Changing oil at 1k

If the car is sitting, that’s not a problem. You’re just saying “lots of short trips” using different words.

 

Even sitting for a few years the additives in the oil will degrade causing the oil to be far less effective.

 

This thread reminds me of a couple of videos I enjoyed recently. Apologies if these have been posted earlier. He (The Car Care Nut) makes a lot of sense to me...

How to maintain your Toyota Part 1 : Engine oil and Filters
https://youtu.be/xdNCnYHhEm8?si=-BCDHaeRiz3Q21BF

TOYOTA OWNERS! PLEASE Don't Make These Mistakes With Oil Filters!
https://youtu.be/G_vl2AYe7Yg?si=UoLzI3b6Y1TMSo3G

 

Toyota god has spoken

 

The long awaited golden jesus on his magical chariot

 

This guy has some good info but he is not an engineer and never references UOA’s. He also thinks you should only use WS transmission fluid and at 60k intervals. Toyota WS fluid has been shown over and over to be in rather poor condition at such mileage given it is not a synthetic / higher end fluid. When I had my LS, the guys getting 300k+ out of their transmissions were doing drain and refills every 30k so sooner. He also thinks just the oil weight printed on your fill cap is the only “correct” weight when the service manual clearly says something else. Even your owner’s manual says something else if you read it correctly. Honestly, his videos are geared towards those who know little about mechanics and understand how your ambient temperature plays a large factor in ideal oil weight selection.

I run 5w-40 summer / 0w-40 winter because it’s perfectly fine for this engine and I prefer this oil. I don’t believe running a thinner oil is bad, I just believe it is geared towards economy and it does not protect the engine as well as a heavier weight, particularly in hot conditions or when under heavy loads / towing. Again, this is my personal choice. Someone choosing a different strategy is not necessarily wrong and may not suffer more wear than someone running thicker oil, but with my research and living in a hot climate this is the conclusion I have come to. It’s ok to have different opinions, I just think beating a dead horse saying you can only run 0w-20 is stupid. It has been shown over and over in many threads what oil weights are acceptable for this engine. 0w-20 up to 15w-40 is acceptable. It is climate based.

I change my oil a lot during engine break-in because I want to minimize microscopic scoring. Again, from my experience buying new this has produced exceptional motors. I have also built a few motors over years and I’m not some amazing mechanic but I have learned from some very good builders. Generally when a motor is rebuilt and you are seating the rings and bearings this produces a ton of metal into the oil. builders will change the oil immediately after seating or within 50 miles. The Toyota factory does this for us so these levels are not as high as our break-in but they are absolutely elevated when we buy a new vehicle. The level of iron, aluminum, and copper in particular. Just like using magnets in the oil & transmission pan, anything done to minimize this metal from circulating is beneficial. If you don’t do this does this mean your motor will fail or consume oil faster than those who do? I cannot prove anything one way or another. I do believe logic points towards this and those who actively minimize scoring, but this is up to you to decide. Using an exceptional motor as a baseline is probably not the best way to test this.

My point is, if you consult mechanical engineers and those that build engines they tend to all say the same thing about changing the oil early to produce a better motor. It’s also standard practice in high end exotics and various performance vehicles. Oil is cheap and if using an extractor it’s is a 10 min job. No need to change the filter during this initial phase. Just suck it out and dump in fresh good synthetic of your choice. Or drain the pan. Either way, minimizing the metal circulating in an engine is always beneficial. I highly suggest it no matter what the owners manual says.

 

Amsoil has a specific break in oil for new motors.

 

This is for rebuilt motors or crate engines. This procedure has already been completed at the factory. Notice the phrase to “change the oil after a few hundred miles…”

I personally did my first oil extraction at 236 miles. 2nd at 612.


When do I use break-in oil?
New cars and trucks don’t need break-in oil. The manufacturer will typically require you to drive under light-to-moderate load for a few hundred miles, then change oil. After that, you’re good to go.

Racers, competitors or gearheads using a rebuilt or new crate engine, however, should use break-in oil. Follow the engine builder’s directions or the instructions that came with the crate engine.

https://blog.amsoil.com/why-you-should-be-wary-about-using-break-in-oil-in-powersports-equipment/

 

Sound reasoning.
A new engine is extremely dirty with metal waste.
Disagree with not changing the filters and not adding a strong magnet.
Do as much as possible to keep that oil clean.

 

The reason why I don’t think changing the filter is really necessary at this stage is the metal you are trying to eliminate is at a microscopic level and the oil filter will catch larger particles. The filter is not going to get clogged up or damaged in this initial phase. I actually plan on doing the filter by 1500 miles, I’m almost at 900 now. I just don’t see a need before this. The oil is not dirty with carbon from the break-in, it’s contaminated, but I’m sure it won’t hurt either.

