Amateur (Ham) Radio BS and Callsign Thread!

Eh just that yearly time to pop in and say hello

 

Mind posting a pic of that? Considering the same location on the new rig. 73

 

Kind of a noob question, but I haven't decided to fully pull the trigger on getting the HAM license yet; it seems like in L.A. the hardest part might be finding out when/where it's possible to take the test. I got a GMRS license and callsign, and my primary radio is a midland GMRS so that's going to meet my needs for the near future.

Since I also carry a Baofeng 5V (8W) as a backup/portable comm, I know I tecnically need a HAM license to use some of the bands that one can access which the Midland can't; I'm assuming the GMRS license covers me for using the Baofeng on the GMRS channels/band but not the higher frequencies.

Question is, will the callsign I have also apply to a future HAM license, or will there be a different one assigned?

 

You can take the test online.

No, that radio is not legal for GRMS.

The call sign will be different.

 

If I only transmit on frequencies matching set GMRS channels, what's the difference which hardware I'm using? The whole "justification" for licensing requirements seems to be tied to the allocation of frequency bands, so why is my existing license not applicable to using the related frequencies with any hardware?

I completely understand that I'd need a different license to transmit on other bands with the Baofeng.

Is it possible to get the same callsign assigned on a HAM license? From what I've read it's supposed to be possible to somehow request a particular callsign when taking the test, and it would seem to simply things from the FCC's end as well if people had the same sign on multiple licensing bands? (judging by the construction of their website, I'd understand if that's the exact reason why they wouldn't allow it though)

 

Well, firstly, the baofang is not type accepted for gmrs use.

I would reccomend a lot more reading about the difference between GMRS and amateur service, and what part 95 and part 97 are. They are not related in any way. Most of what you wrote is just bonkers.

You can get a vanity ham call if you want.

 

In the first 6 words of my first post I admitted to being new to most of this, so having more reading to do was my starting assumption.

The FCC (which claims the authority to regulate the internet) having a website which would have been considered poorly constructed in 1999, and which any private sector programming intern would be fired on the spot for handing in these days makes me wonder if it's my take on whether it's my thinking that's actually "bonkers"; the idea that use of specific hardware models

If I were to use the Baofeng on UHF frequency 462.575 (GMRS channel 16) using my assigned GMRS call, how would anyone not standing directly next to me have any idea whether or not I'm holding a "Part 95 approved" model, or non-"approved" commercial model, or even a home-built collection of components I soldered together in my garage? If they can't tell what I'm using to transmit, how could they meaningfully regulate that? It seems akin to needing to re-test for a new drivers license if I were to buy a Honda or a Ford after owning a Toyota.

I've worked for government contractors for over 25 years now, so I'm well aware that the overlap in the "venn diagram" of how regulators want things to happen and how things actually do happen in reality is almost nil; every year of the "drought" in CA it amazes me that the gov't here doesn't try to solve it by trying to legislate an increase in rainfall, and then act surprised whine it failed to work.

 

So.... why are you asking if you don't care what the answers are?

I'm not a "regulator" and can't possibly explain the logic of current FCC regulations.

Nobody is stopping you from doing whatever you would like to do. Whether it is bonkers or not.

 

At this point, I'm just curious about your use of the word "bonkers" to describe activity which would seem to be in compliance with the "spirit" of the regulation (transmitting permitted content on frequencies and within the power range specific to a license which I do currently have) but which might run afoul of the exact "letter" of the regs (using a piece of equipment which seems to be non-approved simply for having extra capabilities) when you admit that you can't explain the underlying logic of why that specific bit of regulation exists.

I can't get pulled over for speeding simply because I happen to be driving a vehicle that's theoretically capable of exceeding the posted limit, it take actually travelling at a prohibited rate before it's an infraction. I'd say the thing that's "bonkers" is the FCC rules which would allow the equivalent of ticketing anyone driving 32 in a 35 zone simply for having tires rated to 85 mph.

 

To answer your question, tho - No, you cannot use the same callsign for GMRS and ham. Kind of annoying, yes.

Getting a HAM license is super easy - and you can take the exam online these days. Most groups charge $10-15, but often it's trivial to find a free one. For the vanity CS, you cannot request it at exam time but it's easy enough to do. It's a slow process. I think it took like 2 weeks after I hit submit and paid the $18 or whatever it was.

 

@bmgreene The original question of do you need a new callsign, the answer is yes. There's not an overlap in the format of callsigns between GMRS and amateur radio. Your FRN (How the FCC knows you in their system) can be the same but the call you are required to use on the air will be different. There are different formats for callsigns depending on which level of license you hold but basically it is 2 letters, 1 number, 3 letters. That can be reduced to 112 or 211.

As for the legalities of using a non-part accepted radio on a certain band, that's a recipe for argument that goes nowhere. A non-GMRS is not legal to use on GMRS. However, a GMRS radio can be used on the ham bands. That's the way it's written, I agreed to operate by it, and I am not going to argue it publicly. Over a beer might be a different story.

 

You're probably right, the FCC rules are dumb. Using your GMRS call on amateur service frequencies isn't bonkerz at all. Give it a go, you should be fine.

 

Amen to that. It's old and dated but the thing is it works, takes some time to navigate. You should see the software behind financial industry. If you think FCC is old and dated, they're like the Jetsons compared!

Your issues will be TX power. Some of the channels are limited to 5 and 0.5W, even for GMRS, and FRS is always 0.5 or 2 (MAX).

https://www.rightchannelradios.com/blogs/newsletters/gmrs-radio-frequencies-and-channels

And trust me, if there are hobbyists and you come out and blast over their 0.5W max channel with 20W, 50W, etc whatever you have, if they're so inclined, they will foxhunt and report you.

