. They should've picked up on the steering wheel not being centered and corrected it.

Damn man, I so hope this resolves your problem. I don't blame you one bit for the frustration or the bourbon lol.

Going to throw this out there since there will always be someone who comes across alignment threads and wonders what role caster and the rest of the numbers play -

What is Caster?
https://autoquarterly.com/wheel-alignment-what-is-caster/
What is Camber?
https://autoquarterly.com/what-is-camber/
Toe-In and Toe-Out, and Shake It All About
https://autoquarterly.com/all-about-wheel-alignment/

 

@Wanderlust Bus - If you get a chance, I'm curious - do you have roughly the same amount of threads showing on the LH and RH outer tie rods? Many moons ago when I was dealing with an alignment issue, I had some pretty screwed up threads on the outer ties. Had multiple more visible on the RH side vs the LH side.

 

I am not sure. I probably do but the truck is already at the shop on the rack so hopefully they'll figure that out.

 

YESSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!! It's a miracle!!! Just picked it up and the steering is spot on. The mechanic said it was 3 splines off.

 

Time for more bourbon to celebrate

 

Where they have you with caster, it's still bugging me (mentioned in my earlier posts).
Caster should be as close as possible to the same on both sides. If not, its going to pull/tend to want to track to the lesser side.







If it starts pulling again, maybe have them re-work your caster closer to the same. If they start talking about road crown, ask them to work the camber.

Not trying to put a damper on your good feeling after picking up the truck. Just wanted to point out the uneven caster IN CASE you run into it pulling again. You've been banging your head against the wall enough with this thing. Hoping it is fine but if its not, look at the difference in caster.

 

Seems i go through this on every vehicle I've ever had aligned "It's within specs. I think it drives great, get out of our face". I go down the street to somebody else and they set it better.

 

Well, We took the truck out into the desert this weekend. We did our best to get it stuck, and we succeeded! Luckily, we only needed about 10 minutes of shoveling to get unstuck. It drove fantastic on the freeway, dirt roads, and ice and snow fields. I'm hoping my alignment woes are at their end.

 

Well, I suppose it's time for an update. Over the few weeks following that trip, the steering got progressively worse. There is excessive play in the steering wheel. I had long given up on the first shop that replaced my rack twice and I had made an appointment for next Monday with a new shop and I had already decided to just pay for a new rack.

Fast forward a few weeks. Last night I swapped out my brake master cylinder and I was just checking other stuff under the hood and saw that the fluid in the power steering pump was clear! Those f!@#$ at the first shop used the wrong fluid. Needless to say, I am pretty pissed. Everything I've read says that actual power steering fluid will damage seals and hoses. Have any of you had to deal with this? I know there was this thread a couple weeks ago where a previous owner had put in the wrong fluid and he just had to deal with it. My situation is different because I paid a shop to do it and they messed up.


I need to go back to that shop and tell them they need to replace the entire system since it was compromised by the wrong fluid. I'm not really sure what to do next. I think I'll politely ask them exactly what fluid they used so I can make sure I use the right stuff when it comes time and when they tell me that they use ATF then I can point out that the stuff they used is NOT ATF and see what they say. I guess worst case scenario I can just dispute the charge with my credit card company and then just pay another shop to replace the entire system.

Edit: So, I've called a couple dealerships and a few independent shops and they all say that using power steering fluid instead of ATF won't really cause any damage. Power steering fluid is a thicker viscosity so it will feel a little stiffer when it's cold, ATF has some detergent additives, but they are nearly the same thing. I think I may just leave it for now and when it's time to flush the system I'll just change it back to ATF.

 

New update. Just heard back from the third shop. They think the play is coming from the Steering Shaft Universal Joint #2. They spent an entire day checking everything. They disconnected the steering shaft from the rack until this was the only joint connected to the steering wheel (not counting the tilt). They said this is absolutely where the play is coming from. From my experience this is exactly what is causing the strange steering feeling. I'm gonna order this part and dig into it this weekend. I'll try to update back when I get it fixed.

 

If you're not in a rush, $176 @ partsouq.
https://partsouq.com/en/search/all?q=4521060121

EDIT: My bad, wrong part. That is the upper portion. Not #2.

#2 should be -
https://partsouq.com/en/search/all?q=4586034020

There is also -
https://www.toyotapartsdeal.com/oem/toyota~yoke~sub~assy~steering~sliding~45290-35040.html