When you say large magnet, you are dropping the pan and adding additional magnet(s) to the the ones already inside? You can also use a magnetic drain plug.

 

Yes I think the video is for those that just need a bit of help with the confusion that comes from all the new oils. I think it’s also important to think about the cost of Toyota Care at 5k mile intervals. I believe that the 10k mile oil change with synthetics helps cut oil change costs in half for corporate. This ‘are you smarter than the engineers?’ rebuttal every time someone wants to change their oil early is misplaced. Engineers don’t wield power over corporate decisions like that anyway.

The point is: You get 2 free years of Toyota Care. And that means if you do 20k miles a year, you’re good for 4 oil changes by the end of your Toyota care instead of 8. I believe I t’s primarily an economic decision to change oil at 10k.

And if you disagree, we’ll even the Toyota mechanic in this video says change it at 5k not 10k…so there.

 

You need to take into account when changing your oil often during breakin, you're not doing your rings any favor. Constantly having a source of fresh synthetic oil will cause the rings not to seat when they should asap. It's another reason 10k is recommended. I followed the manufactures 1st oil change, and auto transmission operation. I have zero complaints on my 3.5's performance.

 

The rings and bearings are seated at the factory. This is not done by the end user. This also takes very little time, it’s not part of the engine break-in for the standard end user. We are not buying a crate engine or rebuilt motor. What I’m talking about is eliminating the high metal content in the oil to minimize microscopic scoring.

 

In totally agree. There is a huge incentive to make standard maintenance appears low $ as possible. A perfect example, Aisin recommends regular maintenance on their transmission for longevity but Toyota was calling it a “sealed” transmission with a lifetime fluid for many years. Until everyone started loosing transmission’s before 150k. And it turns out they were only doing this in North America. Buffoons. Marketing > Engineering. Many recommendations in the owners manual are marketing based not engineering based. Want to get 300k out of your transmission? Drain and refill by 30k. 45k if you are using synthetic fluid. Preventive maintenance is key to longevity.

 

I can’t remember the last engine that I’ve known needing a rebuild from normal wear.

 

So do many other companies.

 

I wish they were. Toyota doesn't run every engine several hundred miles on a breaking in oil before they're released that I've ever heard of. Most they might do is start it to be sure no defects are present, then it goes out, shipped to the dealer for final prep with synthetic oil, and inspection before we get them.
As far as any microscopic scoring, again you're overthinking this....they have filters that catch much of the nasty particles that can do the real damage. If you've ever seen a newly manufactured block, it's cleaned pretty spotless that one can eat off before it's assembled.

 

Every modern engine is seated at the factory. Unless it’s a crate motor or you rebuilt it. It takes 15 - 20 min not hundreds of miles. The process of seating engine rings is very specific. The engine must be run at a specific rpm for specific periods of time. It also must be done on the first start. I am pretty sure they use an electrically operated machine to do this at the factory, vs starting the motor. I’ve seen both ways. This is not done with the motor in the vehicle at the factory. If Toyota uses a certain type of oil for this process I do not know. The idea that this very specific procedure would fall on the end user is absurd, no offense. 99% of owners would have no clue how to do this or perform it correctly. Look it up.

As far as overthinking, UOA’s show what I am saying to be universally true. And no, the oil filter does not pick up microscopic metal. Why do you think UOA ‘s show such elevated levels of iron, aluminum, and copper?

I prefer to get rid of metal-saturated oil asap. This is a personal preference and is universally recommended with engine builders, but don’t take my word for it. Go ask experts yourself. Again, the main run-in happens at the factory and takes minutes. The rest of the run-in or break-in happens when we purchase the vehicle. Changing the oil early in no way affects the seating of the piston rings, the main bearings, or other elements exposed to metal to metal contact.

 

Agree with what has been said about marketing having their say in those intervals. Once other manufacturers start recommending 10K companies like Toyota want to match that so consumers don’t say “well it’s cheaper to buy this BMW that I only have to change the oil half as often”.

The manual will state shorter intervals for “severe” usage, but what the average customer thinks severe means vs the description is very different. A short trip to drop the kids off at school doesn’t seem severe to a soccer mom and she thinks she can go 10k. In reality, that type of usage should be getting the severe change intervals.

the car care nut may dumb things down in a way, but he has seen a lot of Toyotas consuming oil and they generally had those longer intervals.

so, I always change at 5k with full synthetic.