To be realistic, I don't know what the consequences are/would be, probably limited. BUT since you ARE licensed on GMRS, there's a chance that could be stripped?

It's more of one of those "Well, I didn't catch you for this, but found it in the investigation for something else" types of situations.

The other thing is for sanctioned events (trail rides with clubs, volunteerism, heck we piggybacked onto a group of residents (and I think firefighters?) on a GMRS freq out west in 2021!), etc they'll check your license and probably radio too.

Now, if you just HAPPENED to have a handheld GMRS in your vehicle and when asked, HAPPENED to say "this is the radio I use, this one in the car that is NOT permitted to TX is just used for weather "

It's not an argument. It's not legal. Period. I know what you mean though.

If you're into roof patches, I recommend getting custom ones for each callsign. I know my HAM callsign but my GMRS I forget every winter since I only use it in the summers.

I didn't know you could use a GMRS type certified on HAM bands? I can't find the hardware reqs, I know FRS radios can't have detachable antennas and can only have channel up/down buttons or something like that, I didn't even know that a GMRS radio could be set to other frequencies (out of the box, at least).

 

Get An Amateur Radio License From The FCC

 

Yep - Covid was a blessing to Amateur Radio. Forced a bunch of Morse Coders into using Teams and Zoom and WebEx to keep the hobby alive. Get an online test.

Baofeng - Great radio. You get what you pay for but they have done more for getting people into ham than any other radio. It's a gateway radio - LOL. That was my first one and with an upgraded antenna I used it to hit a repeater (mountain top to mountain top) that was 115 miles away. Bartlett Lake Ranger Station north of Scottsdale AZ to KK7OEM on Mt. Lemmon in Tucson. You can find videos of people on YouTube using it to talk to the International Space Station. All on the 4 Watts that it puts out.

Is it legal to use the Baofeng for GMRS transmitting?
Nope, not at all. Not even a little bit. Using your Baofeng to do anything beyond listening to GMRS is a complete and total violation of the law. Even if you get a Ham license, it's still illegal to use a Baofeng on GMRS channels.

Will anyone notice?
Only if you tell them.

Has the FCC prosecuted anyone for using a Baofeng on GMRS Channels?
Nope - not according to their website where they post code enforcement. No one has even so much as received a nasty-gram in the mail. Not even a "pretty please with sugar on top."

As long as you are a good operator and don't make waves, 98% of the people in GMRS and Ham won't even care. And the 2% that do won't really have any constructive outlet other than venting online.

And yes - you will get a second call sign. I wish that wasn't the case. I wished they would fold GMRS in under Amateur Radio and just make it subordinate to the Technician license and that way you could keep your same call sign all the way up, but no. Long time ago I was licensed as an FM DJ (expired). So now I have basically three "call signs" even though the FM Broadcast is expired and you don't really get a call sign there. This is the government we are talking about and good sense and efficiency has never been their strong suit.

I have both GMRS and Ham. If you are at all interested in Radio for any reason, I encourage both. Great flexibility.

 

Don't need CW for your amateur licenses anymore. I took the test in (I think?) Oct 2020 (if not 2020, then 21, it's been a while). I don't know CW at all.

That's a lie. I know S and O

Same! There's a bunch of grumpy old white dudes who had to build their own radio and learn CW 30 years ago who are so upset that nowadays people can take the test (not for free anymore ) and GOTA for 30$! I have a Baofeng and hit my clubs repeater with an upgraded antenna. My setup in the truck is actually pretty well outfitted. Radio's under the seat, volume control mic form there, antenna up to the roof rack. But, fortunately, I have a "real" radio in the mail should be here Monday. Batteries are obnoxious. Wiring this puppy in

 

I believe he meant the VE old-timer's (those who prob know code) had to learn how to use Teams/Zoom to administer the online tests.

 

It's early.

Mine was a drive-in, pulled in and they handed me the exam through the window. My dumb a** didn't think to bring my clipboard. But someone had circled then "erased" all the correct answers. Tech was an easy flash card study process though, so I knew all the answers but that was funny.

 

I've had a GMRS license for a little while but I just passed my HAM tech over a week ago (still no call sign, ARRL still snail mails to the FCC (lolz)).

Look forward to getting some tips and tricks via this thread.

I was going to put in a KG-1000+ GMRS into the truck, but now have an FTM-300 installed as I knew I was going to get a HAM license eventually. The head is down by the 12v ports/ash tray level. Thinking up top like @vssman is the way to go.

Also have... I hesitate to say as it looks like we have some part 9X compliance-nazi sad HAMs here... an import radio on the way for some other bands.

Not big on breaking rules but also not a fan of having to buy upwards of thousands of dollars worth of radios and then having like 3, 4 or even more radios in a rig when one or two can do the job when MARS modded etc. But sad hams are going to sad ham. What really got me on the track to even want more band access was an emergency to me (though likely not in the eyes of others) and at that moment it would have been amazing to be able to inquire not just over GMRS 70cm, but over any other possible freq in the area as well- be it HAM 2M, 70cm, 10M and even CB 11M (gasp! I know its the thunder dome there, but really needed to inquire on a local issue near two highways). Thus the motivation now to gain both license and technical capability to do so (MARS mod FTM-300, import 10M/11M radio, dual band antenna for 2M/70cm but broad SWRs with reviews noting good GMRS SWR as well etc). Hoping I can tune a firestik to work somewhat well on key 11m channels and also 10m.

@btu44 , you around in this thread?